arguments on abortion[W: 246]

[Henrin]

Re: arguments on abortion

I'm not really inclined to discuss it with you now since you didn't have the courtesy to ask in the beginning instead of jumping to conclusions.

Ok, but I don't see how any sort of qualifiers could make my original statement about your stated position change.

 

[Scrabaholic]

Re: arguments on abortion

Ok, but I don't see how any sort of qualifiers could make my original statement about your stated position change.

It would behoove you to not make any assumptions about what others believe or don't believe.

 

[Henrin]

Re: arguments on abortion

It would behoove you to not make any assumptions about what others believe or don't believe.

What are you talking about? You or her? In any event, she has failed to see that if the argument for abortion is the right to property(body) than it would apply to all property be that a home, a business, a persons body, or whatever. The rules don't just change for a certain kind of private property. It's not that important anyway since in none of the cases can you use kill another person for simply being on, or in this case, in your property.

 

[choiceone]

Re: arguments on abortion

Are OBGYN's that do abortions well payed? Seems like an area of practice that comes with some serious professional draw backs (I imagine regardless of your views, that's a pretty hard job to perform day in and day out), besides the whole death threat thing

OBYGNs that give prenatal care, handle childbirth, and give immediate postpartum care are much better paid than those who perform abortions and give post-abortion care.

http://www.healthcaresalaryonline.com/obstetrician-salary.htmlLowest and Highest OB GYN Salary
The lowest paid Obstetrician and Gynecologist Doctors earn less than $110,000 annually while the highest paid Obstetrician and Gynecologist Doctor earn as much as $400,000 per year.

Abortion Doctor Salaries | Simply Hired Average Abortion Doctor Salaries
The average salary for abortion doctor jobs is $55,000. Average abortion doctor salaries can vary greatly due to company, location, industry, experience and benefits.

Who wants to be an abortion doctor? - Salon.com
Tina Welsh says that workers at abortion clinics can expect to make roughly half what one would make in private practice or at a hospital. (As director, she made less than $60,000 per year). But accepting a lower salary goes along with the larger mission of the work: keeping abortion affordable.

 

[choiceone]

Re: arguments on abortion

What are you talking about? You or her? In any event, she has failed to see that if the argument for abortion is the right to property(body) than it would apply to all property be that a home, a business, a persons body, or whatever. The rules don't just change for a certain kind of private property. It's not that important anyway since in none of the cases can you use kill another person for simply being on, or in this case, in your property.

Of course the rules change. If you enter my apartment without my permission, you will not be prosecuted for rape, but if you put your penis in my vagina, you will be. In NY state law, and I believe there is a similar federal law, I have the right to use deadly force if necessary to make you stop raping me or prevent you from raping me if I perceive that you are threatening me with rape, and a third party may use such force to help me stop you. Same thing for kidnapping, sexual assault, or robbery. But if you merely threaten to use physical force against my umbrella, no one is going to use deadly force against you. Using or threatening to use physical force against a person's body is a completely different matter from using or threatening to use physical force against a person's petty property.

 

[Scrabaholic]

Re: arguments on abortion

What are you talking about? You or her? In any event, she has failed to see that if the argument for abortion is the right to property(body) than it would apply to all property be that a home, a business, a persons body, or whatever. The rules don't just change for a certain kind of private property. It's not that important anyway since in none of the cases can you use kill another person for simply being on, or in this case, in your property.

I'm talking about you making assumptions about my view on the death penalty.

 

[Henrin]

Re: arguments on abortion

I'm talking about you making assumptions about my view on the death penalty.

Sorry then. I honestly don't think I did that. When you support the death penalty you must support the creation of a system to end human life and unless you believe in putting people to death very quickly you must support a system that makes people wait for their death for years to come with nothing else to look forward too.

 

[code1211]

Re: arguments on abortion

No. Paying for abortions is not necessary. All that is required is citizens not prevent access to them, which drives up the cost of abortion. Since abortion doctors are in fear for their lives from crazies with guns, there is a shortage of providers and a high cost for security at the abortion clinics. This makes an abortion much more expensive than if the anti-choice zealots stayed away.

State funded abortions and contraception, if not sterilization, would be wise though, as a means of population control. But, I doubt Americans are ready for that.

I have often thought that if an unwed mother receives public funding to raise her child that she should be sterilized to prevent further opportunities to increase costs. Also that her access to abortion not be obstructed.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: arguments on abortion

I have often thought that if an unwed mother receives public funding to raise her child that she should be sterilized to prevent further opportunities to increase costs. Also that her access to abortion not be obstructed.

thoughts like these have no place in America LOL

 

[calamity]

Re: arguments on abortion

I have often thought that if an unwed mother receives public funding to raise her child that she should be sterilized to prevent further opportunities to increase costs. Also that her access to abortion not be obstructed.

That would make sense, but I've seen the looks on people's faces when this was suggested.

 

[code1211]

Re: arguments on abortion

thoughts like these have no place in America LOL

If her choice is to be supported, should not the supporters have some assurrance that her continued lack of wisdom not bring further costs?

Perhaps not sterilization. Just the lack of any additional assistance to support her continued freedom of choice.

The complete abandonment of her responsibility on her part does not seem to me to justify a complete assumption of that responsibility by me and the others who are penalized financially by her freedom of choice. My support of the availability of abortion is that i do not want to be the caretaker of the babies that result from unwanted pregnancies. This same logic, convenience, supports this conclusion.

What is your suggestion to restrict the costs brought to society by her willingness to be a baby factory?

 

[AGENT J]

Re: arguments on abortion

1.)If her choice is to be supported, should not the supporters have some assurrance that her continued lack of wisdom not bring further costs?

2.)Perhaps not sterilization. Just the lack of any additional assistance to support her continued freedom of choice.

3.)The complete abandonment of her responsibility on her part does not seem to me to justify a complete assumption of that responsibility by me and the others who are penalized financially by her freedom of choice. My support of the availability of abortion is that i do not want to be the caretaker of the babies that result from unwanted pregnancies. This same logic, convenience, supports this conclusion.

4.)What is your suggestion to restrict the costs brought to society by her willingness to be a baby factory?

1.)not at the extent of sterilization
2.) well these things are worlds apart and one has no business being discussed in america lol
3.) thanks for your opinion but that has nothing to do with the point sterilization has no place in america.
4.) who is this mythical person you are talking about? LMAO

regardless who it is, sterilization should never be a suggestion

 

[code1211]

Re: arguments on abortion

1.)not at the extent of sterilization
2.) well these things are worlds apart and one has no business being discussed in america lol
3.) thanks for your opinion but that has nothing to do with the point sterilization has no place in america.
4.) who is this mythical person you are talking about? LMAO

regardless who it is, sterilization should never be a suggestion

So what is your suggestion to eliminate this expense?

 

[AGENT J]

Re: arguments on abortion

So what is your suggestion to eliminate this expense?

who are you talking about
what expense are you talking about
and why does it need "eliminated"

 

[code1211]

Re: arguments on abortion

who are you talking about
what expense are you talking about
and why does it need "eliminated"

There is an expense born by the public to pay unmarried women to assist them with the expense of raising their children. Other coasts that are not so easily isolatable are the school breakfast and lunch programs and costs that seem to rise from the single parent household more often than two parent households of mischief entered into by the unsupervised.

Why does it need to be eliminated? Because I don't want to pay for it. Are you willing to pay my share?

I don't know if you've heard about it, but there is a little bit of a debt issue in this country.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: arguments on abortion

1.)There is an expense born by the public to pay unmarried women to assist them with the expense of raising their children. Other coasts that are not so easily isolatable are the school breakfast and lunch programs and costs that seem to rise from the single parent household more often than two parent households of mischief entered into by the unsupervised.

2.)Why does it need to be eliminated? Because I don't want to pay for it. Are you willing to pay my share?

I don't know if you've heard about it, but there is a little bit of a debt issue in this country.

1.) yes SOME single parents get assistance i have no issues with this premise based on the current discussion

is there some type of specific case you have in mind?

2.) i really dont care that you dont want to pay for it :shrug:
theres many things people dont want to pay for

3.) yep, im aware :shrug:

maybe if you added more substance what you are actually trying to discuss would be more clear?

 

[code1211]

Re: arguments on abortion

1.) yes SOME single parents get assistance i have no issues with this premise based on the current discussion

is there some type of specific case you have in mind?

2.) i really dont care that you dont want to pay for it :shrug:
theres many things people dont want to pay for

3.) yep, im aware :shrug:

maybe if you added more substance what you are actually trying to discuss would be more clear?

There is plenty of talk about rights when it comes to this issue and far less about responsibility.

When anyone exercises their right and it constricts my rights for them to exercise theirs, I have an issue. Taking money from me that could be used for something that benefits me in order that it benefit someone else is an issue.

The notion of Reproductive Rights often has a rider attached whereby I am called upon to pay for the contraceptives, the support of the out of wedlock children and ancillary costs to society of incumbent on the practice of having babies raising babies.

If there was no cost to me involved in this debate, I would have no interest in it. There is so I do.

 

[rivernile]

This article has a good, level headed argument against BOTH extreme sides of the debate. I think people pick pro-choice or pro-life flippantly, without thinking much at all. I agree with the article. Abortion is always morally wrong, but we must allow abortions at an early stage due to diverse personal circumstances.

Acknowledging Abortion: how the pro-choice & pro-life movements have fogged the debate

 

[AGENT J]

Re: arguments on abortion

1.)There is plenty of talk about rights when it comes to this issue and far less about responsibility.

2.)When anyone exercises their right and it constricts my rights for them to exercise theirs, I have an issue. Taking money from me that could be used for something that benefits me in order that it benefit someone else is an issue.

3.)The notion of Reproductive Rights often has a rider attached whereby I am called upon to pay for the contraceptives, the support of the out of wedlock children and ancillary costs to society of incumbent on the practice of having babies raising babies.

If there was no cost to me involved in this debate, I would have no interest in it. There is so I do.

1.) hmmmm i havent seen anybody mention rights when it comes to social programs but i dont read everything
as far as responsibility, well thats subjective

2.) again what right our people exercising that restricts yours? youll have to be more specific
who is taking money from you?

3.) hmmmm reproductive rights call you into action? how? by your examples i fail to see how reproductive rights do that

4.) ok but what are you debating and what is the cost to you? is this the only example or are you against everything that you THINK costs you?

 

[code1211]

Re: arguments on abortion

1.) hmmmm i havent seen anybody mention rights when it comes to social programs but i dont read everything
as far as responsibility, well thats subjective

2.) again what right our people exercising that restricts yours? youll have to be more specific
who is taking money from you?

3.) hmmmm reproductive rights call you into action? how? by your examples i fail to see how reproductive rights do that

4.) ok but what are you debating and what is the cost to you? is this the only example or are you against everything that you THINK costs you?

You're dodging my question.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: arguments on abortion

You're dodging my question.

nope you havent fully answered mine LOL

what question did i dodge and i cant answer until i know what the heck you are talking about LOL

 

[code1211]

Re: arguments on abortion

nope you havent fully answered mine LOL

what question did i dodge and i cant answer until i know what the heck you are talking about LOL

More oxygen would reach your thinker if you'd stop LOL-ing or LYAO.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: arguments on abortion

More oxygen would reach your thinker if you'd stop LOL-ing or LYAO.

oh look a failed insult and deflection instead of honestly and intellectually addressing the issues you havent support yet

now maybe you can buck up and actually address the post and answer the questions? I doubt it but ill ask you too anyway.

 

[code1211]

Re: arguments on abortion

oh look a failed insult and deflection instead of honestly and intellectually addressing the issues you havent support yet

now maybe you can buck up and actually address the post and answer the questions? I doubt it but ill ask you too anyway.

You can lead by example. I'm still awaiting your answer.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: arguments on abortion

1.)You can lead by example. I'm still awaiting your answer.

1.) i do, if you disagree feel free to factually prove otherwise
2.) answer to what? if you keep up and stay on topic im waiting on you, not the other way around lol Im waiting on you to address post 644