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Bush/Spygate - the masters of spin

disneydude

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As much as I believe that the current administration is the most morally corrupt bunch in the history of this country, I have to hand it to them for being incredibly smart (note: I am referring to the cabinet not GWB himself).

The way that they can clearly break the law and then spin into a patriotic act is pure genius. They are masters at spin and when you analyze what they have created you have to hand it to them for having the intelligence to get this by a large segment of the population (who are not bothered that their President broke the law by engaging in domestic eavesdropping).

While I think their tactics are immoral...they clearly work:

First, use 9/11 as the foundation to advance your political agenda. People are very emotional about this and it hits home.

Second, repeat things over and over even if they aren't true because people will start to believe it,i.e., "Iraq and 9/11 are integrally related".

Third, create a terror threat index that you can raise to keep people's fears alive. If the country starts getting too comfortable -- raise the level.

Fourth - develop and engage in "politics of war" to keep people afraid....just enough

Fifth - Talk tough --- the people who vote in this country like a leader who appears strong, even if they are not.

Sixth - deny deny deny --- and block access to the release of all records. You can always use the tried and true "On-going investigation" or better yet "release would jeopardize delicate internal affairs and put the country in jeopardy" -- yeah...that goes back to the politics of war.

Seventh - If you get caught...make it sound like you were wiretapping only calls to Al-quaida. (Remember the movie "Chicago" - "Give em the old Razzle Dazzle --- and a good portion of the country will believe anything you tell them".

Final result: You make anyway who questions you look unpatriotic, which is good for you, so no one really comes after you all that hard for fear of looking weak....and you get away with it.


Oh.....and say that prior administrations have done the same thing: Which isn't true (Remember repeat repeat repeat and some will believe it).

Again: I have to hand it to them. They have played a smart hand. As I indicated in another post, every legal scholar I have read has analyzed the administrations arguments and have concluded that it is clear that there was no justification for the spying and they expect it to go to the Supreme Court, which will be very very interesting because we will see the true color of the new Bush appointees. I am anxious to see how it will play out, but I am pretty sure I already know.

One final thought: Another intelligent aspect of this administration's spin control: How does Bush get away with labeling liberal judges as "activist judges" with a political agenda, when it is clear that both Roberts and Alito were appointed to be "Activists" in moving the Supreme Court to the right wing. Its amazing to me that they clearly say that this is their intention and yet no one in the media or in the public for that matter calls him to explain how they are any less "Activist Judges".
 

cnredd

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john831

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I hate how the administration casts the wiretapping issue as an indication of how much one cares about security. They try to make it seem as though Democrats oppose national security and try to scare people into voting for them because if they don't, it'll be another 9-11. They keep repeating that people talking to al-Qaeda should be listened to; they fail to mention that the controversy is not mainly about whether or not to listen to these conversations, but rather whether to get a warrant in doing so(which can be obtained retroactively so don't give me that crap about not enough time). The president seems to think he is above the law; he refuses to follow the current laws and will not try to get Congress to change the laws to legalize what he is doing.

As for you, cnredd...could you please make your next response a coherent one
 
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Disneydude, your very thread is spin. It is clear you are creating your excuse for when this trumped up scandal goes down in flames. Spin on, McDuff!
 

easyt65

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Oh.....and say that prior administrations have done the same thing: Which isn't true (Remember repeat repeat repeat and some will believe it).

Are you kidding me? We've had this discussion in another thread.

Talk to me about all those illegal FBI Files Clinton had in his office on every GOP politician in Washington and on every opponent of his, all for his personal use.

Talk to me about Clinton's Domestic spying, using the same wire taps bush is but going farther by ordering the entry, search, and seisure of private property without requiring a warrent EVER during his administration.

Both of these ard documented FACT.

And of course those steps you listed work - they were taken right out of the Clinton Memoirs/Political How-To journal!

Your whole post is a TRIBUTE to spin! No wonder your callsign is DISNEYdude cause you're living in a fantasy world!
 

128shot

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easyt65 said:
Oh.....and say that prior administrations have done the same thing: Which isn't true (Remember repeat repeat repeat and some will believe it).

Are you kidding me? We've had this discussion in another thread.

Talk to me about all those illegal FBI Files Clinton had in his office on every GOP politician in Washington and on every opponent of his, all for his personal use.

Talk to me about Clinton's Domestic spying, using the same wire taps bush is but going farther by ordering the entry, search, and seisure of private property without requiring a warrent EVER during his administration.

Both of these ard documented FACT.

And of course those steps you listed work - they were taken right out of the Clinton Memoirs/Political How-To journal!

Your whole post is a TRIBUTE to spin! No wonder your callsign is DISNEYdude cause you're living in a fantasy world!

irrelevent, Clintons presidency is over, Bush is now in the seat. Lets focus on today and tommrow instead of yesterday...



Now that I got that out of the way.


I think this is a serious problem, and is very uncomfortable to think about.
 

easyt65

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128shot said:
irrelevent, Clintons presidency is over, Bush is now in the seat. Lets focus on today and tommrow instead of yesterday...



Now that I got that out of the way.


I think this is a serious problem, and is very uncomfortable to think about.
Clinton's Administration may be over, but as we have seen fromm Sandy Berger last year and the recent findings of his interference with the Cisneros case, we are STILL having to endure his SCANDALS!

He's like Political Herpes - the gift that keeps giving and giving and will NEVER go away!
 
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easyt65 said:
He's like Political Herpes - the gift that keeps giving and giving and will NEVER go away!
You never know, from what we learned about Bill Clinton, his herpes may not be limited to just politics. ;)
 

aps

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disneydude said:
As much as I believe that the current administration is the most morally corrupt bunch in the history of this country, I have to hand it to them for being incredibly smart (note: I am referring to the cabinet not GWB himself).

The way that they can clearly break the law and then spin into a patriotic act is pure genius. They are masters at spin and when you analyze what they have created you have to hand it to them for having the intelligence to get this by a large segment of the population (who are not bothered that their President broke the law by engaging in domestic eavesdropping).

While I think their tactics are immoral...they clearly work:

First, use 9/11 as the foundation to advance your political agenda. People are very emotional about this and it hits home.

Second, repeat things over and over even if they aren't true because people will start to believe it,i.e., "Iraq and 9/11 are integrally related".

Third, create a terror threat index that you can raise to keep people's fears alive. If the country starts getting too comfortable -- raise the level.

Fourth - develop and engage in "politics of war" to keep people afraid....just enough

Fifth - Talk tough --- the people who vote in this country like a leader who appears strong, even if they are not.

Sixth - deny deny deny --- and block access to the release of all records. You can always use the tried and true "On-going investigation" or better yet "release would jeopardize delicate internal affairs and put the country in jeopardy" -- yeah...that goes back to the politics of war.

Seventh - If you get caught...make it sound like you were wiretapping only calls to Al-quaida. (Remember the movie "Chicago" - "Give em the old Razzle Dazzle --- and a good portion of the country will believe anything you tell them".

Final result: You make anyway who questions you look unpatriotic, which is good for you, so no one really comes after you all that hard for fear of looking weak....and you get away with it.


Oh.....and say that prior administrations have done the same thing: Which isn't true (Remember repeat repeat repeat and some will believe it).

Again: I have to hand it to them. They have played a smart hand. As I indicated in another post, every legal scholar I have read has analyzed the administrations arguments and have concluded that it is clear that there was no justification for the spying and they expect it to go to the Supreme Court, which will be very very interesting because we will see the true color of the new Bush appointees. I am anxious to see how it will play out, but I am pretty sure I already know.

One final thought: Another intelligent aspect of this administration's spin control: How does Bush get away with labeling liberal judges as "activist judges" with a political agenda, when it is clear that both Roberts and Alito were appointed to be "Activists" in moving the Supreme Court to the right wing. Its amazing to me that they clearly say that this is their intention and yet no one in the media or in the public for that matter calls him to explain how they are any less "Activist Judges".
:clap: :applaud :bravo:

I totally agree with you, disneydude. I just cannot fathom how these people live with themselves. If Ridge was still head of Homeland Security, I am sure we would have seen a heightened threat index effective today to distract from the BS that our current Attorney General has spit out today regarding the NSA program and remind people that we live in dangerous times. I hope that the FISA court reviews the program because I would love to see what they had to say about it.
 

cnredd

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aps said:
:clap: :applaud :bravo:

I totally agree with you, disneydude. I just cannot fathom how these people live with themselves. If Ridge was still head of Homeland Security, I am sure we would have seen a heightened threat index effective today to distract from the BS that our current Attorney General has spit out today regarding the NSA program and remind people that we live in dangerous times. I hope that the FISA court reviews the program because I would love to see what they had to say about it.
And if they say that the President was correct in his authority and agrees with the Attorney General's methodology, will you retract your accusations and admit you were wrong?...

Cause it's really nice to read all of your posts saying how everybody's guilty followed by this post which says you want to wait to "see what they(FISA court) had to say about it...

Apparently they should've bypassed all of that and just asked you...:roll:
 

aps

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cnredd said:
And if they say that the President was correct in his authority and agrees with the Attorney General's methodology, will you retract your accusations and admit you were wrong?...
I'm not sure that I would be deemed as being "wrong" if the FISA court determines that the President was correct. But sure, I would admit if my legal conclusions were misguided or inaccurate.


Cause it's really nice to read all of your posts saying how everybody's guilty followed by this post which says you want to wait to "see what they(FISA court) had to say about it...
I'm not waiting to see what the FISA court says for any other purpose than just being interested in how they would view the NSA program. Whether it would change my mind about its legality is a whole different issue.


Apparently they should've bypassed all of that and just asked you...:roll:
I know! The nerve of them...wasting all this taxpayer money when they could have come to me.

As an aside, I am proud of Specter. I admire his candidness in speaking about his thoughts about the program and questioning its legality. I can't wait to watch the hearing tonight.
 
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