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Why Do Republicans Hate The Troops?

RBLpolitics

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I know it's a loaded question but, it seems as though Republicans don't care how many of our soldiers die in Iraq in order to save face with a failed plan. "W" himself has admitted that Sadaam Hussein had nothing to do with 9/11. He also admitted there were no WMD's. So, 3376 fallen soldiers later,...we're still there! The administration keeps changing the reason we're there and Republicans keep falling for it...hook, line and sinker! Wake up! Give our troops a break! We can Save Lives by bringing our troops home.
 
Repubs are "followers" not leaders. So that makes Bush sort of like their God and like the little sheep they are they will follow and agree with Bush no matter what. No questions asked.
I would like to get inside the Repubs heads to hear what they really think of Bush.
Probably something like this:
"It seems like 20 years Bush has been in office. I can't wait for him to leave."
_________
Repubs HATE our troops? Well I do say that often but I have come to the conclusion that they don't really HATE our Troops, they just don't mind them being in harms way because Bush said "its ok.":roll:
 
Wow...this thread is flamebait. Nothing more.

:(
 
Wow...this thread is flamebait. Nothing more.

:(

It is definitely bait, but only to draw out discussion on a phrase used by conservatives against liberals for too long. From my view, liberals "love" the troops and want them home and safe, while conservatives "hate" the troops by supporting a policy that guarantees more of our soldiers will die.

Just my view...
 
It is definitely bait, but only to draw out discussion on a phrase used by conservatives against liberals for too long. From my view, liberals "love" the troops and want them home and safe, while conservatives "hate" the troops by supporting a policy that guarantees more of our soldiers will die.

Just my view...

You are making a blanket statement about all Republicans with your thread title and OP. That is the problem here. It doesn't appear that you are seeking to engage in a meaningful debate...it sounds like you are categorizing a group of people in a negative way in order to engage in a slugfest.

Just because the NeoCons and some republicans do it to the Dems doesn't make retaliation in kind right. It might feel good, but it is not a position from which to draw out anything meaningful.

I would also ask you to consider this. Regardless of why we went in and basically carpet bombed that country back into the third world, we are there. We did it. And unless we see this thing through there is a very real probability that we will create generations of enemies who will make it their lives work to avenge that wrong. Not just Iraqi's, but radical Islamists from all over the world.

Just a thought.
 
I would also ask you to consider this. Regardless of why we went in and basically carpet bombed that country back into the third world, we are there. We did it. And unless we see this thing through there is a very real probability that we will create generations of enemies who will make it their lives work to avenge that wrong. Not just Iraqi's, but radical Islamists from all over the world.

Regardless of why we went in? We are there? We did it?

I guess the difference is that you want to "see this thing through" even though, it seems, you might accept it was wrong in the first place.

I think we are creating more enemies by being there. More of the world hates us now. Remember what it felt like weeks after 9/11. We had the world's support behind us. I supported this president, but we have to face the fact that this administration went in with a failed plan. More soldiers are dying now but you guys think we're making progress! What has to happen for you to say enough is enough?
 
I'm going to level this challenge again... what is worth the loss of human life?


When the first skyscrappers went up it was a statistical fact that about 5 people were going to die every single time you decided to build one.


FIVE or more people died... every single damn time. Was 50 story building worth the price in blood?


How many people died making air planes into viable long range transport? If you decided that air travel was worth it, would that mean that you hate pilots or something?


What about the space program? How many people have died around the space programs all over the world? Failed launches... failed tests... the no doubt thousands of chimps wiht their brains splattered all over the cockpit... men left to die in cold vacuum... mothers and fathers exploding on take off... their children never to know the embrace of their parent ever again. If you decided to say it was worth it... does that mean you hate astronauts?



The construction workers volunteered for the job. They knew the risks and the work they did benefited everyone. What's more the vast majority of them worked until they were old and gray without any major injuries.

The astronauts volunteered for the job. They knew the risks and the work they did benefited everyone. What's more the vast majority of them retire from the profession without any major injuries.

Our soldiers volunteered for the job. They knew the risks and the work they did benefited everyone. What's more the vast majority of them retire from the military without any major injuries.


I ask you... do you want to live in a society that never risks even the lives of willing volunteers? Would you like to live in a society where no building is over 4 stories high... where no dangerous research is ever done no matter the benefits... where no war is ever worth fighting because all war has it's causalities?


This is the failure of your argument. It puts too few qualifiers on it's judgments and takes no consideration for the fact that these men and women chose to serve.


They are with few exceptions patriots and those that aren't have no business being there. They are our champions. Our heros. They go into fire and ash... to fight for this republic. And we will use them. Not abuse them... not discount them... not take them for granted... not treat them like poker chips in a game. We will out fit them with the finest hardware in the world. Designed by the finest military engineers in the world. We will give them the best training of any military force in the world. They will be backed up with air support, sea support, and vast land based logistical networks to see that they get what they need when they need it. Death from above? Point your laser GPS target painter and say "die" into a radio. It goes on and on... The american people are supporting the troops. There might be political wavering but the muscle of the country remains behind the troops. Our champions will not give up their blood easily sir. Often I'm quiet sure the enemy has realized exactly how expensive trying to take american blood really is... Typical attempts yield NO american dead and perhaps 30-200 enemy dead. That's a hard lesson for the enemy... and one that should be taught without mercy. It is in the interest of this people to see to it that our enemies are defeated utterly. Our enemies cry "death to america"... their cries have not gone unheard... and they shall be answered with thunder and lightening.
 
Regardless of why we went in? We are there? We did it?

I guess the difference is that you want to "see this thing through" even though, it seems, you might accept it was wrong in the first place.

I think we are creating more enemies by being there. More of the world hates us now. Remember what it felt like weeks after 9/11. We had the world's support behind us. I supported this president, but we have to face the fact that this administration went in with a failed plan. More soldiers are dying now but you guys think we're making progress! What has to happen for you to say enough is enough?

Do you know what happens to that country if we pull out now? Have you thought about it? Get back with me on your answer please.
 
Our soldiers volunteered for the job. They knew the risks and the work they did benefited everyone. What's more the vast majority of them retire from the military without any major injuries.


I ask you... do you want to live in a society that never risks even the lives of willing volunteers? Would you like to live in a society where no building is over 4 stories high... where no dangerous research is ever done no matter the benefits... where no war is ever worth fighting because all war has it's causalities?


Exactly! )


While people may or may not agree with the war, you can't blame Republicans for the whole thing. Don't forget there are Democrats in congress, too. I know people on every side who are split on the war. Not all Republicans are brain-washed war lovers and not all democrats are pacifist hippies.

So okay then, we are there and right now there is nothing we can do about it but finish the job, the one those people volunteered to do, and then leave. I do think we need to set a time table and pull out soon, but we can't just up and leave.
 
I know it's a loaded question but, it seems as though Republicans don't care how many of our soldiers die in Iraq in order to save face with a failed plan. "W" himself has admitted that Sadaam Hussein had nothing to do with 9/11.

He never said there was what there was infact was a connection between AQ and Saddam.

He also admitted there were no WMD's.

Well everyone has the right to be wrong even the President, but the truth of the matter is that we have found 500 sarin filled binary warheads with indefinate shelflives and some of these warheads have even found their way into the hands of the insurgency, luckily though they did not know how to mix the precursors before detonation.

So, 3376 fallen soldiers later,...we're still there! The administration keeps changing the reason we're there and Republicans keep falling for it...hook, line and sinker!

Umm no actually it is the Democrats who have spread the myth that WMD was the only reason for the war, there were actually numerous reasons listed in the AUMF against Iraq including bringing Democracy to Iraq and ending Saddam's brutal repression of his people.

Wake up! Give our troops a break! We can Save Lives by bringing our troops home.

I love leftist newspeak, routing for our troops to win the war is "hating the troops," but hoping against hope that they surrender and fail in their mission is "supporting the troops." Got to love that logic. :roll:
 
Remember what it felt like weeks after 9/11. We had the world's support behind us.

Ya except for all the people dancing in the streets and cheering, and the only countries that really had our back are those countries currently aiding in the war in Iraq all the others were giving their faux sympathies.
 
So okay then, we are there and right now there is nothing we can do about it but finish the job, the one those people volunteered to do, and then leave. I do think we need to set a time table and pull out soon, but we can't just up and leave.
If you set a time table you tell the enemy too much.


you stay until the job is done.
 
I think it's time to admit the obvious.

We see it so often in public - in private. Everybody does it - so it must be true.........................................

Two wrongs do make a right. :mrgreen:
 
Do you know what happens to that country if we pull out now? Have you thought about it? Get back with me on your answer please.

The civil war will continue, but no Americans will die?
 
The civil war will continue, but no Americans will die?
no, it will spin out of control, we'll lose most of the progress we've made, and then we'd have to go back in to stop the civil war.


Don't kid yourself... if we leave and Iraq falls apart then we'll be going right back in.


If you care about american life, then hold the line now. It will cost more american life if we turn our back on the enemy.
 
Karmashock,

Your comparisons are ludicrous! This war is not for advancements in science, aviation and engineering!

These heroes that have volunteered to serve, should only be sent into harms way when absolutely necessary. This war was not necessary at this time.
 
no, it will spin out of control, we'll lose most of the progress we've made, and then we'd have to go back in to stop the civil war.

It's already out of control. What progress? More Americans are dying now than before!
 
I know it's a loaded question but, it seems as though Republicans don't care how many of our soldiers die in Iraq in order to save face with a failed plan. "W" himself has admitted that Sadaam Hussein had nothing to do with 9/11. He also admitted there were no WMD's. So, 3376 fallen soldiers later,...we're still there! The administration keeps changing the reason we're there and Republicans keep falling for it...hook, line and sinker! Wake up! Give our troops a break! We can Save Lives by bringing our troops home.


Q) Where do religious terrorists come from?
A) The cancer of religious terrorism grows where socio-economic conditions are poor; governments are repressive and unable to provide essential social services, such as providing adequate oversight of their educational system….or have allowed / sanctioned Radical religious curricula.

This can be true for all religions and all cultures. It was true for Christianity in Europe in the 16th century. And it is true today for Islam in the Middle East.

Frustrated by the complete inability to exert any discernible degree of control over their immediate circumstances, frustrated adherents of Radical Islam, goaded by Radical Islamic Clerics, will resort to terrorism as the only avenue to effect religious, social, political, and economic change. To compound this threat, the Qur’an and Hadiths support a potential for violence not found in other major religions. Now, not all Radical Muslims carry guns or strap bombs to themselves….the majority are the "sea within which the Radical Islamist terrorists swim." It is very obvious to all that Radical Islam is a precursor to terrorism. It lays the ideological and religious foundation for Islamic-inspired violence and, as such, represents a long-term threat to the national security of the United States of America.

Q) What did Iraq have to do with the 9/11 terrorists or Al-Queda?
A) Nothing.

The 9/11 terrorists came from Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates, Egypt, and Lebanon. Other individuals that are (or were) a part of Al-Queda come from Pakistan, Afghanistan, Sudan. Without the intelligence reports or the roll calls before you, it is a pretty safe assumption that these individuals come from all over the region. With most of all the Islamic terrorists belonging to the Muslim Brotherhood, Radical Islam is an intentional religious insurgency spread through a variety of means. This "War on Terror" (so wrongfully named) currently targets current generation of terrorists; however, unless the ideology that spawned them is also countered the long-term threat to the U.S. will exponentially grow with time. Armed with an ideological foundation, making the leap to Islamic-inspired terrorism requires only a charismatic leader for direction, continued social pressures to solidify the will, and the means (weapons, money) to conduct terrorist acts.

Q) But why Iraq?
A) Opportunity.

It is also a well known fact that the "House of Saud" are the lords of terror. They have used us as a scapegoat to get away with brutalizing their societies as they encourage the fundamental preachings of Islam. This is all in an attempt to protect themselves, but also to cast blame outward. Our greatest sin is that we have purchased oil on the cheap while turning our backs on their misery. It is true that Saudi Arabia has backed off significantly with regards to funding Islamic schools abroad, but the damage has been done. With Iran seeking nuclear power, Saudi Arabia and Egypt still trumping humane treatment with greed, and the Israeli/Palestinian conflict never ending, the Middle East must change. A brutal dictator that oppresses the most diverse population in the Middle East would do. And even a secular brute like Hussein knew how to manipulate the masses through religion as he demonstrated by launching into Israel during the Gulf War. An Iraqi Muslim government that honors the basic human rights of all sects while maintaining a democracy where all voices matter would go a long way for this Middle Eastern civilization.

Events like 9/11, Bali, Jordan, Somalia...organizations like Al-Queda, Hamas, Hezbollah....and individuals like Bin Ladden, Zarqawi, Saddam Hussein, Khomeini are symptoms. They are not the disease. The disease is Radical Islam.

This administration may "keep changing the reasons," but this is only because you chose to focus on the parts of his speeches that stated anything about WMD. Also, things became more clear as event unfolded (The War on Terror continues to define itself). Iraq, as a beacon for change was introduced before the United Nations before February 2003. The "War on Terror" is not just about chasing down terrorists. It's about changing the environment where this never ending supply of terrorists are bred.

Q) Then why not just take out Suaid Arabia?
A) Because we couldn't defeat Soviet communism by invading Moscow, nor would we destroy Radical Islam by invading Riyadh. And, of course, we love that black gold. But the oil won't last.



......In a nut shell.
 
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It's already out of control. What progress? More Americans are dying now than before!

This is always the case in war. More Americans always die after we choose to take a stand. Say we didn't opt to do anything of substance in the Middle East. Say we simply waited until later when more people could see that somehting has to change. Would not more Americans die after we decided to do something then?

Besides, Americans had been dying in the wake of Islamic Radical deeds for a decade before 3000+ died on our own land.
 
More Americans are dying now than before!
It seems your criteria relies strictly on what is happening today rather than on the future prospectus. Very well, let's play that game. With an immediate pull-out the body count would certainly cease, but cease only in the short-term. What you fail to consider in your body-count equation is the long-term component. An Iraq left to its own devices will not somehow miraculously transform itself into a benign and pacifist entity. Sans US forces in-country, its problems will rapidly exacerbate and increase exponentially. This inferno would enflame the entire Middle East. Then what? Your short-term saving grace position does not address this reality at all. Rather... it promotes such a reality.

If high body-counts are your criteria, then I cannot understand your position. Does it not make more sense to pay a price outright rather than charge it with interest due? Look at your words above and rethink your criteria.
 
It seems your criteria relies strictly on what is happening today rather than on the future prospectus. Very well, let's play that game. With an immediate pull-out the body count would certainly cease, but cease only in the short-term. What you fail to consider in your body-count equation is the long-term component. An Iraq left to its own devices will not somehow miraculously transform itself into a benign and pacifist entity. Sans US forces in-country, its problems will rapidly exacerbate and increase exponentially. This inferno would enflame the entire Middle East. Then what? Your short-term saving grace position does not address this reality at all. Rather... it promotes such a reality.

If high body-counts are your criteria, then I cannot understand your position. Does it not make more sense to pay a price outright rather than charge it with interest due? Look at your words above and rethink your criteria.


"If you fail to pay the butcher up front, you will pay in interest later."
 
The administration keeps changing the reason we're there and Republicans keep falling for it...hook, line and sinker!

YOU WAKE UP!

“The great rule of conduct for us, in regard to foreign Nations is in extending our commercial relations, to have with them as little political connection as possible.
—So far as we have already formed engagements, let them be fulfilled with perfect good faith. —Here let us stop.” (George Washington’s farewell address, page 143, “The story of the Constitution,” United States Constitution Sesquicentennial Commission, House office building, Washington, D.C., Copyright, 1937, by Sol Bloom.) I first read that when I was a kid, it was my grandmothers copy.

How dare you say I “keep falling for it...hook, line and sinker!”

When I voted for Andre V. Marrou it was because when Gorby said, “that is far enough,” I didn’t think the United Nations (of tyrants too) could be trusted to follow through, and history have proven that it was NOT far enough! We had no business going if not to finish it.

What is the reason I supported our troops being there, it is the same with me as it was in the beginning, to finish it!

As long as we had a reason to contain Iraq, as long as Saddam was in power and the Iraqi people were not enfranchised, there was a reason for this garbage:

July 1997: “Those who desire to face up to the Zionists conspiracies, intransigence, and aggressiveness must proceed towards the advance centers of capabilities in the greater Arab homeland and to the centers of the knowledge, honesty and sincerity with whole heartiness if the aim was to implement a serious plan to save others from their dilemma or to rely on those capable centers; well-known for their positions regarding the enemy, to gain precise concessions from it with justified maneuvers even if such centers including Baghdad not in agreement with those concerned, over the objectives and aims of the required maneuvers." (On the 29th anniversary of Iraq’s national day (the 17th of July 1968 revolution). President Saddam Hussein made an important comprehensive and nation wide address) President Saddam's speech on July 17 1997

February 17, 1998: “While speaking at the Pentagon on February 17, 1998, President Bill Clinton warned of the ‘reckless acts of outlaw nations and an unholy axis of terrorists, drug traffickers and organized international criminals.’ These ‘predators of the twenty-first century,’ he said ‘will be all the more lethal if we allow them to build arsenals of nuclear, chemical and biological weapons and missiles to deliver them. We simply cannot allow that to happen. There is no more clear example of this threat than Saddam Hussein's Iraq.’“ Bombing of Iraq (December 1998) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Text Of Clinton Statement On Iraq - February 17, 1998

February 23, 1998: One (“The best proof of this is the Americans' continuing aggression against the Iraqi people…”), Two (“despite the great devastation inflicted on the Iraqi people by the crusader-Zionist alliance…”), Three (“if the Americans' aims behind these wars are religious and economic, the aim is also to serve the Jews' petty state and divert attention from its occupation of Jerusalem and murder of Muslims there. The best proof of this is their eagerness to destroy Iraq…”)! http://www.fas.org/irp/world/para/docs/980223-fatwa.htm

The only way to remove that, was to end the lukewarm “liberal” arts of war of containment.

The Democratic strategy, and Wesley Clark’s containment of the Iranian bottle with the Saddam “cork,” was not an exit strategy.

We can Save American Lives in the short term by bringing our troops home (as if peacekeepers will ever go to Darfur before all the villages are burned), we can save the lives of Americans.

Live and let die!
 
"Violence begets violence."
only if you don't finish the job.


Do you know how much blood is on the hands of your anscetors? It doesn't matter who you are... we are all the children of kings and slaves... murders... saints... rapists... etc.


In fact, it's more probable that your ancestors were nasty then nice as the nice tend not to survive contact with the nasty.... unless they become slaves... which of course happened often enough... And remember... we are the survivors.


So why then are you not getting killed in your sleep by enemies your ancestors slew a thousand years ago?



Violence does not beget violence... hate begets hate. Violence as distasteful as it might be to your sensibilities often begets peace.
 
"Violence begets violence."

Quite true.

But another apt expression is this one, this one from that TV oil filter guy, "You can pay me now, or you can pay me later." So we can quote all homilies all day long, and none of them will change the fact that OBL and AQ have vowed to engage thru the US, mainly thru provoke and bait operations, into what he has called a "bleeding war". His objective is to exhaust the US until we no longer have the patience, fortitude or resources, whichever comes first, to oppose him. In this, he aims to replicate the Soviet experience in Afghanistan.

So we have a choice. We can simply withdraw from all of the ME and all areas of the world where Muslims are a substantial portion of the population. Or, we can fight AQ wherever we find them, and at the same time, try to bring representative government to areas and peoples where it is unknown, and work to raise hopes and aspirations to levels that will diminish the attractives of radical Islam to the youth.

We can't ignore radical Islam and AQ. OBL will not let us do that. We are left with "pay me now, or pay me later."
 
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