• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Ankara could let Russia use its Incirlik airbase to fight ISIS – Turkish FM

Beaudreaux

Preserve Protect Defend
Supporting Member
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 13, 2012
Messages
18,233
Reaction score
15,861
Location
veni, vidi, volo - now back in NC
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
I saw this as I was wandering around the interwebs today -

This will not end well for Turkey and their relationship with NATO and the EU... if it's even true.

Given the source (RT) it's possible that it's just a propaganda spin.

However, given that Erdogan has been crawling on his knees to Putin following his military shot down the Russian fighter/bomber, it's also possible, given that Obama told him as far as the US and NATO were concerned regarding Russia - YOYO (You're On Your Own). On one hand, I can see how the US wouldn't want to be dragged into an armed conflict with Russia over a shoot-down done by Turkey under questionable circumstances, yet on the other hand, they are a NATO alley, and we have a large and extremely important ongoing operation at Incirlik that is critical to our operations in that region of the world (and has been for decades), not just within Turkey as a NATO alley. Given the heated aggressive actions of Russia toward Ukraine, Georgia, the Baltic states and now the Balkans, I just can't see it as acceptable for the US or NATO to sit by and allow this to occur under current treaties and agreements. This may just be Erdogan's way of putting pressure on Obama and NATO to get what he wants from us? I can't tell yet. Either way, it's still a very high stakes gamble on the part of Erdogan.

Anyone heard anything else about this? I can't imagine that the US military would be happy having Russian forces on the same flight line with US assets. The security implications are immense.

 
Didn't Russia shoot down a Turkish aircraft recently?
 
mak2 said:
Didn't Russia shoot down a Turkish aircraft recently?
Click to expand...

I don't remember, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen. I'll look.

EDIT: The only thing I can find in a quick search was about the Turks shooting down the SU-24.

Russia seems to like shooting down everyone else's planes, so it could be possible.
 

I was stationed at Incirlik, you do realize its a base with US service members, rented and paid by US tax payers per a SOFA. The OP should do some research before posting idiocy. Do you even have a basic understanding of Turkish Russian relations? If you did you would realize how off the mark you are
 

I've deployed to, and out of, Incirlik and other bases in the region. What part, exactly, was off the mark? Did you not see where I mentioned treaties and agreements? NATO is based on a treaty, and our presence at Incirlik is governed by a SOFA (status of forces agreement) which is an agreement - if you'd like, read this: MilitaryINSTALLATIONS - U.S. Department of Defense

Again, what parts, exactly, are off the mark? Or, was this just a drive by post?
 

You understand nothing of Turkish Russian relations or the history, if you did you would not have posted. Read my post, i have said it twice, cant make it any clearer.
 

How much thought did you put into your reply?
 
JANFU said:
How much thought did you put into your reply?
Click to expand...

As much as you have, does that answer your question? I have a masters in modern European history, your post indicates your ignorance of the geopolitical issues of the area, and i dont have time to school an obvious amateur.
 
yankintx said:
You understand nothing of Turkish Russian relations or the history, if you did you would not have posted. Read my post, i have said it twice, cant make it any clearer.
Click to expand...

In your first post, you accused me of not understanding SOFA's and a number of other things. Now it's just me supposedly not understanding Russo-Turkish relations or the history. For future reference, telling me what you think I do or do not understand, is not telling me anything other than your opinion. I've asked twice now, and all I get is personal insults, rather than facts substantiated with evidence.
 

Blah blah

Like I care enough to continue with amateur historians.
 
JANFU said:
How much thought did you put into your reply?
Click to expand...

It would be strange as hell for a NATO member nation to allow Russia to use one of its airbases. If true, it's one more reason to kick Turkey out of NATO, or dissolve NATO completely as a relic of the Cold War that's no longer worth keeping. The U.S. has other airbases it could use to strike targets in Syria beside Incirlik--there are large bases near Irbil and northwest of Baghdad, and the British bases on Cyprus should be available. A carrier in the Mediterranean could also be used.
 

We have certainly played Syria badly. But the problems with Turkey go deeper and further back. I very much Obama can handle either situation and kerry is certainly not up to the job any better.
 
Beaudreaux said:
Your genuflexion is respectfully acknowledged.
Click to expand...

Feel free to bow to my superior knowledge on the subject, no problem. I tutor history part time, can you give a discount along with a basic understanding of the region. Later !!
 
joG said:
We have certainly played Syria badly. But the problems with Turkey go deeper and further back. I very much Obama can handle either situation and kerry is certainly not up to the job any better.
Click to expand...

I think Kerry could do it if he had the approval to do so. I don't think Obama understands or cares about the strategic necessity of having a NATO/US presence in Turkey for numerous reasons. Obama has moved toward a retraction of US military assets worldwide, with the exception of the west Pacific in what he called our "Pivot to Asia." Although, Turkey is part of both Asia and Europe, with the Strait being the dividing line.
 
yankintx said:
Feel free to bow to my superior knowledge on the subject, no problem. I tutor history part time, can you give a discount along with a basic understanding of the region. Later !!
Click to expand...

All I asked was that you provide detail to your assertions. You refused, obfuscated, insulted, and now retreat. I have no idea why? You are welcome to answer at any point, by simply describing your claim in detail with evidence through citations that are linked to outside sources. I understand that you say you don't have the time, yet you seem to have enough time to post hit and run posts like the above. That actually speaks volumes for you instead.
 
Beaudreaux said:
I don't remember, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen. I'll look.

EDIT: The only thing I can find in a quick search was about the Turks shooting down the SU-24.

Russia seems to like shooting down everyone else's planes, so it could be possible.
Click to expand...


Your OP says it happened...



"However, given that Erdogan has been crawling on his knees to Putin following his military shot down the Russian fighter/bomber,..."
 

You assume way to much about me, explains your thoughts on the geopolitical issues of the area.
 
yankintx said:
You understand nothing of Turkish Russian relations or the history, if you did you would not have posted. Read my post, i have said it twice, cant make it any clearer.
Click to expand...

You've said Beaudreaux is off the mark. In what ways? Seems churlish to make a claim such as this and then be unwilling to back it up with specifics.

I will freely admit that I'm not even an amateur historian of Turkey-Russia relations, but I am eager to learn. With your Master's, which you thought important enough to mention as an appeal to authority, I'd really like to know what you disagree with in the OP and why.
 

Do you recall Turkey planning to purchase Aid Defense kit from China?? Which was later scrapped.

Confusion over Turkey’s air defense system - DEFENSE UPDATE


Turkey Scraps $3.4B Air Defense Contract
 
yankintx said:
As much as you have, does that answer your question? I have a masters in modern European history, your post indicates your ignorance of the geopolitical issues of the area, and i dont have time to school an obvious amateur.
Click to expand...
Regardless of your oh so impressive credentials...the OP cited an article (with links to other stories supporting the premise. And you counter with the awe inspiring...Nuh UH!!! Gotta be honest with you...you are coming across as petulant, ignorant...and kinda douchey.
 
VanceMack said:
Regardless of your oh so impressive credentials...the OP cited an article (with links to other stories supporting the premise. And you counter with the awe inspiring...Nuh UH!!! Gotta be honest with you...you are coming across
Click to expand...
 
 
 
Wow, Turkey has officially pulled a complete 180 in regard to Russia.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Menu
Log in
Register
Cookies are required to use this site. You must accept them to continue using the site. Learn more…