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I think you are mixing up excuses with understanding. We all need to do a better job of understanding each other
Let's be real about what people mean when they say something like that. Usually it means understanding what you think while you feel no obligation to try to understand others.
The point is that white people can and have done it as well.
You can't forget what we did 40 years ago because it was 40 years ago.
Seems to me that he has an illogical and racially preconceived judgment about black people with no "grounds or sufficient knowledge" on the subject. To say that only blacks riot, recently or not, is stupid and would be, by definition, racist.
Whatever you say. I just think it's ridiculous to assume that the African American race, as a whole, should be completely impartial to the whole not having rights until a few decades ago thing. I don't know why people assume that means I think it's ok to hate, since I clearly never said that, but obviously - just as a sideline observer - you have to know that's not just going to be hunky-dory afterward.
Hardly the same.
"We" didn't do it; specific individuals did. The attitude that "we" are responsible for some crime against humanity 200 years ago based on nothing but the color of our skin is racist.I don't blame all black people for the Cincinnati Riots. Why are you trying to blame all white people for the 18th-19th century slave trade or an act of violence 40 years ago? I never said anyone had to forget it; I said that its not a valid excuse for underachievement. If CJ Walker, daughter of slaves, could become the first self-made millionairess in US history then whats their excuse for not even graduating from high school in 2012? We don't hear people like Jesse Jackson asking those questions. Instead, he runs his mouth about racist whitey and the vast conspiracy to keep blacks in poverty and people like you try to justify it.
Actually I have a mountain of statistical evidence which formed my judgement. But I suppose next you'll come up with some cockamamy story about statistics being fixed and the police being racists. Its a typical tactic; accuse people of being racists when the data doesn't support your views.
If all you ever do is justify something, it's fair to assume that you support that thing, right?
None of what you said makes any sense.
It makes perfect sense. You accuse me of being a racist because I pointed out the fact that blacks have been the only people to hold a city hostage to violent race-based riots in recent memory. You then claim that "we", being all whites, are collectively responsible for the violent acts committed by individual people 40 years ago because we are white. I never said that all blacks were responsible for the Cincinnati Riots. You are the only one speaking in collective terms here and attempting to advance a racist point of view. Or are you now backpedaling on your "we" accusation?
Because it's not true. In fact, I showed it. There are riots all of the world done by people who aren't black, including many riots by white people - in this country and in others.
I have yet to see you provide an example of anyone else holding an American city hostage to violent race-based riots in recent memory. Unless of course "recent" to you is 1971. :roll: Are "we" still responsible? You think that every black person is assigned a racist white man at birth to wait in the wings for an opportunity to sabotage their life? Or just that its justifiable for them to believe it?
If 1971 isn't recent...
Do you honestly consider 1971 to be recent? :lol: Just admit it; you have nothing. There haven't been any violent racially-based riots in American cities by white people, hispanic people, jewish people, asian people, etc. for 40 plus years.
Dude, really? You are passing judgment over a race of people..
No, YOU are passing judgement on an entire race of people and encouraging another race to do the same. "We" are not responsible for something that happened 40 or 200 years ago. I'm not the one claiming that an entire race is responsible for the actions of individuals. You don't believe that all blacks should be judged on the basis of the behavior of the barbarian thugs looting our cities, and rightly so, but why then do you blame the entire white race for the actions of individuals 40 plus years ago and encourage blacks to do the same?
Rocketman said:not when it predates their lives.
Caine said:So... A black baby born into this world is already born resentful towards whites because of something that has happened in history that has not affected them? Even though they don't know the difference between races yet?
Caine said:Quit jabbering about "Oh Woes R DUH EFFEKZ UF DUH HIZTORY" and make SENSE!
Caine said:What effects of history? At what point in a black person's life is it that they obtain awareness of their inherent resentment towards white people, which is an excusable trait?
Caine said:You are just repeating the same thing without making any effort to explain why history should matter to the 80s and 90s born black people who have had full and equal opportunity in the country since their birth. You just keep repeating.... "Oh Woez is duh history dat be holdin' da black menzzes down"
Caine said:Socioeconomic status is what matters. An upper class black kid is going to have the same opportunities as an upper class white kid.
Caine said:BTW: Your links suck... half of them don't work
Caine said:the others talk about "disease rates are higher for afric.." OF ****ING COURSE THEY ARE... WHITE PEOPLE CAN'T GET SICKLE CELL.
Caine said:Sorry, I call bull****. "Social capital" is something an INDIVIDUAL builds.
Caine said:You show up to a job interview dressed well, articulate, honest, and qualified for the job, and it doesn't matter if you are black or white.
Caine said:So I, who had nothing to do with slavery or discrimination........ I am supposed to ACCEPT having people of another race hateful and resentful and distrustful towards me for some **** I didn't do to them, who didn't experience it.... and you expect the racial "gap" to be bridged? GTFO.
Caine said:Until blacks can grow up and move on, it ain't going to happen. Im not kissing someone's ass because of some **** I didn't do, and I am sick of walking on eggshells. So call me a racist... cause I didn't have **** to do with it.
Caine said:And yet that is an alternate reality to the one being faced by blacks born in the current generation of mid 20s and early 30 year olds.......... Nobody is paying **** back. Last time I checked, my black friends don't have a ****ing check they have to send off to the "Cracker Slave Massa" that sets them back every month. So your analogy can suck a nut.
Caine said:You see.... Apparently you think you are talking to just another privileged northern hand flopping white dude whose parents had plenty of "opportunity" to pass on to them.
No, I grew up moving from one "trailer" to the next...
Caine said:So you see..... Claiming I had some kind of special leg up in life because I am white is just ****ing stupid.
Caine said:Any poor black person who stayed out of trouble (that is THEIR responsibility to do, regardless of where they life) and stayed in school (THEIR RESPONSIBILITY) could have done the same thing.
Caine said:If someone lacked the ability to make good decisions, they can't blame that **** on their race.... because I know plenty of broke ass crackers in North Carolina who made ****ty decisions too.
Napoleon said:Now lets examine why that is.
Napoleon said:The most prominent leaders in the black community LOVE stirring the pot.
Napoleon said:Their mantra is that you didn't get that job, you are poor, or you were arrested not because you didn't graduate from high school, take responsibility for your life, or commit a crime but because ol' racist whitey is at it again.
Napoleon said:And then there's a distorted earful of life for blacks 200 years ago and calls for a riot.
Napoleon said:We don't hear many leaders in the black community mention that only 1% of whites were actually slave holders, that the largest slave holder in Louissianna was actually a black woman, or that the first self-made millionairess was a black woman.
Napoleon said:Instead, its a bunch of bull saying that you aren't responsible for the state of your life
Napoleon said:and you'll never get a fair shot because everyone is racist and those successful black men and women are race traitors.
Napoleon said:The disadvantages experienced by the black community in modern society are of their own making not the result of anything the white man has done to them.
Napoleon said:Black Americans have been offered every advantage we can provide
Napoleon said:and its not our fault that many choose to sell crack on street corners instead of graduating from high school and/or going to college.
Ok, lets.
Well, I suspect this is just what most people would do in their situation. And rightly so. If you see injustice, the proper reaction is not to acquiesce in leaving things as they are.
I don't have that impression. This seems to be an opinion. Oh, I imagine you can find someone who's said something like this. Saying this is characteristic of what black leaders say, however, is going to be a much tougher point to establish.
No doubt for every call for a riot that an African American leader makes, we could find a call for mass murder, assassinations, or other such by white supremacist groups. I don't see an army of angry white people killing blacks en masse, but I also don't see a bunch of black people rioting. I'll leave the point delicately unstated.
Whether those are true or not, why are they relevant? Most African Americans today have ancestors who were slaves. At least as importantly, the social and economic status of African Americans today is greatly affected by slavery and Jim Crow laws. All of what you say can be true, and mean absolutely nothing to that analysis.
People who think they are entirely responsible for the state of their lives seem to have an overblown sense of human power, and a staggering ignorance of history and the reasons for civilization.
Your entire rant here seems to be nothing more than a straw man. Racism continues to exist, and it has direct power in the day-to-day interactions between people of different races. And this is surely part fo the problem. The other part of the problem is that accumulated acts of racism have led to serious disadvantage for African Americans generally.
To believe this, one would have to believe that history has no effect on the present, or so it seems to me. I don't think anyone who fully grasps what has been done to African Americans could believe that the effects of those happenings are entirely settled out.
Not really. They've been offered the advantages we are willing to provide. Not the ones we have been capable of offering, or any that could redress the injustice done to them.
Well...I don't know that we're in a position to analyze fault just yet. But again, I'm not sure why this is important. It's not my fault (or yours, I assume) that human beings are mortal. That doesn't mean we shouldn't, or don't, respect that fact and make allowances for it, both small and large, from our day-to-day lives to our grandest political institutions.
OscarB63 said:poor poor black people, they system is rigged against them, history is against them, nothing is their fault, they don't stand a chance. hell, if I was black I'd just give up and kill myself...since the whole situation is beyond my control
Ok, lets.
Well, I suspect this is just what most people would do in their situation.
And rightly so. If you see injustice, the proper reaction is not to acquiesce in leaving things as they are.
Saying this is characteristic of what black leaders say, however, is going to be a much tougher point to establish.
No doubt for every call for a riot that an African American leader makes, we could find a call for mass murder, assassinations, or other such by white supremacist groups. I don't see an army of angry white people killing blacks en masse, but I also don't see a bunch of black people rioting. I'll leave the point delicately unstated.
So far, those powers are not enough to redress the opposing power, which is based in history and is responsible for ongoing injustice.
One can lack some control, but not lack every kind or level of control. If you actually want to think about these issues, try not taking everything automatically to an extreme, and only do so when there's a clear reason for it. I have never said that black people in this country lack all power and control. They have at least the natural power any human being has to move around, talk to people, form associations, and so on.
So far, those powers are not enough to redress the opposing power, which is based in history and is responsible for ongoing injustice.
I mean.... for ****s sake..... Morgan Freeman was G O D.
Events have consequences, which become the causes of yet other events in their turn.
Did you experience the American Revolutionary War? Does the American Revolutionary War have an effect on your life?
I'm pretty sure it's no to the former, and yes to the latter. And if that is so, especially given the weight of the history under discussion, why wouldn't it have a profound effect on our current situation?
As a person, it's never racial.'As a black person it's always racial'
OscarB63 said:thanks for confirming everything I said in my post....outside of the "natural power" to move about...blacks are powerless victims of the evil white society
OscarB63 said:100 years ago, a black man stole my great grandfather's horse. according to ashurbanipal's logic...I would be justified in distrusting and being resentful towards all black people
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