Why I Can No Longer Call Myself an Evangelical Republican

[Oreo]

There are times in life when the institutional ground underneath you begins to crumble — and with it, longstanding attachments. Such is the case for me when it comes to the Republican Party and evangelicalism.

I’ve been a part of both for my entire adult life. These days, though, in many important ways they are having harmful effects on our society.

The latest example is in Alabama, where Roy Moore, the Republican Senate candidate, stands accused of varying degrees of sexual misconduct by nine women, including one who was 14 years old at the time. Mr. Moore leads in most polls, and solidly among most evangelicals, heading into Tuesday’s election.

Yet the support being given by many Republicans and white evangelicals to President Trump and now to Mr. Moore have caused me to rethink my identification with both groups. Not because my attachment to conservatism and Christianity has weakened, but rather the opposite. I consider Mr. Trump’s Republican Party to be a threat to conservatism, and I have concluded that the term evangelical — despite its rich history of proclaiming the “good news” of Christ to a broken world — has been so distorted that it is now undermining the Christian witness.

Assume you were a person of the left and an atheist, and you decided to create a couple of people in a laboratory to discredit the Republican Party and white evangelical Christianity. You could hardly choose two more perfect men than Donald Trump and Roy Moore.

Excellent article--there's more at this link.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/09/opinion/sunday/wehner-evangelical-republicans.html

How could 81% of Evangelicals cast a vote for a man with no honor, no respect, no dignity, no decency and the only loyality he has ever shown to anyone was to himself and Vladimir Putin? How do Evangelicals stand up in support of a man that has been accused repeatedly of being a child molestor?

All over this country there were white male pastors that were singing Trump's praises during the campaign season. Including Mike Huckabee, Billy Graham Jr. & several others. Where did Evangelicals lose their way? Another good article. How the bible belt lost God and found Trump.
https://www.ft.com/content/b41d0ee6-1e96-11e7-b7d3-163f5a7f229c

By doing this, do they have any idea how many they have chased away from the teachings of Jesus Christ. How many refuse to go church today, because they so heavily supported Donald Trump. They instead, have made a mockery of the teachings of Jesus Christ. Yet today, there are Evangelicals in Alabama that refer to themselves as Christians supporting Roy Moore.

As the above article (How they lost GOD and found Trump) explains -most of their political interest is centered around abortion. Which is a 46 year old U.S. Supreme Court already settled issue. One that Neil Gorsuch, Trump's nominee, stated during confirmation hearings: That Roe v Wade is precedent in the Constitution, meaning set in stone.
Gorsuch to Feinstein: Abortion ruling is 'precedent' | Fox News



So are they really Christians? I don't think so. I think they're more red hat Jesus followers, than real Christians.

 

[Hawkeye10]

I remember one South Carolina highly esteemed evangelical who said something to the effect "When Trump talks what shows on his face is what he is saying, and I gotta say, that is damned refreshing", his way of saying that Trump was about the last honest man who was interested in serving us in Washington.

 

[Geoist]

I remember one South Carolina highly esteemed evangelical who said something to the effect "When Trump talks what shows on his face is what he is saying, and I gotta say, that is damned refreshing", his way of saying that Trump was about the last honest man who was interested in serving us in Washington.

That is the thing with narcissists. They are very good at convincing others of just about anything, even when they are blatant liars. That is because they do not have a conscience the way the rest of us do. Their lies are not betrayed through their body language.

 

[Hawkeye10]

That is the thing with narcissists. They are very good at convincing others of just about anything, even when they are blatant liars. That is because they do not have a conscience the way the rest of us do. Their lies are not betrayed through their body language.

Only if you are right that he is a narcissist, and I say you aint.

See the thing about conventional wisdom is that it is wrong a whole lot more than is comfortable.

 

[Crovax]

I remember one South Carolina highly esteemed evangelical who said something to the effect "When Trump talks what shows on his face is what he is saying, and I gotta say, that is damned refreshing", his way of saying that Trump was about the last honest man who was interested in serving us in Washington.

So all of these are truthful?

"I believe in universal healthcare" -DJT

"I'm very pro-choice. I am pro-choice in every respect." -DJT

"Hillary would do a good job [as president]" -DJT

"I support the ban on assault weapons and I also support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun" -DJT

 

[Hawkeye10]

So all of these are truthful?

"I believe in universal healthcare" -DJT

"I'm very pro-choice. I am pro-choice in every respect." -DJT

"Hillary would do a good job [as president]" -DJT

"I support the ban on assault weapons and I also support a slightly longer waiting period to purchase a gun" -DJT

Policy, Hell no one hardly reads Policy Papers anymore......Do you remember JEB! with his bookshelves full of exhaustively perfect looking and sounding policy papers....which he had a hard time remembering what was in them but damn it everyone was supposed to be all impressed that he had these books made ......and weren't?

I DO

 

[Geoist]

Only if you are right that he is a narcissist, and I say you aint.

Everyone who isn't a diehard Trump fan knows he's a narcissist.

 

[PleasantValley]

You have already been proven to be one to deny irrefutable evidence proving you wrong.
Feeling you are one of those infallible perfect humans makes any post or thread you create suspect on its face.
The rest of us bleed when cut, fart, and also make mistakes sometimes.
The best of us admit to those mistakes.
The WORST OF US, never admit to making any mistakes.
You know i can prove you to be in the latter group.

 

[Hawkeye10]

Everyone who isn't a diehard Trump fan knows he's a narcissist.

"Everyone knows...." being the most famous of last words of course.....

 

[Crovax]

Policy, Hell no one hardly reads Policy Papers anymore......Do you remember JEB! with his bookshelves full of exhaustively perfect looking and sounding policy papers....which he had a hard time remembering what was in them but damn it everyone was supposed to be all impressed that he had these books made ......and weren't?

I DO

Are you suggesting that Trump is too stupid to remember if he is for or against abortion, guns control, and universal healthcare

 

[Hawkeye10]

Are you suggesting that Trump is too stupid to remember if he is for or against abortion, guns control, and universal healthcare

I am suggesting that I tuned into a few rallies and I vaguely know about what is in his books so I always knew that what he was proposing was an opening position, and that he would figure out what needs to be done when he got to Washington, when he got inside to see how bad the damage was, and when he figured out what he had to work with.....which upon Nov 9th "NOT MY PRESIDENT!!!!!!!!!!" was not much.

I am sorry if Trump has disappointed you.

America has disappointed me.

 

[Aristaeus]

I remember one South Carolina highly esteemed evangelical who said something to the effect "When Trump talks what shows on his face is what he is saying, and I gotta say, that is damned refreshing", his way of saying that Trump was about the last honest man who was interested in serving us in Washington.

Trump has made over 1,600 false or misleading statements since he became President.

Donald Trump has made 1,628 false or misleading claims since becoming President | The Independent

 

[Hawkeye10]

Trump has made over 1,600 false or misleading statements since he became President.

Donald Trump has made 1,628 false or misleading claims since becoming President | The Independent

I cant imagine a more boring hobby than keeping count.

 

[Aristaeus]

I cant imagine a more boring hobby than keeping count.

When you tell as many lies as Trump, it's important to keep count. Do you want to retract your claim that Trump is honest?

 

[joG]

There are times in life when the institutional ground underneath you begins to crumble — and with it, longstanding attachments. Such is the case for me when it comes to the Republican Party and evangelicalism.



Excellent article--there's more at this link.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/09/opinion/sunday/wehner-evangelical-republicans.html

How could 81% of Evangelicals cast a vote for a man with no honor, no respect, no dignity, no decency and the only loyality he has ever shown to anyone was to himself and Vladimir Putin? How do Evangelicals stand up in support of a man that has been accused repeatedly of being a child molestor?

All over this country there were white male pastors that were singing Trump's praises during the campaign season. Including Mike Huckabee, Billy Graham Jr. & several others. Where did Evangelicals lose their way? Another good article. How the bible belt lost God and found Trump.
https://www.ft.com/content/b41d0ee6-1e96-11e7-b7d3-163f5a7f229c

By doing this, do they have any idea how many they have chased away from the teachings of Jesus Christ. How many refuse to go church today, because they so heavily supported Donald Trump. They instead, have made a mockery of the teachings of Jesus Christ. Yet today, there are Evangelicals in Alabama that refer to themselves as Christians supporting Roy Moore.

As the above article (How they lost GOD and found Trump) explains -most of their political interest is centered around abortion. Which is a 46 year old U.S. Supreme Court already settled issue. One that Neil Gorsuch, Trump's nominee, stated during confirmation hearings: That Roe v Wade is precedent in the Constitution, meaning set in stone.
Gorsuch to Feinstein: Abortion ruling is 'precedent' | Fox News



So are they really Christians? I don't think so. I think they're more red hat Jesus followers, than real Christians.

Think of it this way. The Democrats idolised and renominated Ted Kennedy to the Senate for decades.

 

[Hawkeye10]

When you tell as many lies as Trump, it's important to keep count. Do you want to retract your claim that Trump is honest?

In what thread did I do that?

Give me a link.

 

[Aristaeus]

When you tell as many lies as Trump, it's important to keep count. Do you want to retract your claim that Trump is honest?

In what thread did I do that?

Give me a link.

In this thread:

"his way of saying that Trump was about the last honest man who was interested in serving us in Washington."

 

[Hawkeye10]

In this thread:

"his way of saying that Trump was about the last honest man who was interested in serving us in Washington."

"His way of saying...."

He not being me.


EDIT: I mean I used to argue that long ago, but I am pretty sure that I have stopped....

 

[Port & Starboard]

Think of it this way. The Democrats idolised and renominated Ted Kennedy to the Senate for decades.

We'll cross that bridge later on.

 

[HowardBThiname]

How could 81% of Evangelicals cast a vote for a man with no honor, no respect, no dignity, no decency and the only loyality he has ever shown to anyone was to himself and Vladimir Putin? How do Evangelicals stand up in support of a man that has been accused repeatedly of being a child molestor?

Hillary.

All over this country there were white male pastors that were singing Trump's praises during the campaign season. Including Mike Huckabee, Billy Graham Jr. & several others. Where did Evangelicals lose their way?

Hillary.

By doing this, do they have any idea how many they have chased away from the teachings of Jesus Christ. How many refuse to go church today, because they so heavily supported Donald Trump. They instead, have made a mockery of the teachings of Jesus Christ. Yet today, there are Evangelicals in Alabama that refer to themselves as Christians supporting Roy Moore.

Probably none.

So are they really Christians? I don't think so. I think they're more red hat Jesus followers, than real Christians.

If they say they are -- they probably are.

But, as an atheist, that doesn't interest me, and I'm not sure why it bothers you so much. Keep in mind that the words of Jesus about the Jews (Pharisees, at that time) have been used to hunt them down and prosecute them for two millennia (children of the Devil).

I don't find anywhere in the Bible that an opposition to abortion is anti-Christian. Perhaps you could point us to that scripture?

What I think is that you're not really coming from a Christian point of view, or at best, minimally so. Because if I remember correctly, Christians weren't supposed to judge, and yet, you're on the lynch-Moore bandwagon. Oh wait, that is Christian -- I'm remembering now what happened in Salem MA a few centuries ago when a variety of females pointed their fingers and made accusations. I take it back -- perhaps you really are a Christian. Perhaps you should rethink your narrative, because, while you are pointing fingers -- three are pointing right back at you.

Fascinating.

 

[Hawkeye10]

We'll cross that bridge later on.

Now that THE GREAT CLEANSING is going after dead men too TED will surely get an asterisk.....somebody was lynching (Newts Term) JFK in the grave the other day.

 

[Hawkeye10]

Now that THE GREAT CLEANSING is going after dead men too TED will surely get an asterisk.....somebody was lynching (Newts Term) JFK in the grave the other day.

Now I see that I put this in a different thread, so I will drop it here so that I dont get in trouble for that last post:

NEWT:

These are people who grew up in a party which used to preach free love, which used to think that all of the hippiedom was wonderful, who used to think they were somehow representing the future, and now they have suddenly curled into this weird puritanism which feels a compulsion to go out and lynch people without a trial.”

 

[tosca1]

That is the thing with narcissists. They are very good at convincing others of just about anything, even when they are blatant liars. That is because they do not have a conscience the way the rest of us do. Their lies are not betrayed through their body language.

What's new with other politicians that served in the past?
What politician doesn't think of his own interest?

Some may have started out with noble ideas.....but like the saying goes, "power corrupts."

 

[Geoist]

What's new with other politicians that served in the past? How many politicians doesn't think of his own interest?

As you can see on my lean, I am a libertarian so there aren't many politicians I trust to put the interest of the people over their own. Trump is just the ego-driven politician on hyperdrive. What is different is that, in the past, most politicians had to keep their egos in check unless they wanted to upset the voters and get ousted. Trump supporters, on the other hand, eat up his lies and egoism. In their eyes, he could do no wrong so long as he sticks with the alt-right agenda.

 

[tosca1]

There are times in life when the institutional ground underneath you begins to crumble — and with it, longstanding attachments. Such is the case for me when it comes to the Republican Party and evangelicalism.



Excellent article--there's more at this link.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/09/opinion/sunday/wehner-evangelical-republicans.html

How could 81% of Evangelicals cast a vote for a man with no honor, no respect, no dignity, no decency and the only loyality he has ever shown to anyone was to himself and Vladimir Putin? How do Evangelicals stand up in support of a man that has been accused repeatedly of being a child molestor?

All over this country there were white male pastors that were singing Trump's praises during the campaign season. Including Mike Huckabee, Billy Graham Jr. & several others. Where did Evangelicals lose their way? Another good article. How the bible belt lost God and found Trump.
https://www.ft.com/content/b41d0ee6-1e96-11e7-b7d3-163f5a7f229c

By doing this, do they have any idea how many they have chased away from the teachings of Jesus Christ. How many refuse to go church today, because they so heavily supported Donald Trump. They instead, have made a mockery of the teachings of Jesus Christ. Yet today, there are Evangelicals in Alabama that refer to themselves as Christians supporting Roy Moore.

As the above article (How they lost GOD and found Trump) explains -most of their political interest is centered around abortion. Which is a 46 year old U.S. Supreme Court already settled issue. One that Neil Gorsuch, Trump's nominee, stated during confirmation hearings: That Roe v Wade is precedent in the Constitution, meaning set in stone.
Gorsuch to Feinstein: Abortion ruling is 'precedent' | Fox News



So are they really Christians? I don't think so. I think they're more red hat Jesus followers, than real Christians.

I think evangelicals are not supporting Moore, the person - they are supporting the desired senator, who will help advance Christian values.


I think, the evangelicals are looking farther down the tip of their noses when they supported Trump and now, supporting Moore.......

.........after all, as Christians who follow Christ, who are we to judge a person's sins?
Do we know what's in everyone's hearts?

Who isn't a sinner.....does that ring a bell?



Trump's policy aligns with Christian values.
The Democrats' policy aligns with Satan's.
How can it not when it pushes for all the things that are opposed to God's.
That's how a Christian would look at it...... wouldn't you?




As a Christian - I look at it as a kind of spiritual warfare that was mentioned in the NT.

Ephesians 6
The Armor of God

10 Finally, be strong in the Lord and in his mighty power. 11 Put on the full armor of God, so that you can take your stand against the devil’s schemes. 12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.
13 Therefore put on the full armor of God, so that when the day of evil comes, you may be able to
stand your ground, and after you have done everything, to stand. 14 Stand firm then, with the belt of truth buckled around your waist, with the breastplate of righteousness in place, 15 and with your feet fitted with the readiness that comes from the gospel of peace. 16 In addition to all this, take up the shield of faith, with which you can extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one.
17 Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.




Trump's already delivered the most important thing that was promised - the appointed judge for the
Supreme court.

For more to be done, it will be important not to lose a seat. That's the driving force.