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Abolish ICE

Abolish ICE

  • Yes

  • No

Results are only viewable after voting.
No. We have immigration laws and they need to be enforced. If congress think our immigration laws are too harsh or not harsh enough, then they ought to change the law. Congress passes the laws; the administration’s job is to enforce those laws. There’s a legal and right way to enter this country just like every other country in the world. Then there’s the illegal way which makes them a law breaker.
 
Gatsby said:
That's fine, I don't care what it's name is. As long as it does immigration and customs enforcement.
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I was completely against banning ICE for the same reason you stated. But imagery of agents dressed in black with no obvious identification whisking humans away. Well, there is no coming back from those depths.
 
Pyrite said:
Do not step outside your house if an ICE agent asks you to do so.
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It should have read, do not step outside your house if a masked man who is not wearing a uniform or sporting identifying insignia asks you to do so.
 
Scatty Kitty said:
What does that mean specifically? For example, if there is a town 50 miles from the border, does ICE have any sort of jurisdiction to operate in that town?
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Of course.
 
Josie said:
If no, please explain why and any other commentary you'd like to add to your answer.
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No. It's due process we need to worry about being abolished
 
Lol even Bill Kristol the neocon warmonger thinks we should abolish ICE, if you answered no to this question imaging being a bigger piece of shit than someone like that.

This is like living during Third Reich and arguing in favor of the Gestapo.
 
Josie said:
Not the cubed or crushed kind ...
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Agreed.

Josie said:
although crunching ice should be outlawed.
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Well that does it! We're never getting married.

Josie said:
Do you think Immigration and Customs Enforcement needs to be abolished?
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I think after this shit show of an administration is done, if we still have a republic, we're going to have a major bipartisan rethink of the entire Executive branch and all of its powers.
 
No. We need to stop the invasion of unwelcome foreigners.

Immigration needs to be approved and of those who can better this nation without the need of subsidies.
 
StillBallin75 said:
Lol even Bill Kristol the neocon warmonger thinks we should abolish ICE,
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What does being a warmonger have to do with immigration and customs enforcement?
StillBallin75 said:
if you answered no to this question imaging being a bigger piece of shit than someone like that.

This is like living during Third Reich and arguing in favor of the Gestapo.
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Is your position A) that we shouldn't do any immigration and customs enforcement at all, or B) that we should do those things but just change the name of the agency?
 
Felis Leo said:
If the only choices are either the Gestapo or no police, there is only one moral choice
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I would recommend not framing the choice to the voters that way, because I think you will not like their choice.
 
ICE has arrest powers anywhere on US soil, and is being used by the Trump administration to intimidate.

Yesterday masked ICE agents arrested the Mayor of Newark, NJ. and manhandled 2 members of Congress for protesting outside a Louisiana ICE detention facility. Intimidation.

The Tufts University woman arrested on the street by masked ICE goons was ordered released yesterday by a judge. ICE had no evidence of any wrongdoing. Intimidation.

White House deputy chief of staff Stephen Miller said Trump is considering suspending habeas corpus - the right of a person to challenge their detention in court.

We can see where this is all going. Dictatorship. The WH is in negotiations to deport individuals to Rwanda and Libya.

‘No one is safe’: New Jersey Congressman calls arrest of Newark Mayor a ‘clear act of intimidation’

Mayor Ras Baraka is now free after federal officials arrested him on trespassing charges during an oversight visit at a new ICE detention facility. One of the elected officials present during the arrest, Rep. Rob Menendez and MSNBC Legal Analyst Catherine Christian join The Weekend to discuss.
www.yahoo.com

Judge orders Tufts student's release from ICE detention: "No evidence"

U.S. District Judge William Sessions III in Burlington, Vermont, ruled that Ozturk was unlawfully detained in March.
www.newsweek.com

The WH says Trump is considering suspending habeas corpus. What would that mean?

The move to expel migrants would curtail a constitutional right to due process.
abcnews.go.com
 
ICE needs to be abolished. It was created to help guard against foreign threats. I gather from their focus on deporting perfectly reasonable people who pose no threat, their work is done.
 
I'm a little perplexed by the number of people who have strong opinions about the name of the agency that does immigration and customs enforcement. Call it ICE, or call it something else, whatever.

If the "Abolish ICE" slogan blows up, it's going to be just as much of a fiasco for liberals as "Defund the police" was. If you're going to say "Abolish ICE" and then go into a convoluted explanation that you don't actually mean abolish ICE, you mean change the name of the agency or shuffle its powers around to other agencies, then don't be surprised if voters hear the plain meaning of "Abolish ICE" and decide they don't want what you're selling.

Of course, if you *actually* think there should be no immigration and customs enforcement whatsoever, then that's a different matter. At least you are using the "Abolish ICE" slogan as people will hear it, although the voters are never going to support that.
 
No. ICE needs to stay. We need to reel them back into a legitimate LE agency. Take off the masks and fairly enforce immigration laws. Illegally searching American citizens homes and leaving them with nothing is just out of control.
 
Gatsby said:
What does being a warmonger have to do with immigration and customs enforcement?

Is your position A) that we shouldn't do any immigration and customs enforcement at all, or B) that we should do those things but just change the name of the agency?
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1) We shouldn't have any immigration enforcement at all (and before you say that's crazy we didn't have any immigration controls for the first hundred years of the country's existence - we had open borders). Even if you don't agree with that, most of the border control and deportation infrastructure we have now has only been built since the 1990s.

2) As pertains to ICE specifically, everyone who STILL works there as a federal agent has always been a Gestapo piece of shit and this administration in particular has unleashed them to do shit they've always wanted. If we are to have any sort of truth and reconciliation after the Trump regime, the entire agency needs to be destroyed and all of these people deserved to be jailed and never have a job in law enforcement at any level ever again.

3) I am OK with customs enforcement as it pertains to biosecurity and invasive species, that's about it. We don't need ICE to do that.

I believe in the inherent right to freedom of movement, and that borders are essentially racist, anti equality, anti freedom, and a form of intra-class warfare in the sense that your money is being taken from you to oppress other poors while the real class war should be waged against the rich.
 
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bomberfox said:
There is nothing in between you are correct. Its time to abolish this damnable thug institution. They are brutalizing citizens on camera in Oklahoma.
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No immigration controls at all?

No thanks.

We have police brutality. The answer is not to simply not have police. The idea of not tracking who is in the country and rendering ourselves completely incapable of removing anyone who really is a problem is absurdist.



But then, these are days when an awful lot of people think the stronger argument is the one that is stated in the most nuance-free extremist terms.
 
StillBallin75 said:
1) We shouldn't have any immigration enforcement at all (and before you say that's crazy we didn't have any immigration controls for the first hundred years of the country's existence - we had open borders).
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We also had:
  • Slow, expensive, dangerous travel, which imposed a natural limit on immigration.
  • A regime of codified racism. Anyone who wasn't viewed as sufficiently white would be mistreated, if not outright enslaved. This also imposed a limit on immigration from non-Northern European countries (and even some of them were viewed as dubiously white).
  • No cities of note on the West Coast or southern frontier, imposing a natural limit on immigration from Asia or Latin America.
  • No movies, TV, and very little cultural connection between the US and most of the world. If a person in, say, Vietnam was even vaguely aware of America's existence, they would have no way to compare it to their own living standards and thus little reason to want to move there.
  • No Fourteenth Amendment granting people birthright citizenship. The rules around citizenship for people born here were vague and often left up to the states.
I don't think that's a world we want to go back to. And open borders can't work in a modern context where even the median person in a developing country could probably scrape together the money for a plane ticket and get here, in the absence of any border checkpoints or immigration controls. There are hundreds of millions - maybe billions - of people who would like to move to America. It's just not feasible to have open borders.
 
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Abolishing

Especially if Americans come to accept their sadistic brutality of people on the street. They already accept it in the camps where they hold 1000s of people that I find hard to believe represent a threat to our national security.
 
j brown's body said:
Especially if Americans come to accept their sadistic brutality of people on the street. They already accept it in the camps where they hold 1000s of people that I find hard to believe represent a threat to our national security.
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Is your position that we should stop doing all immigration and customs enforcement? Or merely that the agency needs to change its name, shuffle some personnel from Office A to Office B, and rebrand itself?
 
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