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Wolfowitz Apologizes For 'Mistake'

Middleground said:
Hmmm... I'm more of a whipped cream kinda gal, ya know. Hell, you can join in if ya want.
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Woo-HOO!!!!!! I'll be every straight man's envy...that's always a good time.

Whipped cream though...it starts to smell quickly. Don't even bother asking how I know. Just trust me...jell-o is much more sanitary. :mrgreen:
 

As far as people here and in this country I don't either it's the least he could have done for her. As far as what is going on at the World Bank, Wolfowitz is doing there like he did at the UN and is investigating corruption. China has already complained that he is "too vigilant" and want him gone so they and other countries can continue on what appears to be UN type corruption scheme.

FOX news is leading the way on this just as they did with the UN scandal which the MSM tried to cover up.
 

Well there ya go. By the way, that's twice today that we have been in complete agreement...is it a Friday the 13th thing or what? :2wave:
 

She was. Apparently, helped her land a "plummer" position. Was it deserved? Hmmmm... from a mid-level job to in line with Vice President. Ah, call me stoopid, but I'd say no.

And tell me Stinger... who's helping her more? Is it Wolfie who demanded that she get a stellar job review so he can promote her, or is it the bank who's paying her freakin' bloated salary?

I wonder how you'd feel if you worked at the bank. I doubt you'd be kissing Wolfie's NeoCon a$$. (how aprepo$)

Even Wolfie saw that he done wrong, but here you are, defending him.You are a twisted apologist.
 
jallman said:
Well there ya go. By the way, that's twice today that we have been in complete agreement...is it a Friday the 13th thing or what? :2wave:
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Must be the pollen in the air!:doh
 
Middleground said:
She was. Apparently, helped her land a "plummer" position. Was it deserved? Hmmmm... from a mid-level job to in line with Vice President. Ah, call me stoopid, but I'd say no.
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Based on what? And explain "in line with the Vice President"?

And tell me Stinger... who's helping her more? Is it Wolfie who demanded that she get a stellar job review so he can promote her, or is it the bank who's paying her freakin' bloated salary?
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I have no reason to believe she has not always recieved stellar reviews.

What is your true beef against her that you are so determined to have her head on a platter?

I wonder how you'd feel if you worked at the bank. I doubt you'd be kissing Wolfie's NeoCon a$$. (how aprepo$)
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And my wife got a appointed to a high position meaning I have to leave. Like it was unfair.

Even Wolfie saw that he done wrong, but here you are, defending him.You are a twisted apologist.
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He said he perhaps shouldn't have been involved so that people like you wouldn't try to make a political scandal out of something that isn't.

This isn't about Wolfowitz, it's deeper than that, you have just fallen for it.
 
Stinger said:
Based on what? And explain "in line with the Vice President"?
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From the article:

Cave asked that the board release all documents related to the issue, the same step that Wolfowitz requested last night. Among the documents, Cave said, is a 2005 memo from Wolfowitz to the vice president for human resources detailing the terms of Riza's outside assignment, including promotion upon her return to the bank from an upper-middle position to a level equal to bank vice president, "depending on the length of her external service." The agreement said the promotion would be subject to a performance review by a "panel whose membership would be mutually agreed" by human resources officials and Riza.



I have no reason to believe she has not always recieved stellar reviews.
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That's not the point. Not one iota. I got a stellar job review, but no damn promotion.

Did you read the article or is it too much trouble?

Bank insiders confirmed reports from the bank's staff association that Wolfowitz directed personnel officials to give Shaha Riza, his longtime companion, an automatic "outstanding" rating and the highest possible pay raises during an indefinite posting at the State Department, as well as a promotion upon her return to the bank.

Is that clear enough for you?

Hmmm... maybe I should start boinking my company President.

What is your true beef against her that you are so determined to have her head on a platter?
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What an asinine question. I could give a rat's *** about her. My beef is with Wolfie.


Wife got a appointed to a high position meaning I have to leave. Like it was unfair.
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Why would you have to leave? There would be nothing wrong with that, actually. What would be wrong, though, is if your wife--using her powers of position--decided that she would promote you on the basis that you boink her every night.

Gosh, I didn't think it would be that difficult to understand. You do understand the concept of conflict of interest, do ya? Actually, I think it's beyond you.


He said he perhaps shouldn't have been involved so that people like you wouldn't try to make a political scandal out of something that isn't.
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Can you link me to that quote? I did see it. But he did say this... straight form the horse's...oops, I mean wolf's mouth:

He had approached the gathering after holding a news conference in which he said, "I made a mistake for which I am sorry."

What part of that do you not understand? I don't think it can be simplified anymore. Why do you apologize for this man?????????????????? No matter how you spin, slice, dice, justify... he fcuked up. And he not waterboarded to come clean. Shesh.


isn't about Wolfowitz, it's deeper than that, you have just fallen for it.
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Have some more Kool-Aid, Zinger. Oops, I mean Stinger.
 

Sorry I thought you meant in the administration not at the bank. So why is this merely on it's face nefarious? It seems reasonable that she could reach that position during the same timeframe and that her seniority is being guarantied during her leave of absence.



That's not the point. Not one iota. I got a stellar job review, but no damn promotion.
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Well yes it is the point, you seem to assert that she was not qualified and that something was being done because she had a personal relationship with Wolfowitz, that he was using the opportunity to use his power to give her something. That is not the case at all.

Did you read the article or is it too much trouble?


Well I'd like to see exactly what the memo's stated especially when FOX news reported that the head of the banks ethics committee had written a memo to Wolfowitz congradulating him on how ethically he handled the matter. Again, this could be a pretty standard temp assignment clause.

Hmmm... maybe I should start boinking my company President.
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Well we don't know the extent of thier relationship but the fact is she left the World Bank perciesly so there would be no appearence that that was occouring. You are talking out of both sides of your mouth, had she stayed then there could have been a conflict of interest, she leaves and you STILL complain.


What an asinine question. I could give a rat's *** about her. My beef is with Wolfie.
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Sorry but this is about both unless you are just using this opportunity to try and go after Wolfowitz, his name in case you forgot, like the other member nations of the World Bank who are scared of his investigation.


Why would you have to leave?
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DUH, the same reason Riza left the world bank, what we are discussing you know.


I've really come to the conclusion that you don't really know what happened here. They were doing the RIGHT THING with Ms. Riza leaving the World Bank so that she would not be a subordinate of Wolowitz, now why should she suffer for doing the right thing. An arraignment was being worked out so that she would not lose any seniority when she returned, the only question is why did the job at State pay so much more than the job at the World Bank, which could simply be a matter of the US government paying too much.


What part of that do you not understand? I don't think it can be simplified anymore. Why do you apologize for this man?????????????????? No matter how you spin, slice, dice, justify... he fcuked up. And he not waterboarded to come clean. Shesh.
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So what? Nothing illegal or nefarious AT ALL.



Have some more Kool-Aid, Zinger. Oops, I mean Stinger.
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Do you know how immature it looks when you have to make up names for people?

What this is about is several member countries coming under his scurtiney, like when he was at the UN and exposed the corruption there, and getting scared about it and dragging this up to try and get rid of him. You think this non-issue is more important than that?
 
Stinger, you cannot reason impartially. Nothing you write I take in a serious way because you are clearly partisan. I've seen it time-and-time again. Even if you might make a valid point, I will take it with a grain of salt. It is fruitless to try to debate and reason with you, so I'm going to back down from this debate. I stand by what I've written, but I hate wasting time.
 
Middleground said:
Stinger...........
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I'm sorry your ad homimen doesn't fool anyone.

This is just another phony issue. Wait for the Dems to start demanding everyones emails and testimony under oath just to see if the can trap someone, or keep the MSM harping on what is nothing. The fact is we should all be concerned the MSM should be reporting of what is really going on at the World Bank.
 

Maybe this will explain it a little better

""Wolfowitz told the group's human resources director to lift Riza's salary to $180,000, with further guaranteed increases of about 8 percent a year, according to a memo released by the board. At the end of Wolfowitz's five-year term, she was to be offered a promotion to the level of director, with a further promotion to vice president should Wolfowitz stay longer.

After her first annual raise, Riza earned $193,590 in her State Department job, free of income taxes because she isn't a U.S. citizen. The raises were justified by the disruption to Riza's World Bank career that would be caused by her transfer, according to the memo.



Wolfowitz depicted his decision to promote Riza as a good- faith effort to carry out recommendations of the board's ethics committee. Still, ``I take full responsibility for the details,'' he said this week, and appealed for understanding of a ``painful personal dilemma.''



Riza, in her memo to the board, said she never wanted to leave the bank. She described the ``professional, physical and psychological damage'' she had suffered and said the people who had leaked details of the arrangement should be held responsible for violating confidentiality rules.


``I have now been victimized for agreeing to an arrangement that I have objected to and that I did not believe from the outset was in my best interests,'' wrote Riza, who is a U.K. citizen.""



http://news.yahoo.com/s/bloomberg/20070414/pl_bloomberg/aupndxy5gaei_1



So you would have been happier if they had just told her to take a hike? Tough luck. You keep posting who you're going to start screwing a bank president so you can get the same treatement, well is that the kind of treatment you'd like to receive. Someone you're having an above board personal relationship with, you're just dating him, gets a job above you at you place of employment and you have to leave because of it so they just show you the door?



Let me ask you this what if she had received special treatment BECAUSE she was engaged in sexual activity with the boss, treatment you don't get because you don't. Do you believe you would have cause to file a civil action against the boss? What if he brought you into a room and groped you and asked you to give him sexual favors, while you were on the job, do you think you would have a cause to bring an action against him?
 

And you still dont grasp the idea of conflict of interest or nepotisim. The bold part says it all.

Wolfowitz should have never been involved in discussing her "package", let alone dictating it. The conflict of interest and nepotisim is clear and disgusting.

Yes there was a clear conflict of interest between her and Wolfowitz and it sucked that one had to go. I got no problem nore do most critics with that fact. Hell I am glad that she got such a good deal, but the problem comes when we learn that the deal was dictated/ordered by her lover!

That is the problem. Wolfowitz was directly involved in the dealings, which he has admitted, and that was exactly what the board was attempting to avoid.. that he could be accused of things like favoritisim, corruption and worse.

Love does stupid things no doubt about that, but this was brain dead to say the least. He should have known better and should suffer the consquences.
 
PeteEU said:
And you still dont grasp the idea of conflict of interest or nepotisim. The bold part says it all.
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That was what was negotiated with the ethics committee.

Wolfowitz should have never been involved in discussing her "package", let alone dictating it. The conflict of interest and nepotisim is clear and disgusting.
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Perhaps in hindsite, but everything was run through the ethcis committee and they approved.

Yes there was a clear conflict of interest between her and Wolfowitz and it sucked that one had to go. I got no problem nore do most critics with that fact.
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There is one here who sures has a problem with it.

Hell I am glad that she got such a good deal, but the problem comes when we learn that the deal was dictated/ordered by her lover!
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The ethics committee reccomended it and had not problem and they could have amended it.

"Wolfowitz depicted his decision to promote Riza as a good- faith effort to carry out recommendations of the board's ethics committee. Still, ``I take full responsibility for the details,'' he said this week, and appealed for understanding of a ``painful personal dilemma.''"

Love does stupid things no doubt about that, but this was brain dead to say the least. He should have known better and should suffer the consquences.
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Suffer what for what? The head of the ethics committed commended them both for their professionalism in handling the matter and invited them over for dinner.
 
In the August 11 2005 memorandum, two sources told the Financial Times, Mr Wolfowitz directed Xavier Coll, the Bank's vice-president for human resources, to offer Ms Riza specific terms as part of a secondment package to the US State department.

These included a promotion, a pay rise above that normally associated with the promotion, and arrangements to ensure Ms Riza received exceptional annual pay increases. Only the promotion had been recommended by the board's ethics committee, two sources told the FT.

The terms and conditions were not approved by the Bank's ethics committee or its senior legal officer, then general counsel Roberto Danino.

http://us.ft.com/ftgateway/superpage.ft?news_id=fto041220071413511885

So what excuse are you going to come up with now, Stinger? Can't play the "Ethics Committee card" anymore. Wolfie should be toast.... if this is not a conflict of interest, I don't know what is. If I were a WB employee, I'd be frothing at the mouth.
 
Not to mention it seems that his girl friend was instrumental in shaping the Iraq policy.. she even got a goverment job from it.
 
PeteEU said:
Not to mention it seems that his girl friend was instrumental in shaping the Iraq policy.. she even got a goverment job from it.
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Jeepers... and she got a promotion? Must be nice to get a extraordinarily fat pay raise and really suck ('scuse the double-entendre) at your job. Cool.
 
So what? She was getting shafted, they gave her a good package for to compensate what she was losing by having to change jobs, it's not even that much and as Wolfowitz has stated within what he believed the ethics committee advised and in the end recieved their blessings.

What specifically is your beef here? Or are you just out to get Wolfowitz no matter what, you just want him out of the way?

This is a dead story, it's not going anywhere. You hate him, you wish no mercy on him or anyone associated with him, so be it.
 
Stinger said:
So what? She was getting shafted, they gave her a good package for to compensate what she was losing by having to change jobs
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She got shafted because her boyfriend accepted the position. Why is it you feel the bank should pay through the nose for that?

BTW, I had to laugh at "good package." I wonder what it takes to you get you excited, LOL. She got a raise 3 times higher than the national average! What's the WB's goal this year? Isn't it to assist world poverty? *rolls eyes*


it's not even that much and as Wolfowitz has stated within what he believed the ethics committee advised and in the end recieved their blessings.
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What part of:

These included a promotion, a pay rise above that normally associated with the promotion, and arrangements to ensure Ms Riza received exceptional annual pay increases. Only the promotion had been recommended by the board's ethics committee, two sources told the FT.

...don't you understand?

He DID NOT HAVE FULL BLESSING from the ethics committee. They were unaware of the monitary amount... especially the "exceptional annual pay increases" part.
 
Middleground said:
She got shafted because her boyfriend accepted the position. Why is it you feel the bank should pay through the nose for that?
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I disagree with your characterization of it.

BTW, I had to laugh at "good package." I wonder what it takes to you get you excited, LOL. She got a raise 3 times higher than the national average!
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You know what, people in her positions, ususally do, that's how they got there, not by only being good enough to make the national average.



Which is not what Wolfowitz said happened, let me know when you have some named sources.

...don't you understand?
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This was not about Ms Riza, it was about countries worried Wolfowitz is going to root our corruption at the World Bank like he did at the UN. Which side of that equation are you on?
 
Stinger said:
I disagree with your characterization of it.
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Fair enough.



You know what, people in her positions, ususally do, that's how they got there, not by only being good enough to make the national average.
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No way, Jose. Unless you're a CEO, or some high-level position in the private sector, it doesn't happen. Not to someone who has a high intermediate position. I would love to see the average raise number of other people within the organization. Is that why Wolfie was booed ya think?


Which is not what Wolfowitz said happened, let me know when you have some named sources..
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Two separate sources confirmed this. I believe them. You choose to believe Wolfie... bet I'm right.

This was not about Ms Riza, it was about countries worried Wolfowitz is going to root our corruption at the World Bank like he did at the UN. Which side of that equation are you on?
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If he's going to root out corruption, he'd better fire himself.
 
Stinger said:
This was not about Ms Riza, it was about countries worried Wolfowitz is going to root our corruption at the World Bank like he did at the UN. Which side of that equation are you on?
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I think that about sums it up. I still fail to see where this man did anything that I haven't done or hasn't been done for me or that a large number of professionals in any field haven't done for someone else.

This is all smoke and mirrors.
 
Middleground said:
Fair enough.
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Way Jose, she was not working for hourly wages forty hours a week, the comparison of her package with a "national average" is folly, of course she is at the top of the measure.


Two separate sources confirmed this. I believe them.
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Really? Who are they that you would believe them? Let's look at how some of thier stories have, shall we say "shifted"

FOXNews.com - Documents May Give Wolfowitz New Lifeline in World Bank Scandal - International News | News of the World | Middle East News | Europe News

"But FOX News has analyzed more than 100 pages of internal bank documents dating to 2005 that paint a far more complex portrait of the case – and suggests that the bank’s own ethics committee had known the terms of the settlement with Riza for at least a year.
The documents show that while Wolfowitz did indeed dictate the lucrative terms of Riza’s salary to the bank’s human resources chief, he also took steps to try and determine if what he was doing was right – seemingly trying to navigate his way through an arcane bureaucracy with a maze of unusual rules and procedures.
The documents also show that, while many board members have claimed that they only learned the details of Riza’s case – and salary hike — this week in newspapers, the board’s Ethics Committee has been fully aware of all the details since early 2006, when it conducted a probe and determined that the allegations “did not appear appropriate for further consideration.”
The documents paint a more sympathetic picture of Wolfowitz and his efforts to deal with the situation than what’s been revealed in the press thus far. And they shine a light on the bank’s board as having far more knowledge of the case than members have let on in off-record talks with the media."

And after Wolfowitz tried to recluse himself of authority over here so she could remain the ethics committe said no that just won't work so they came up with.



"

But the chairman of the bank’s ethics committee at the time, Ad Melkert, wrote back that bank rules prevented such an arrangement. (Melkert, a former Dutch politician, is now the No. 2 official at the United Nations Development Program.)
To solve the dilemma, Melkert suggested three options: External service at another agency (with Riza remaining on the bank’s payroll, along with a promotion to make up for her sudden career predicament), a re-assignment to a bank unit that didn’t fall under Wolfowitz’s domain (an unlikely option, since there were very few such spots), or a separation agreement with a lump-sum payment that would probably have given Riza up to $66,000, according to the documents.
“A larger payment could be made at managerial discretion,” according to a document identified as an “Ethics Committee Discussion.”
The ethics committee left it to the bank’s management to work out the details of Riza’s deal, after which it would inform the full board that the matter was resolved."

And the ethics committee agreed she needed to be compensated above and beyond for the interruption in her career.


"The documents also show that the ethics committee was sensitive to the need to compensate Riza for her trouble, which she hardly brought on herself. In a memo from Melkert to Wolfowitz on July 27, 2005, the ethics committee chairman proposed “that management [Wolfowitz] provide some form of additional personal benefit to offset the negative career impact of the staff member [Riza]…Possible benefits include promotion, or additional salary increase.”"


And when the whole thing was questioned the ethic committed looked at it all once again and found no foul.


Click here for February 2006 letter to Wolfowitz from Ethics Committee dismissing Riza allegations



So your unnamed sources versus named and documented sources.



Which is it and why?




If he's going to root out corruption, he'd better fire himself.
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How did he personally gain? Was it corruption when Bill Clinton tried to pressure then UN Representative Richardson to give is illicit girlfriend and job she was not even qualified for?

The fact is Wolfowitz was the one who uncoverd the UN/Saddam bribery and corruption and now he is going to do the same at the World Bank, why do you oppose that?
 
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He has lost the trust and respect of bank staff at all levels, provoked a rift among senior managers, developed tense relations with the board, damaged his own credibility on good governance -- his flagship issue -- and alienated some key shareholders at a time when their support is essential for a successful replenishment of the resources needed to help the poorest countries, especially in Africa."

http://rawstory.com/news/afp/Wolfowitz_must_quit_say_ex_World_Ba_04232007.html

What a shocker, eh? You mean it has developed a rift amongst employees? No way!

Spin it any way you want, Stinger. All I know if I were an employee of the WB, I'd be pissed. Only people that fcuk presidents and CEOs get raises like that.
 
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