Air America

GPS_Flex said:

I think this link should work: http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20050728-081354-1414r.htm


No, Air America is claiming that they aren’t responsible for what happened before they owned it. Besides, the charity went under because of this. Who is Air America going to pay the money to now?

Federal tax dollars that were earmarked for charity were used by Air America. Do you deny this Gordon travels?

Air America claims it isn’t responsible because there are new owners. Do you deny this?

Air America rips on corporations (like Enron) for less sullied and less sleazy activities every day in its broadcasts. Do you deny this?

Mainstream media is trying to shove this under the rug. People need to know that Air America is as bad or worse than the corporations it attacks.

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I read your links and you don't know any more than I do. I don't bite the conservative or liberal until the investigation is done.

I don't have to deny anything. I read your link in the Washington Times and feel the same about them as I do about the New York Times. They start their article with "Did Al Franken's liberal radio network Air America divert city money for the elderly and inner-city children to itself?" Well? You tell me.

After that personalized blast they say "That's the question people should be asking this week after the revelation that the New York Department of Investigation is looking into whether hundreds of thousands of dollars were illegally transferred from a Bronx community center to Air America."

Here's what I'm saying and I won't have to deny it because I am telling you I'm saying it. The New York Department of Investigation is investigating it right? The paper is quoting anonymous sources. I never trust that. I don't trust that if it is a story I love. Anonymous sources can't be trusted.

According to the article the organization didn't "go under" as you say but, "In late June, city officials designated the Gloria Wise Boys and Girls Club, a nonprofit organization that runs mentoring programs for children and day care for Alzheimer's patients, a "non-responsible city contractor." Investigators found "significant inappropriate transactions and falsified documents that were submitted to various City agencies." The city subsequently suspended the club's contracts, which run well into the millions." Note they say "various City agencies"?

Then the paper in it's last paragraph says, "Al Franken and Randi Rhodes, ever the defenders of the "little guy," should explain this one." Don't you think that if the New York Department of Investigation is investigating this that is what should be done? I seriously doubt that Al Franken and Randi Rhodes were out dealing with the Gloria Wise Boys and Girls Club which would have been the responsibility of the Air America Administration?Sales Staff and not the on air staff.

Anyway, I'm not denying anything. I'm saying whether it's Karl Rove or Air America, you can read what you want from a liberal slant or conservative but why not see if an investigation finds something before we ask someone that probably didn't do anything wrong or even know about it to explain it all?

And by the way: don't think the mainstream media can't go both ways. The Washington Times is just as much a member of the mainstream media as the Washington Post, New York Times and the New York Post. Quite a crowd aren't they? :duel

If this were Enron or Rove, it would be on the front page of every paper and you know it gordontravels.

Where is the New York Tomes on this? They never wait for an investigation to be complete before dragging a corporation through the mud unless said corporation is a liberal news outlet.

It’s like the Dan Rather memo, the bloggers had to do all the work and unearth the story before the Times reluctantly admitted Rather screwed himself.

GPS_Flex said:

If this were Enron or Rove, it would be on the front page of every paper and you know it gordontravels.

Where is the New York Tomes on this? They never wait for an investigation to be complete before dragging a corporation through the mud unless said corporation is a liberal news outlet.

It’s like the Dan Rather memo, the bloggers had to do all the work and unearth the story before the Times reluctantly admitted Rather screwed himself.

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Don't want to be a broken record but I was a member of the broadcast media for years. So what if the New York Times is liberal. So what if the Washington Times is conservative. What I am saying is I know that. I'm not blind to the NYT's or a Dan Rather. I can take Rush because he is not a reporter, he is strictly commentary. I am aware of how the media works.

What I am saying is - I don't work that way. I look at all sides and of course I have an opinion. I have read and heard Karl Rove far beyond it being anything new. The media needs Karl for their summer but I note that the lady that sits in for Olberman on Countdown at MSNBC asked a talking head the other night, "Why haven't we heard Karl Rove's name the last few days?" Well duh lady. The bombing in London erased a non news story just as 9/11 buried Chandra Levy. Oh and; before anyone accuses me of having inside information, the Karl Rove "non news" comment is because the Special Prosecutor doesn't have him as a figure in the investigation so I go with the Special Prosecutor's word.

You don't have to tell me what liberal or conservative news organizations do but when it comes down to Air America and we only know what some conservative source says quoting anonymous sources; then is when I am willing to sit back and await the findings of the investigation. I'm going catfishing tomorrow and I wish Air America well. Don't like em much but whether the fish are biting is more important right now. :duel

Enron steals half a million from charities:

Yeah, like that wouldn’t be a headline the New York Times or Air America would run with before an investigation was over.

Pacridge said:

Actually I'm saying I have no idea what Champs was or is trying to say. Just thought it could be read at least two separate ways.

As for IE if you're a Liberal you'll love AA and if you're a Conservative you'll love Rush et el. I probably should put a disclaimer in there that says "a lot of..." Rather then making it sound like I'm referring to all Cons/Libs. I do think there are a lot of each who like or dislike Franken/Rush based on their political leanings. But, as you point out, that doesn't apply to all.

That sound better?

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I know you think I'm nit-picky, but yes, it does....

I think almost, if not all, people on this forum have said things like "All liberals" instead of "some Liberals" or the same thing for Cons.

I, appartently, don't show it, but I'm a moderate...I believe abortion should be legal & I believe in regulated gun-control. That puts me in direct violation with the "conservative" manual that some people believe exists. That also make me a target for Cons that think I have to agree with all 98 positions they hold...97 just doesn't cut it.

Overall, people here(including me) have said not to go "groupthink"....But we've all done it ourselves(including me).

The bigger picture, Pacridge...I've said it before and I'll say it again...Even though we're on different side of the aisle, you're "good people" in my book.
Saying "all" instead of saying "most" or "some" is small potatoes...

You'll probably be accusing me of the same thing by the end of August...and you'll probably be right. :2razz:

GPS_Flex said:

Enron steals half a million from charities:

Yeah, like that wouldn’t be a headline the New York Times or Air America would run with before an investigation was over.

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As I remember it when the Clinton's or the Clinton Administration had accusations you saw the same thing from the conservative press which is my point on the media no matter what side it comes from. The "reporting media" takes the story beyond the facts regularly whether it is conservative based or liberal based.

You may want to concentrate on Air America or the New York Times and you would be right in your statement. All I am saying is that our media is out of control and offers "commentary" couched in what they call "reporting". The two things are completely different. In the days of Cronkite a news anchor would have commentary at the end of the broadcast and it would be labeled commentary. Now commentary is the bulk of the broad cast and is not labeled at all.

I don't dispute that "any" media outlet runs with headlines or stories based on incomplete facts or investigations. I am saying I don't and I could care less what media outlet, conservative or liberal, has to give in the way of their opinion until that investigation is done and the facts are in. Sure, I form my own opinions and some are based upon my own bias for an issue or belief but, to base guilt on something the media says is like playing marbles. Sometimes you hit the mark and sometimes you don't.

Here's an example of the "news". Rita Cosby, formerly of the Fox News Channel has a new program coming to MSNBC. I don't know whether she will be liberal, moderate or conservative. What I do know that in her promo for the show, in her own words she says, "We will break the news. We will make the news." Says it all to me. A journalist that will continue the bent of the media and confuse reporting with creation. Still, I'll watch, maybe.

Bottom line? I don't let the media make up my mind whether I feel conservative or liberal about a topic or whether I agree with one side or another. I agree with whom I do because I have made up my mind. :duel

cnredd said:

I believe abortion should be legal...

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Why is that?

Not that it has anything to do with Air America but I am Pro Life and I believe a woman should have the right to choose. I'm not the pregnant one and don't think I have the right to make the decision for the one that is. When it comes to one's own body I believe if you have the right to say DNR for yourself then a woman has the right to say DND. :duel

cnredd said:

...I believe abortion should be legal

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Fantasea said:

Why is that?

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I answered your question in "Abortion - My take on the abortion issue."
This is the wrong thread for that...

It IS the right thread for 26 X World Champs to prove he's not complete liar in the eyes of this forum...Let's review...

This what Champ's posted to me...

26 X World Champs said:

I think your comments are full of crap. I think you purposely try to hurt people who disagree with you. That's not cool, I think it's proof positive of all around ignorance.

I'm sure you can since it seems that every post that I've read from you contains some sort of personal attack or some sort of backslapping for a previous post's personal attack.

The respect generated by that type of post equals the level of intelligence it takes to write it, which is zero IMHO.

How come when you're asked to provide proof for the blustery claims that you make you never produce proof? How come instead you choose to make, using your words, "snide comments"? Is it that you're unable to make any points that are truthful so instead of admitting you were wrong you attack the person who proved you wrong?

That is how I interpret your posts, but that is just MHO.

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Then he posted this right in this thread the VERY NEXT DAY...Post #81...

26 X World Champs said:

You are CORRECT, I agree wholeheartedly.

I will again reiterate my earlier post that I was referring to most of the Conservatives in THIS community who want Air America off the air because of their distaste for Liberals.In the world outside of this community people from all walks of life condemn each other, it is not limited to one side or the other.

I've never called for anyone's censorship, that is unAmerican. I simply prefer to tune them out if I do not want to get my blood boiling....

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Here was my response to that accusation...Post #84...

....I think now would be an EXCELLENT time for YOU to provide sources of your "blustery" claim that "most of the Conservatives in THIS community who want Air America off the air because of their distaste for Liberals." You've already provided your explanation of "THIS"...which means this forum...

With MOST of them, obviously, this would end up being a double digit number...But I'm SUCH a nice guy, I'm going to let you off the hook by seeing if you could produce 5(five). If you would like to, I will provide 5 conservative sources that say they WANT Air America to continue....but only if you ask nice...

C'mon, big guy....You accuse others of not providing sources....Now's the time to shut me up and prove that you're a man of your words...

If you find FIVE sources of your claim that "most of the Conservatives in THIS community who want Air America off the air because of their distaste for Liberals.", then I will publicly apologize and leave you alone....

Otherwise, everyone on this debate site will see that you are a li.....a big, dumb lia....a big dumb, ignorant lia....C'mon...don't make me say it....

Five sources....time's a tickin'....

Since that time, I've been nice enough to bring that challenge down to four sources...I've also publicly let it be known that he may provide sources used from "Conservatives who wants AirAmerica off of the air" for ANY eason; not just for their "distaste in Liberals"...That should open the field wide open for him.

It's been two days since...He's responded to other catagories, so he HAS been to this website...But he hasn't posted any comments in this thread, because he knows he just got caught. He made an accusation that he can't back up with sources...

Now, that, in itself is not the worst thing in the world...we've probably all have done it ourselves...

But to belittle other people on this forum for his stated reasons...and then not live up to his own stated reasons...the height of hypocracy and audacity.

This is what he has written to others since my challenge has been posted...

In the thread "Today's News - "Political Correctness" killed the Columbia astronauts"...Post #99...

26 X World Champs said:

When someone is making a factual claim rather than expressing an opinion it is common courtesy on this site to post a link to substantiate one's claim.

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In the same thread 30 minutes earlier...Post 93...

26 X World Champs said:

Have you ever considered posting a link to prove of what you claim?

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In the thread..."Todays News - Who is an American"...Post #25...

26 X World Champs said:

You're right Simon, his comment was bullshit. The mere fact that he cannot produce any evidence whatsoever is proof enough

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I've included the post numbers so anyone can check these statments out and see that the comments are not taken out of context.

So unless Champs can come in here and do what he accuses others of doing, I want everyone in this forum to see what a complete bumbling idiot he is and that he is simply "undebatable"...

Four sources Champs...or an admission you can't live up to your own words...

Just for the record, I want Air America to continue.

I see no reason under our Constitution or laws to take anyone from Howard Stern, Rush Limbaugh, Al Franken or Air America off the air. We are the ones that have the freedom to seek out what we want in the way of information or entertainment or even self punishment. Freedom is all we should consider when deciding what we want. :duel