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Article with various arguments around the issues raised by the Ukraine war

Craig234

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There are a lot of topics in this article, so I'll leave it to people to respond to the ones they're interested in. One of its main themes returns to the issue of why Ukranian neutrality should be considered. Agree or not, there are some topics worth looking at.

How the US Started a New Cold War with Russia and Left Ukraine to Fight It | Common Dreams

"The world must do whatever it takes to obtain a ceasefire in Ukraine and make it stick."
www.commondreams.org
 

Highly biased article.
 
watsup said:
Highly biased article.
Click to expand...
Not a single Ukrainian is thinking "Damn It Joe Biden and America, why did you do this to us!!!??"

Your blog article tries to shift the blame from Russia and Putin towards the US, which is total ****ing nonsense. This war is 100% Russia's fault, nobody forced them to do this.
 
Common Dreams
 
thanks....I guess.
 
watsup said:
Highly biased article.
Click to expand...
That doesn't make much sense. I didn't say what I agree or disagree with, but try making actual arguments against the actual arguments in the article. Or should I reply to your post with "biased post" and that's all?
 
RabidAlpaca said:
Not a single Ukrainian is thinking "Damn It Joe Biden and America, why did you do this to us!!!??"
Click to expand...

That's a straw man. Who Ukranians blame for the war is not the topic. The article also says repeatedly, Putin is responsible for the wrong war, period.

RabidAlpaca said:
Your blog article tries to shift the blame from Russia and Putin towards the US, which is total ****ing nonsense. This war is 100% Russia's fault, nobody forced them to do this.
Click to expand...

It discusses more issues than who is responsible for the war. You're misrepresenting it.
 
Craig234 said:
That doesn't make much sense. I didn't say what I agree or disagree with, but try making actual arguments against the actual arguments in the article. Or should I reply to your post with "biased post" and that's all?y
Click to expand...

What I’m saying is that it is so highly biased that it is simply not worth the time to discuss it. I gagged while I was reading it at how highly biased it was. There’s better things to do in DP than try to answer anti-American propaganda.
 
Biased post. No, seriously. The article's arguments are better than you suggest and you can agree or disagree, but your reaction is projecting bias.
 
Craig234 said:
That's a straw man. Who Ukranians blame for the war is not the topic. The article also says repeatedly, Putin is responsible for the wrong war, period.



It discusses more issues than who is responsible for the war. You're misrepresenting it.
Click to expand...

What do YOU find interesting about the article? YOU haven’t even tried to discuss it yet. If you don’t like what we are saying, throw some ante into the pot.
 
Craig234 said:
Biased post. No, seriously. The article's arguments are better than you suggest and you can agree or disagree, but your reaction is projecting bias.
Click to expand...

See post #11. If you think that this is such an important article, feel free to tell us why and YOU discuss the points therein. I mean, for chrisakes, look at the headline! It screams anti-American bias. Why would anyone want to go any further? Waste of time.
 
watsup said:
What do YOU find interesting about the article? YOU haven’t even tried to discuss it yet. If you don’t like what we are saying, throw some ante into the pot.
Click to expand...
I would had you not made it look like a waste of time. If someone shows actual discussion, I can.
 
Craig234 said:
I would had you not made it look like a waste of time. If someone shows actual discussion, I can.
Click to expand...

It’s quite obvious that no one cares about this blatantly anti-American propaganda. Instead of whining about us, start a discussion of it. We are not your discussion servants. It reads like it came out of one of Putin’s hack rooms.
 
watsup said:
It’s quite obvious that no one cares about this blatantly anti-American propaganda.
Click to expand...
Speak for yourself, and it's clear there's not a point even reading your posts in this thread further.
 
watsup said:
Whatever. Quit whining and start a discussion.
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You can't read, as in the OP I said there are a lot of arguments and people can indicate which are important to them to discuss, but you have lost the opportunity for any discussion with your obnoxious behavior.
 
Craig234 said:
You can't read, as in the OP I said there are a lot of arguments and people can indicate which are important to them to discuss, but you have lost the opportunity for any discussion with your obnoxious behavior.
Click to expand...

Still full of lame excuses as to why YOU won’t discuss an article that YOU posted. I don’t see people rushing to this thread. Why should they? Read the headline of the article and go the other way. That’s what they’re doing. See post #16.
 
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Lazy Russian Craig is lazy. America bad!

Craig234 said:
That's a straw man. Who Ukranians blame for the war is not the topic. The article also says repeatedly, Putin is responsible for the wrong war, period.



It discusses more issues than who is responsible for the war. You're misrepresenting it.
Click to expand...
It's not. It's Russian propaganda filth that tries to blame the US for the Russian invasion. We're the ones helping Ukraine fight for themselves. The keyword is FIGHT FOR THEMSELVES. The Ukrainian people have a right to self determination.

Your article is such shit you haven't even been able to say anything you like about it, and as we attack it you just watch because you have no arguments to defend it.
 
RabidAlpaca said:
It's not. It's Russian propaganda filth that tries to blame the US for the Russian invasion.
Click to expand...

You lie. "Nothing justifies the Russian invasion" "None of this can justify Russia's invasion of Ukraine" "We sincerely hope that Russia will end its illegal, brutal invasion of Ukraine"
 
Craig234 said:
You lie. "Nothing justifies the Russian invasion" "None of this can justify Russia's invasion of Ukraine" "We sincerely hope that Russia will end its illegal, brutal invasion of Ukraine"
Click to expand...
You and your article just tried to justify the Russian invasion. You wrote on your OP there are solid reaosns for Ukraine to be left "neutral", which based on everything else you're supporting seems like you're saying we should let them get their nuts stomped by Russia. There is no neutral for Ukraine to be, they're fighting for survival.

Your articles titles starts with HOW THE US STARTED A WAR. I've seen people like you in the past days running around calling Euromaidan an American coup and claiming that Russia had no choice.
If you can't defend this ****ing idiocy, don't expect any of us to. This thread was lazy and you should put more effort into defending the things you post.

Sorry Craig. The war is 100% Russia's fault and no matter how much you hate it, the Ukrainian people have a right to self determination.
 

Your reading comprehension is terrible like your manners. I didn't express an opinion, and the neutrality referred to was NOT to let Russia attack them. The best thing I can say about your comment is that you limited yourself to "seems" rather than overstating your errors.

RabidAlpaca said:
Your articles titles starts with HOW THE US STARTED A WAR.
Click to expand...

COLD war.
RabidAlpaca said:
I've seen people like you
Click to expand...

So your lack of reading comprehension includes you lumping people together carelessly.

RabidAlpaca said:
in the past days running around calling Euromaidan an American coup and claiming that Russia had no choice.
Click to expand...

You lie in associating that statement with me.

RabidAlpaca said:
Sorry Craig. The war is 100% Russia's fault and no matter how much you hate it, the Ukrainian people have a right to self determination.
Click to expand...
You've gone from idiotic to despicable.

You owe me an apology.
 
RabidAlpaca said:
Your blog article tries to shift the blame from Russia and Putin towards the US, which is total ****ing nonsense. This war is 100% Russia's fault, nobody forced them to do this.
Click to expand...

Nobody forced Russia to attack Ukraine, but actual experts say that the US (being the heavyweight of NATO) created the conditions where Putin/Russia perceived they were threatened, which very much helped this to happen.
 
I don't owe you shit. You lazily tried to argue in the OP that we should remain neutral, which immediately aligned your post with the Kremlin.

You've made it clear you're the kind of person that if you saw your neighbor was being raped and you could toss her a gun to defend herself, you'd just remain neutral and go back to watching TV. Talk about despicable!

Antiwar said:
Nobody forced Russia to attack Ukraine, but actual experts say that the US (being the heavyweight of NATO) created the conditions where Putin/Russia perceived they were threatened, which very much helped this to happen.
Click to expand...
Total nonsense. At no point did Ukraine threaten the national security or territorial integrity of Russia. Lol, some internet guy named antiwar doing everything he can to defend a war started solely by Russia. Was your name meant to be ironic?
 
Antiwar said:
Nobody forced Russia to attack Ukraine, but actual experts say that the US (being the heavyweight of NATO) created the conditions where Putin/Russia perceived they were threatened, which very much helped this to happen.
Click to expand...
My position is that what I know about Ukraine is that it is a great country with peaceful, freedom-loving people; and that Putin is an immoral dictator kleptocrat. That there was a legitimate discussion about the aggressiveness of NATO expansion; that we don't know the role that played in this war, from important reason to Russian propaganda, or whether Putin would have invaded anyway; and that regardless, Putin's war is not justified at all.
 
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