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Debunking the Iranian lie

Billo_Really

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Last month, as Bush and Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert met for the final time as Heads of State, Truthout journalist Ann Wright and 3 other human rights activists met with Iranian government officials, business leaders, students and average citizens to find out their perspective on US/Israeli – Iranian relations and to get their views on the issues between the 3 countries. The following should shed some light on Iran that the various war-hawks are either not telling people or are deliberately lying about.

War with the west:
  • Iran desires peace with the United States and Israel, not war.
  • Unlike the United States, which has invaded and occupied Iran's neighbors Iraq and Afghanistan, Iran has not attacked a single country in the last 200 years.
  • Ahmadinejad did not call for the destruction of Israel. This is a misinterpretation of his reference to an old speech by the Ayatollah Khomeini.

Chemical weapons:
  • The US provided chemical weapons to Iraq, during its 8 years war with Iran, that were used 50 times against civilian and Iranian military targets.
  • During this time, the Ayatollah Khomeini had mandated that it would be against Islamic precepts to bomb Iraqi cities or use chemical or unconventional weapons on Iraq.

Iran’s nuclear program:
  • Iran has had a nuclear program for almost 50 years, having purchased a research reactor from the United States in 1959 during the Shah's reign.
  • The US National Intelligence Estimate (NIE) made public December 3, 2007, concluded with "high confidence" that the military-run Iranian nuclear weapons program had been shut down in 2003.
  • Iran is in compliance with the IAEA standards, according to the November 2008 IAEA report, despite interpretations of the report by the United States and Israel.
  • On August 9, 2005, at the IAEA meeting in Vienna, 60 years after the US atomic bombing of Japan, Iran's Supreme Leader Ayatollah Khamenei announced that he had issued a fatwa, or religious mandate, forbidding the production, stockpiling and use of nuclear weapons.
  • Iran is a member of the Non-Proliferation Treaty (unlike nuclear states Israel, India and Pakistan, which refused to join the NPT and developed nuclear weapons purposefully outside the treaty.)
  • Iran has a right to develop nuclear power for peaceful energy uses.

Iran’s support for Hamas and Hezbollah:
  • On the Iranian government's support for Hamas in Palestine and Hezbollah in southern Lebanon - Iranians pointed out that the US has consistently and heavily funded Israel during its 62-year existence (US provides about $4 billion per year to the Israeli government and the Israeli Defense Forces).
  • Palestinians who have lived in refugee camps during those 62 years must be provided assistance.
  • Hezbollah is not only a military group but a political organization that won seats in the Lebanese government, has a radio and satellite television station and provides social development and humanitarian assistance for much of southern Lebanon.
  • Hamas is the legally elected government of Gaza, needs financial support, particularly now in current extraordinary humanitarian crisis due to the lengthy Israeli blockade of foods and services into Gaza.

Iranian – Israeli relationship:
  • Israel, like the United States, had a long history of selling arms to the Shah.
  • In 1980-82, during the Iranian Revolution and war with Iraq, Ayatollah Khomeini's government sold oil to Israel in exchange for weapons and spare parts.
  • During the American hostage crisis (1979-1981), in which 52 US diplomats were held for 444 days, Israel made weapons deals with Iran.
  • Ronald Reagan's Secretary of State Alexander Haig gave permission to Israel to sell US-made military spare parts for fighter planes to Iran in early 1981.

Human rights and issues with current government:
  • Iranian citizens have issues with their government not unlike American’s and Israeli’s have with theirs.
  • Iranians want change to come from within their society, not imposed by another government, especially one, as we were reminded, that has its own human rights issues, including incarceration of the highest percentage of its citizenry of any country in the world, high rates of execution (Texas in particular), state-sponsored kidnapping from other countries (known in the Bush administration as extraordinary rendition), imprisonment without due process, extrajudicial courts and a military and an intelligence agency that are notorious for torture.
  • 70 percent of all university students are women, 30 percent of doctors in Iran are women, 80 percent of women are literate (88 percent of men can read), women receive 90 days of maternity leave at two-thirds pay and right to return to their jobs.

It is pretty obvious, Iran is not the big, bad bear war-hawks in this country and Israel are making out to be. And we must realize there are two sides to every issue. But before we go spending more tax dollars on US aggression around the world, we should do our civic duty as American’s and become more educated on the issues that affect our governments’ foreign policy.

Anyone that disagrees with the comments above, is welcome to comment below.

The Iranian views stated above were taken from the following article:
 
Lesson: If you want peace with terrorists, give them what they want.
 
Billo_Really said:
Ahmadinejad did not call for the destruction of Israel. This is a misinterpretation of his reference to an old speech by the Ayatollah Khomeini.


IS THIS A LIE?

From Iranian News:

Stating that establishment of the Zionist regime and using the Holocaust as propaganda aim at dominating the region, he added, "As the Soviet Union disappeared, the Zionist regime will also vanish and humanity will be liberated".

The president reiterated that certain European and US politicians could no longer term atrocities of the Zionist regime "self-defence" and the resistance of Palestinians against occupying invaders as terrorists.

Supporting establishment of a fact-finding mission on Holocaust as proposed by the Tehran conference, he urged the western coutries to pledge that they will not disturb members of the team, "so that further surveys are carried out, issues are clarified, and criminals are sentenced".

"Based on the facts gained by the team, if Holocaust's truth is ruled out, root causes of problems and crimes in the Middle East region will be terminated."
He also said that results of the mission's study will put an end to the 60-year-old dispute on the issue of Holocaust and its scale.

"Sixty years after the World War Two, why are we still witnessing aftermath of this war?" Ahmadinejad questioned.

News  Headlines
 
I was in the middle of a long detailed reply when my computer froze. The timing of this occurrence is suspicious.
 
I know it's inconvenient Billo, but a new (Democratic) administration will run the executive branch. The Democrats already control Congress. Their approach to Iran will probably be different.
 
Quite different, I'd suspect:

At the Tuesday-morning meeting with committee staffers, Biden launches into a stream-of-consciousness monologue about what his committee should be doing, before he finally admits the obvious: "I'm groping here." Then he hits on an idea: America needs to show the Arab world that we're not bent on its destruction. "Seems to me this would be a good time to send, no strings attached, a check for $200 million to Iran," Biden declares. He surveys the table with raised eyebrows, a How do ya like that? look on his face.

The staffers sit in silence. Finally somebody ventures a response: "I think they'd send it back." Then another aide speaks up delicately: "The thing I would worry about is that it would almost look like a publicity stunt." Still another reminds Biden that an Iranian delegation is in Moscow that very day to discuss a $300 million arms deal with Vladimir Putin that the United States has strongly condemned. But Joe Biden is barely listening anymore. He's already moved on to something else.

Rhetorical Question
 
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IS THIS A LIE?
no, it's not. Read it again:
"As the Soviet Union disappeared, the Zionist regime will also vanish and humanity will be liberated".
So Ahmadinejad did not call for the destruction of Israel, he rather suggested that their regime will collapse and vanish (just as Soviet union did), without Iranian 'help'.
 
" * Iran desires peace with the United States and Israel, not war."

Of course it doesn't it wants to subvert it through more covert actions like blowing up US troops in iraq.



:lol: billo, got any more terrorist propaganda you want to sell us? :lol:
 
Lesson: If you want peace with terrorists, give them what they want.

Or is it, if you don't want to be stung by bees, don't tap their nest with a stick.
 
I was in the middle of a long detailed reply when my computer froze. The timing of this occurrence is suspicious.

Step one to taking over America: disable the few voices that speak out about the true nature of the Islamic plan to take over the world, by interrupting their posts on bulletin boards.

Yes ... more proof that our plan to take over the US is working!!!!!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
 
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I know it's inconvenient Billo, but a new (Democratic) administration will run the executive branch. The Democrats already control Congress. Their approach to Iran will probably be different.
I really don't care how we deal with Iran, as long as we deal with them honestly without all the deceit and lies we are being told. I'm not in to this "daemon building" in order to justify armed aggression. If Iran does attack someone, we should act in accordance with the decisions of the UNSC. If Iran attacks us, we kick their ass!

I'm so sick of this phoney intel that....

....lets just say that's why I vote out all incumbants.

And if Obama doesn't do anything to reverse this trend, I'll vote him out too.
 
This thread is a crude attempt to discredit proof that Iran's government is a collection of murderous islamic zealots.

DO NOT belive the liberal nonsense posted here in defense of Iran's government.
 
This thread is a crude attempt to discredit proof that Iran's government is a collection of murderous islamic zealots.

DO NOT belive the liberal nonsense posted here in defense of Iran's government.
Most of it is a matter of public record and a fact of history.

You cannot re-write history!

And on the issue of "proof", I've provided mine; I'm still waiting for yours.
 
Most of it is a matter of public record and a fact of history.

You cannot re-write history!

And on the issue of "proof", I've provided mine; I'm still waiting for yours.

Vader's "proof" goes something like this. "People more in the know disagree with you".
 
Well, whatever the story, one thing for sure, none of us here know it. Everybody talks like they are experts on everything and they know-it-all. :roll:

The only reality any of us know is the reality that is presented to us. Some of us are afforded the option to pick and choose our reality. That reality can change as quickly as one can change the channel on the TV.

Reality also depends on which plot of ground you're sitting on. Don't think for a second your reality is the same as one from the Middle East.

Iranian lie? What is a "lie" these days? (I guess that depends on what "is" is. :roll:)

No sir. Y'all can keep talkin' but none of us know doodly-squat.

Wait. One more rant and I'm done for now. I'll try to be brief.

I hate fishing downtime. Waiting for the ice to get deep enough to fish on sucks. I hate shovelling snow. I hate cabin fever.

I'm done. Feel a lot better. :cool:
 
Most of it is a matter of public record and a fact of history.

You cannot re-write history!

And on the issue of "proof", I've provided mine; I'm still waiting for yours.


You posted "Propaganda" and propaganda IS NOT proof; therefore, you've proven nothing except that you're an Iran propagandist.

:mrgreen:
 
Vader's "proof" goes something like this. "People more in the know disagree with you".

Actually, my proof is still classified. As you may or may not know, I was in the military.

I saw many rather horrifying things.

My job exposed me to things that I cannot say much about except for the fact that I wish I had never been exposed to them.

Iran is a terrorist nation bent on the destruction of Israel. Iran's government hangs 15 year-old girls for violating Islame's retarded chastity laws... while their male counterparts go unpunished.

I realize you hear only what the media wants you to hear; so I do not blame you for being ignorant of the ACTUAL truth.

These are people who live in the 16th century; they would modernize but their religion prevents it.

Modernization means mullahs and ayetoiletbowls lose their mind control gig and they do not like that. As such, any mention of modernizing or secualrism is generally punished with death.

Likewise, males converting away from Islam are executed; women are sentenced to life imprisonment.

Homosexuality is punishable by death in Iran.

This whole thread is the ranting of man who refuses to believe the obvious truth about the islam-o-barbarians the run Iran.

It's a typical liberal misconception.
 
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Actually, my proof is still classified. As you may or may not know, I was in the military.

I saw many rather horrifying things.

My job exposed me to things that I cannot say much about except for the fact that I wish I had never been exposed to them.

Iran is a terrorist nation bent on the destruction of Israel. Iran's government hangs 15 year-old girls for violating Islame's retarded chastity laws... while their male counterparts go unpunished.

I realize you hear only what the media wants you to hear; so I do not blame you for being ignorant of the ACTUAL truth.

These are people who live in the 16th century; they would modernize but their religion prevents it.

Modernization means mullahs and ayetoiletbowls lose their mind control gig and they do not like that. As such, any mention of modernizing or secualrism is generally punished with death.

Likewise, males converting away from Islam are executed; women are sentenced to life imprisonment.

Homosexuality is punishable by death in Iran.

This whole thread is the ranting of man who refuses to believe the obvious truth about the islam-o-barbarians the run Iran.

It's a typical liberal misconception.

Damn I'm good!
 
Quite different, I'd suspect:

I can't believe how deliberately dishonest this post is. That article and quote is from 2001! Do you really think so little of the people who post here, bhkad?

While the information speaks to the matter of the OP, it does so only faintly. A quote that is so old cannot credibly be claimed to be the current thinking of a public person.
 
Damn I'm good!

Good at saying nothing... maybe!

Btw ... I posted the videos in the other thread. This thread is a Billo recation to the truth.

Billo couldn't handle the truth so he made this thread to discredit the thread I created.

It doesn't change the fact that he is ABSOLUTELY wrong on this issue.
 
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Thank you so much for that post bill.
This is a very good skeleton for a chapter of my masters (which is concerned with applying neorealist theory to iranian perception (which I try to aproximate through historical experiance + walzian neorealist international behaviour assumptions) to better understand the security dillema in the region.

When peoples say its old and it cant be trusted, and theyw ere believing in stuff like it when ti was published, and oh so very little has changed make me :roll:

Im not saying its gospel
but I think its a more acurate perspective than most, imo.
 
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Actually, my proof is still classified. As you may or may not know, I was in the military.
I wouldn't call that an advantage. Everybody knows that (at least combat) soldiers are mostly poor educated brainwashed 'killing machines' who can't have emotions in the line of battle and are not allowed to think with their own head. They must believe every story (about good guys, bad guys...) their commanders told them. American soldiers are no different. Therefore, being in army doesn't bring any real proof into a debate as such. Have you ever been to Iran? Or did you just hear some stories and rumours about "evil Iranians" from your commanders and Fox news channel?

I realize you hear only what the media wants you to hear; so I do not blame you for being ignorant of the ACTUAL truth.
It so works for you as well. Reading your posts is much like reading some ultra right republican pro-israel newspaper. But it's not all your fault. It is well known that American media always defends Israeli violence and don't criticize any Israeli action, while at the same time it 'attacks' countries like Iran, Russia, China etc.
 
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