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Atheists Favorite Argument

I don't deny there is evidence against my claim.
There is no "evidence aganst" your claim. Certainly not evolution. There is simply evidence that our universe is a physical, deterministic system that follows natural laws. And by evidence, I mean all the information ever collected.

All of that can be true, and still it is not evidence that rainbow unicorns DID NOT make the universe out of their own poop. A claim, by the way, that goes on and is on the same shelf as your claim.

You once again mangle the concept of evidence.
 
Stating a fact that makes a claim more probable than not is evidence
100% wrong. It was wrong the first time you said it, and it is wrong now. I have explained why, directly to you, multiple times.

It's not just wrong. At this point, it's laughable, as is your intransigent repetition of it.
 
I don't know. I'm not making the case for a kindly benevolent God who loves people and just wants a good day for all. The Creator might be a crusty old bastard for all I know. I still think the universe and our existence was intentionally caused. I don't believe in kindly benevolent mother nature either.

OK. So basically we agree that the idea of a designer-God is a possibility- and is a hypothesis which we really are in no position to test right now. And even if such a God existed, we can't really know his/her/its/their real identity or desires.

So the next question is: so what?

Would we or should we be doing anything differently? Would it make any difference in our ethics or how we treat each other?
 
There is no "evidence aganst" your claim. Certainly not evolution. There is simply evidence that our universe is a physical, deterministic system that follows natural laws. And by evidence, I mean all the information ever collected.

All of that can be true, and still it is not evidence that rainbow unicorns DID NOT make the universe out of their own poop. A claim, by the way, that goes on and is on the same shelf as your claim.

You once again mangle the concept of evidence.
Do you have a feces fetish? You should get help for that.
 
100% wrong. It was wrong the first time you said it, and it is wrong now. I have explained why, directly to you, multiple times.

It's not just wrong. At this point, it's laughable, as is your intransigent repetition of it.
We can test this.

It is within any number of ranges of probability that one or more DP participants are active cannibals. In fact, there is a non-zero chance that one DP contributor has eaten human flesh.

I state as fact that the poster using the handle @DrewPaul fits within the parameters of these probability sets.

Therefore, my assertion, were I to offer it, that @DrewPaul is a cannibal would serve as evidence that @DrewPaul is the cannibal.

@DrewPaul, using @DrewPaul's reasoning, is therefore necessarily a cannibal.
 
Do you have a feces fetish? You should get help for that.
*when there are no tools left in the toolbox

You have only had two weak parlor tricks this entire time. And both of them have been exposed for all to see.

So we get posts like this one ^^
 
We can test this.

It is within any number of ranges of probability that one or more DP participants are active cannibals. In fact, there is a non-zero chance that one DP contributor has eaten human flesh.

I state as fact that the poster using the handle @DrewPaul fits within the parameters of these probability sets.

Therefore, my assertion, were I to offer it, that @DrewPaul is a cannibal would serve as evidence that @DrewPaul is the cannibal.

@DrewPaul, using @DrewPaul's reasoning, is therefore necessarily a cannibal.
One must own a collie in order to molest one's collie.

Therefore owning a collie is evidence of being a collie molester.

Logic!
 
OK. So basically we agree that the idea of a designer-God is a possibility- and is a hypothesis which we really are in no position to test right now. And even if such a God existed, we can't really know his/her/its/their real identity or desires.

So the next question is: so what?

Would we or should we be doing anything differently? Would it make any difference in our ethics or how we treat each other?
This is one expression of it.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness.

This way our most basic rights don't come from the government. It goes on to say that governments are formed to perserve these rights.

If the universe was caused for life and humans to exist it puts humanity in a special category. If we're the unintended result of mindless forces then humans aren't any more special than anything else that was accidentally caused to exist. I believe in the golden rule because I believe humans are special.
 
This is one expression of it.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness.

This way our most basic rights don't come from the government. It goes on to say that governments are formed to perserve these rights.

If the universe was caused for life and humans to exist it puts humanity in a special category. If we're the unintended result of mindless forces then humans aren't any more special than anything else that was accidentally caused to exist. I believe in the golden rule because I believe humans are special.

Now you are getting close. Human beings aren’t special.
 
Atheism is nothing more than a lack of belief in a god or gods.
That’s all.

I have no clue what your word salad post refers to, or what you think atheists favorite arguments are.

I’m sure many atheists argue far more about sports/music/politics than whatever you’re going on about.

I'm in my mid 40's and atheist.
I've never had an argument with anyone about atheism.
I work with a lovely Muslim guy from Packistan and he knows I'm atheist and we get along just fine.
It's not my job to try and convert him and he is of the same opinion and we work together every day extremely well.

People need to chill out and just accept people for who they are.
 
If the universe was caused for life and humans to exist it puts humanity in a special category
How do you know the universe wasn’t caused for plankton to exist, and humans are just a bizarre and unintended byproduct of billions of years of evolution?
 
How do you know the universe wasn’t caused for plankton to exist, and humans are just a bizarre and unintended byproduct of billions of years of evolution?

Obviously the reason for the universe to exist is so that England can win the world cup.

What else matters?
 
One must own a collie in order to molest one's collie.

Therefore owning a collie is evidence of being a collie molester.

Logic!

I know you're not as dumb as you act. Why do your parody the logic I use? Why not just address the original post? This isn't about whether a Creator exists, its about whether there are facts that make that claim more likely. Of course there is. Its disingenuous to claim there isn't. Evidence isn't proof. I'm not forcing you to believe anything. I'm not making a fact claim theism is true. I believe it is and I submitted 4 facts in favor of that belief. Not gaps. Not leaps of logic.

F1. The universe exists. This is a foundational fact. If the universe didn't exist neither claim would be true. This fact is evidence of either claim.
F2. Intelligent life exists. This is a foundational claim of theism. Theists believe the universe was intentionally caused and designed for intelligent life. Mindless naturalistic forces don't have to cause any life or intelligent life.
F3. The universe is fine-tuned for life. For the belief the universe was intentionally caused for life to exist it must be in a configuration that allows life to exist. No one can claim intelligent life had to exist. No one would predict or expect mindless forces minus any plan or intent cause life to exist. This evidence is so powerful it's the basis of multiverse theory.
F4. The fact the universe has laws of nature, is knowable, uniform and to a large extent predictable, amenable to scientific research and the laws of logic deduction and induction and is also explicable in mathematical terms.

I'll add one.
F5. The fact intelligent humans have created a virtual universe.

It shows intelligent beings have the inclination and intelligence to cause a universe to exist. In this case it wasn't a real one, it is a mathematical one the visually replicates what we observe in the real universe. The only thing that stops us from creating a real universe is knowledge. If we humans caused a universe to exist would you agree it was intentionally caused to exist?

Are you going to actually get serious and engage in this topic or just continue being a fool?
 
This is one expression of it.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness.

This way our most basic rights don't come from the government. It goes on to say that governments are formed to perserve these rights.

If the universe was caused for life and humans to exist it puts humanity in a special category. If we're the unintended result of mindless forces then humans aren't any more special than anything else that was accidentally caused to exist. I believe in the golden rule because I believe humans are special.

I have zero problem knowing that humans are not special in any ways that are not linked to our biological, physiological, and intellectual genetic components. We are bags of cells in water, more highly developed than many life forms, with more intricately developed brains...thru evolution. Those of us born as humans won the genetic lottery...that's it.

I also have no problem if humans were to disappear from the Earth.

How can you provide significant "evidence" otherwise?
 
Why do your parody the logic I use?
The ILLOGIC you use.

What is left to do? Your specious illogic has been obliterated. Your only presented argument has failed spectacularly. At this point I'm just trying to have a little fun.
 
I know you're not as dumb as you act. Why do your parody the logic I use? Why not just address the original post? This isn't about whether a Creator exists, its about whether there are facts that make that claim more likely. Of course there is. Its disingenuous to claim there isn't. Evidence isn't proof. I'm not forcing you to believe anything. I'm not making a fact claim theism is true. I believe it is and I submitted 4 facts in favor of that belief. Not gaps. Not leaps of logic.
The bold shows that you dont have the educational foundation or discernment or open mindedness needed to realize that the bold is wrong. So wrong.

There are no 'facts' that make it more likely. It's supposition, period. Again, you need a dictionary for "evidence."
 
How do you know the universe wasn’t caused for plankton to exist, and humans are just a bizarre and unintended byproduct of billions of years of evolution?

I don't believe we would be here were it not for plankton. However either way you're saying the universe was intentionally caused to exist.


Phytoplankton comprise two main groups: photosynthetic cyanobacteria and the single-celled algae that drift in the sunlit top layers of oceans. They provide food, directly or indirectly, for virtually every other marine creature. They emit much of the oxygen that permeates our atmosphere. Their fossilized remains, buried and compressed by geological forces, are transformed into oil, the dense liquid of carbon that we use to fuel our cars, trucks and buses. In addition, according to research that has only recently come into focus, they play a huge role in the cycling of carbon dioxide from the atmosphere to the biosphere and back, and this cycling helps to control Earth's climate.
 
Intelligent beings can self initiate an action.

Except that you have not an iota of actual objective evidence for your so-called "Intelligent" Designer. None. All you have, as everyone here recognizes, is a bunch of empty words.
 
The bold shows that you dont have the educational foundation or discernment or open mindedness needed to realize that the bold is wrong. So wrong.

There are no 'facts' that make it more likely. It's supposition, period. Again, you need a dictionary for "evidence."

Excellent analysis!
 
Confirmation bias is the tendency to seek out and prefer information that supports our preexisting beliefs. As a result, we tend to ignore any information that contradicts those beliefs.

You are more SELF-aware than I thought you might be! Congrats!
 
There is evidence no matter how long you hold your breath or say there isn't.


Claiming it is evidence does not make it evidence--no matter how long you hold your breath and claim otherwise.
 
Stating a fact that makes a claim more probable than not is evidence.

Not if the "claim" is NOT REALLY made more probable. Whether you care to admit it or not, your "claim" remains nothing but OPINION WITHOUT REAL EVIDENCE, as lots of people have now shown.
 
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