De-regulating nuclear power is dumb, dangerous, and expensive

[Lord of Planar]

Joey just presented relevant, factual, data for you. If you disagree with his/her data then you can do what Joey did and present your own data! Where are the facts to support your opinion?

The facts are not complete for all fields making the comparison a lie. I only pointed that out. I am not taking the time to show the facts. I have better things to do with my time than waste it looking for data that I do mot care about.

I pointed out that he needs to look at certan things. I dont care if he does or not.

 

[Volunteer]

Specifically because it’s highly regulated and intensely looked after.
It’s not a business that tolerates mistakes and cutting corners well.

Highly regulated? Not really. Radiological embrittlement, due to metallurgical design flaws in the Unit 1 reactor vessel at Diablo Canyon nuclear power plant in California, risks millions of people. PG&E was allowed a deferment to avoid further embrittlement testing. Very lax regulations.

Mistakes? Three million pounds of highly radioactive waste, needing 250,000 years of safe-keeping, is stored in dry casks designed to last only 100 years. Huge mistake.

 

[Gordy327]

Specifically because it’s highly regulated and intensely looked after.

It’s not a business that tolerates mistakes and cutting corners well.

Good thing too.

 

[ModernDiogenes]

Highly regulated? Not really. Radiological embrittlement, due to metallurgical design flaws in the Unit 1 reactor vessel at Diablo Canyon nuclear power plant in California, risks millions of people. PG&E was allowed a deferment to avoid further embrittlement testing. Very lax regulations.

Mistakes? Three million pounds of highly radioactive waste, needing 250,000 years of safe-keeping, is stored in dry casks designed to last only 100 years. Huge mistake.

Right, and that’s [i[with[/i] this level of regulation. Wait until it’s lesser than today.

 

[Buzz]

I have a good track record of being correct

What a load of crap!!

Lord is well known for getting his facts wrong.

and citing material when I feel I need to.

Unfortunately, for most of the people Lord debates, he rarely ever feels the need to back himself up. Just like he is doing here.

 

[Volunteer]

From Chemical and Engineering News

As nuclear waste piles up, scientists seek the best long-term storage solutions

cen.acs.org

"In Hanford alone, more than 200 million L of this waste still sits after many decades in underground tanks waiting to be processed, according to Thomas M. Brouns, who leads the environmental management sector at nearby Pacific Northwest National Laboratory (PNNL). About one-third of the nearly 180 storage tanks, many of which long ago outlived their design lives, are known to be leaking, contaminating the subsurface and threatening the nearby Columbia River. Another 136 million L of the stuff awaits processing at the Savannah River Site."

Today, no nation in the world would consider storing high-level liquid waste indefinitely like this, says PNNL materials scientist John D. Vienna.

 

[bythoughts]

I guess we both screwed up here mate. Bot solar and wind are apparently safer than nuclear. You got a source? I asked ChatGPT and checked 4 sites myself. All are more or less in line with the below....

The most striking detail of that table, which anyone with a nose knows instinctively, is that coal is just plain bad, killing more people than any other option. And Trump wants to bring back coal. To burn!

If we had Xi Jinping in charge, he'd be using it to make advanced products out of graphene, and would continue getting rid of coal and improving air quality. Of course, the Chinese had a striking lesson in just how awful coal is just a decade ago, so they had reason to learn.

Note: if energy shortages were so crucial, would Trump be taking steps to tax and discourage solar and wind? No, the nuclear program is all about making nuclear weapons. Always has been, always will be, in the U.S. just like in Iran.

 

[bythoughts]

The media likes to talk about the U.S. falling into civil war. What people forget is that in civil war, everything is a target. Little portable nuclear reactors can blow up in unexpected places. And all it takes to convert a cask of high-level nuclear waste into a deadly campaign of hidden radioactive attacks is a couple of shaheeds. If we had any wit we would put all the sharp objects back in the box before the kids get to fighting!!!

 

[JoeyJoystick]

The most striking detail of that table, which anyone with a nose knows instinctively, is that coal is just plain bad, killing more people than any other option. And Trump wants to bring back coal. To burn!

If we had Xi Jinping in charge, he'd be using it to make advanced products out of graphene, and would continue getting rid of coal and improving air quality. Of course, the Chinese had a striking lesson in just how awful coal is just a decade ago, so they had reason to learn.

Note: if energy shortages were so crucial, would Trump be taking steps to tax and discourage solar and wind? No, the nuclear program is all about making nuclear weapons. Always has been, always will be, in the U.S. just like in Iran.

Hi bythoughts,

I do not want to undermine China efforts regarding Solar, but context matters here. Yes, the amount of solar installed in China is mindboggling. They installed 217GW in 1 year, that is almost as much as the total electricity capacity of Germany... But they also install about 50GW of coal per year. And this trend is not going to stop anytime soon... Oh, and for context. 50GW of coal in China is equal to the total electricity production of Denmark. And they add that in a year. Every year.

As far as Trump is concerned. I do not know where he learned how to count, but solar is more than 50% cheaper than the cheapest hydrocarbon based power plant. So if he does not want to promote that he is an idiot. Even if he does not subsidize it, he should still encourage it. It is cheaper. And I thought that was about the only word he understands.

And when it comes to pollution, they are one of the worst, if not the worst. Very little regard for the health and safety of the people. And even less so for the environment. The only reason he buys solar is because it is cheap. If he could produce more solar panels he would install more solar panels. I have seen it myself first hand. When I offered services for mercury I was told that they do not have a mercury problem. But when I was off shore I saw them throw drums (yes drums!) of mercury overboard. Only 25 litres because that stuff is so heavy, but still. This just lies on the seabed and disperses among Sealife including fish. Needless to say that seafood is an important part of the diet, especially in coastal areas.


Joey

 

[Volunteer]

As far as Trump is concerned. I do not know where he learned how to count, but solar is more than 50% cheaper than the cheapest hydrocarbon based power plant. So if he does not want to promote that he is an idiot. Even if he does not subsidize it, he should still encourage it. It is cheaper.

Take away the oil and gas subsidies, tax credits, federal land use, and U.S. Navy oil tanker security we'd be lucky to be paying $6.50/gal at the pump. Requiring cleanup of fouling our lands, waters, and our air would raise the prices even more. In a free energy market these artificially low prices at the pump would easily more than double.

Take away the subsidies and tax credits for solar and we'd see less than 30% rise in installed costs.

Then there's the nuclear industry bailouts. Ratepayers in the Southeast are financing failed nuclear projects that will never produce jack squat.

We need a transition to market pricing to minimize taxpayer liability.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Take away the oil and gas subsidies, tax credits, federal land use, and U.S. Navy oil tanker security we'd be lucky to be paying $6.50/gal at the pump. Requiring cleanup of fouling our lands, waters, and our air would raise the prices even more. In a free energy market these artificially low prices at the pump would easily more than double.

Take away the subsidies and tax credits for solar and we'd see less than 30% rise in installed costs.

Then there's the nuclear industry bailouts. Ratepayers in the Southeast are financing failed nuclear projects that will never produce jack squat.

We need a transition to market pricing to minimize taxpayer liability.

I think you are denying the actual subsidies.

 

[JoeyJoystick]

I think you are denying the actual subsidies.

Hi Lard,

Don't think. Safer for all involved. You have a good track record of not knowing what you are talking about. And you have also a good track record of not backing up any of your claims. That is your standing with the rest of the community.

Joey

 

[Lord of Planar]

Hi Lard,

Don't think. Safer for all involved. You have a good track record of not knowing what you are talking about. And you have also a good track record of not backing up any of your claims. That is your standing with the rest of the community.

Joey

Wow.

Coming from you, that is so meaningful... NOT!

I have an excellent track record. I'm sorry that it is hardly ever what the brainwashed leftists think and believe.

 

[Steve Case]

Hi Lard,

Don't think. Safer for all involved. You have a good track record of not knowing what you are talking about. And you have also a good track record of not backing up any of your claims. That is your standing with the rest of the community.

Joey

You've posted 24 times in this forum thread with one LINK to China's graphene industry

And one chart in Post #86 but no link to where you got it.

Your comments are unsupported and mostly insulting.

 

[Lord of Planar]

You've posted 24 times in this forum thread with one LINK to China's graphene industry

And one chart in Post #86 but no link to where you got it.

Your comments are unsupported and mostly insulting.

And note that it is a ChatGPT find.

 

[JoeyJoystick]

You've posted 24 times in this forum thread with one LINK to China's graphene industry

And one chart in Post #86 but no link to where you got it.

Your comments are unsupported and mostly insulting.

Hi Steve,

And so they should be for that idiot. I don't give a ****. I have made it clear a long time ago that I wanted to be banned. They prefer to give me warnings instead of banning me. It is true that I have been gaslighting a few post. But I just like to rub it in when people are as stupid and arrogant is that lord thing is. Report me, ban me, and the problem will be solved. Well it won't be solved. You will be stuck here with the idiot Steve.

I rather die walking straight than live on my knees.

Sure I am never going to give in to hypocrisy. A comment to admin also went without a response. Not my problem anymore though. Well, it never was to start with of course. lol.

Joey

 

[Germinator]

I'm for expanding nuclear power, but it needs to be well regulated.

Before more nuclear power infrastructure is even considered, something that first should be addressed for, is what to do about with the spent fuel,...

A place to perhaps store at least some of the 3.55 million pounds of waste sitting at the San Onofre Nuclear Generating Station remains in play after a ruling by the U.S. Supreme Court — but plenty of hurdles loom before the spent fuel ever gets moved off the beach.

In a 6-3 decision issued Wednesday, the high court said the Nuclear Regulatory Commission was within its rights to grant a 40-year lease to a private company in West Texas that wanted to build a facility to store spent fuel that’s accumulated over the years at various nuclear power plants across the country.

The Supreme Court overturned a decision by a federal appeals court in New Orleans that sided with the state of Texas and a company with land near the proposed site.

Pitched by Interim Storage Partners, the project in a remote portion of Andrews County, Texas, is designed to store 40,000 metric tons of nuclear waste.

The 3.55 million pounds of spent fuel stored in dozens of canisters at San Onofre equals 1,610 metric tons, so at least in theory, the project in West Texas would certainly be large enough to take the waste at the now-shuttered power plant known as SONGS for short.

...For decades, Yucca Mountain in Nevada had been slated as a permanent site to take the waste that has stacked up over the years at the nation’s commercial nuclear power plants.

But the Obama administration cut off funding for the site in 2010, following years of protests from lawmakers in the Silver State who had long opposed the project. The project’s costs came to at least $15 billion before getting shelved.

With Yucca off the table, federal officials have gone back to the drawing board, looking at potential sites to accept some or all of the country’s commercial spent fuel, either on an interim (still-to-be determined number of years) or permanent basis.

The Supreme Court just issued a ruling on nuclear waste. What does that mean for San Onofre?

Some see the high court’s decision in case against the state of Texas as a promising sign, but significant hurdles remain.

www.sandiegouniontribune.com

Recycling Nuclear Waste: A Win-Win or a Dangerous Gamble?

As interest in nuclear power rises, startups are pursuing plans to recycle spent fuel and reuse its untapped energy to power reactors. Advocates tout new recycling methods as a breakthrough, but many experts warn it will extract plutonium that could be used for nuclear weapons.

e360.yale.edu

 

[Steve Case]

Hi Steve,

And so they should be for that idiot. I don't give a ****. I have made it clear a long time ago that I wanted to be banned. They prefer to give me warnings instead of banning me. It is true that I have been gaslighting a few post. But I just like to rub it in when people are as stupid and arrogant is that lord thing is. Report me, ban me, and the problem will be solved. Well it won't be solved. You will be stuck here with the idiot Steve.

I rather die walking straight than live on my knees.

Sure I am never going to give in to hypocrisy. A comment to admin also went without a response. Not my problem anymore though. Well, it never was to start with of course. lol.

Joey

Interesting reply if ever there was one. Hmm, well I will mostly ignore your posts from here on out.
Only mostly since you might say something that makes a reply worth while. I'm not going to report
you, as snitches and Karens are repulsive members of our society. Have fun (-:

 

[bythoughts]

Hi bythoughts,

And when it comes to pollution, they are one of the worst, if not the worst. Very little regard for the health and safety of the people. And even less so for the environment. The only reason he buys solar is because it is cheap. If he could produce more solar panels he would install more solar panels. I have seen it myself first hand. When I offered services for mercury I was told that they do not have a mercury problem. But when I was off shore I saw them throw drums (yes drums!) of mercury overboard. Only 25 litres because that stuff is so heavy, but still. This just lies on the seabed and disperses among Sealife including fish. Needless to say that seafood is an important part of the diet, especially in coastal areas.

This sounds intriguing, but I'm having a hard time believing it. According to an AI, "scrap mercury" is worth about $35 a pound. It did link to apparent ads selling it. Although I know how unreal this sort of market information can be, I have a hard time picturing that even low-grade, impure scrap mercury wouldn't be sold to international artisanal gold miners to help them recover gold amalgam.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Hi Steve,

And so they should be for that idiot. I don't give a ****. I have made it clear a long time ago that I wanted to be banned. They prefer to give me warnings instead of banning me. It is true that I have been gaslighting a few post. But I just like to rub it in when people are as stupid and arrogant is that lord thing is.

You are a unique type of person. Your gaslighting is more like laughing gas.

Report me, ban me, and the problem will be solved. Well it won't be solved. You will be stuck here with the idiot Steve.

Why report you? Your attempts at bashing are comical. They show a very high degree of misunderstanding and almost polite malace.

 

[CLAX1911]

Hi planar,

Well than, if you are tired of that and complaint about that openly, the least you can do is set an example. Demanding that from others and than act as if you're just an other MAGAT. Yet you cry like a baby now, but continue to produce not a SINGLE shred or evidence to counter anything put in front of you. And that, is my definition of vile and disgusting behaviour, and is not worthy of anything containing the word 'lord'.


Joey.

Information regarding nuclear power pretty readily available easy to get.

I think people are hurt scared and rightly so of the idea radiation killing them. I learned all about radiation safety in my studies to do industrial radiography. there are protocols and procedures all in place you make sure that doesn't happen, and if it does there is a robust organization to call that can make sure nobody gets hurt.

Yes it can be terrifying but knowledge is power.

In the US since the 1950s I believe only four people have died in nuclear power related accidents and I'm not even sure that it was radiation poisoning.

So the reality is a nuclear power plant is way safer than any other kind of energy you can imagine it pollutes far less even than solar and wind one dual core reactor can produce about 4,000 megawatts that's the same as about 2,000 windmills.

It's not so much the fuel for the reaction with the safety systems.

 

[CLAX1911]

From Chemical and Engineering News

As nuclear waste piles up, scientists seek the best long-term storage solutions

cen.acs.org

"In Hanford alone, more than 200 million L of this waste still sits after many decades in underground tanks waiting to be processed, according to Thomas M. Brouns, who leads the environmental management sector at nearby Pacific Northwest National Laboratory (PNNL). About one-third of the nearly 180 storage tanks, many of which long ago outlived their design lives, are known to be leaking, contaminating the subsurface and threatening the nearby Columbia River. Another 136 million L of the stuff awaits processing at the Savannah River Site."

Today, no nation in the world would consider storing high-level liquid waste indefinitely like this, says PNNL materials scientist John D. Vienna.

The resume why spent fuel is just stored is an executive order by Jimmy Carter because I'm those days the only reason you'd mess with the spent fuel is to crate doomsday weapons.

 

[CaughtInThe]

We're living in the era of stupidity. Why wouldn't the dumbasses do this.

 

[Volunteer]

there are protocols and procedures all in place you make sure that doesn't happen, and if it does there is a robust organization to call that can make sure nobody gets hurt.

Who do we call? Are you referring to the Nuclear Regulatory Commission that allowed Biden to subsidize Diablo Canyon, a nuke plant on top of a major earthquake fault, another $1,500.000,000 to keep operating? The same NRC that allowed PG&E a deferment of metallurgical embrittlement testing needed due to design flaws in Unit 1?

nuclear power pollutes far less even than solar and wind

150,000 years from now those waste dumps will still be leaking radioactivity. Your analogy is off the charts.

 

[longview]

Who do we call? Are you referring to the Nuclear Regulatory Commission that allowed Biden to subsidize Diablo Canyon, a nuke plant on top of a major earthquake fault, another $1,500.000,000 to keep operating? The same NRC that allowed PG&E a deferment of metallurgical embrittlement testing needed due to design flaws in Unit 1?

150,000 years from now those waste dumps will still be leaking radioactivity. Your analogy is off the charts.

Can you think for a second why it was important to spend the money to keep Diablo canyon running?
I like Solar ( I am guessing that is how you make your living) but until we have grid scale seasonal energy storage,
photovoltaic solar cannot keep our grid supplying electricity 24 X 7 X 365. We need dispatchable sources
of electricity that can be called on when the Sun is not shining and the wind is not blowing.
In the long term and with energy storage, Solar can do that, but it is not ready to do that right now.
We can deal with spent Nuclear fuel, France has minimized their Nuclear waste, and while more expensive the spent fuel can be
recycled. The bottom line is that we need a bridge to get us (All of Humanity) from where we are to where we need to be.
Nuclear will likely need to be one of the parts of that bridge, there is not really many other ways to cross that gap.