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Most Americans do not see a need for a border wall. There is no evidence it will be effective. There is little justification for the building and maintenance of such a structure. The fencing and security that currently exist have enjoyed strong bipartisan support. But Trump supporters seem dead set on forcing the other two thirds of Americans to believe the idea that this wall is essential. That there is a crisis of some sort without it. That we need 10,000 military troops there rather than 2,000 troops in Syria because the threat is so dire.
You aren't selling the wall to the rest of America. You are imposing it on us. You go down this road, then if you manage to get it built I could see it being torn down by your fellow Americans the next time the pendulum swings.
Here is your chance. Produce a coherent, rational, and evidence-based argument for this wall. Not the emotional tripe, but something actually based in fact. Convert some people to your cause since you seem to believe the wall is a worthy project.
Why are you shoving this wall down our throats?
Most Americans do not see a need for a border wall. There is no evidence it will be effective. There is little justification for the building and maintenance of such a structure. The fencing and security that currently exist have enjoyed strong bipartisan support. But Trump supporters seem dead set on forcing the other two thirds of Americans to believe the idea that this wall is essential. That there is a crisis of some sort without it. That we need 10,000 military troops there rather than 2,000 troops in Syria because the threat is so dire.
You aren't selling the wall to the rest of America. You are imposing it on us. You go down this road, then if you manage to get it built I could see it being torn down by your fellow Americans the next time the pendulum swings.
Here is your chance. Produce a coherent, rational, and evidence-based argument for this wall. Not the emotional tripe, but something actually based in fact. Convert some people to your cause since you seem to believe the wall is a worthy project.
I'm against the wall as I think there would be more effective ways. But to say that a wall would be ineffective is naive at best. Israel has a wall that is quite effective. Lots of properties all across the US have walls and fences around their properties. Hell, even the richest among us use walls to keep people off their property. And areas where walls have been built have shown a sharp decline in illegal immigration. Will it stop all illegal immigration? Of course not. And no one is saying that it will. But it would help prevent the majority of illegals that enter through the southern border from entering. Once that is done then we can work on other ways of preventing illegal immigration. I'd prefer to do that first, but its not happening that way. In the end the goal is to secure our country. That is the Job of our Federal Government. It's time that they did that instead of listening to bleeding hearts that often use emotional arguments rather than logic.
Q: Why are you shoving this wall down our throats?
A: Trump was elected in part on the back of this promise, he carries with him a Mandate.
I'm on record as preferring strong immigration laws fully enforced without exception, defining birthright citizenship as pertaining only to babies born of legal residents, immediate deportation without legal recourse for anyone entering illegally, and a permanent ban on amnesties. Doing this would preclude any need for a wall.
However, whenever I see an argument against the wall that starts with "There is no evidence it will be effective" I have to laugh at this fallacious point.
The fact is we are literally surrounded by walls in our everyday lives, and they prove their effectiveness by preventing and/or channeling access to whatever space is being walled in.
Of course no wall is going to be 100% effective as a stand alone defense. If there is something inside worth it to someone breaking in for, then the wall/barrier will also need dedicated defenses.
In normal life it would be security guards, police, soldiers, automated systems, or in the case of a homeowner that person themselves.
So arguing that no wall is 100% effective is disingenuous. Walls work as they are designed to, and if well defended then they work even better.
As for why one would want a wall along the borderline? For the same reasons any wall has been built, to prevent anyone not allowed from entering the premises without permission.
Oh? What about the walls in Israel? They seem to work pretty good. You live surrounded by walls - anyone breaking in to your place?Most Americans do not see a need for a border wall. There is no evidence it will be effective.
Sorry, I seriously doubt a coherent, rational, evidence based argument would make any difference to you because it's TRUMP proposing it. You don't care about logic or evidence or anything other than hate for Trump. I've challenged anti-wallers to provide an alternative to control illegal entry. So far: ::crickets:: We have fences or walls around military installations, we have walls around prisons, we have walls around rich liberal communities and seem to think THEY work, but a wall preventing illegal entry to our country and unnecessary deaths to children who have no choice and you guy get all gooey.CriticalThought said:There is little justification for the building and maintenance of such a structure. The fencing and security that currently exist have enjoyed strong bipartisan support. But Trump supporters seem dead set on forcing the other two thirds of Americans to believe the idea that this wall is essential. That there is a crisis of some sort without it. That we need 10,000 military troops there rather than 2,000 troops in Syria because the threat is so dire.
You aren't selling the wall to the rest of America. You are imposing it on us. You go down this road, then if you manage to get it built I could see it being torn down by your fellow Americans the next time the pendulum swings.
Here is your chance. Produce a coherent, rational, and evidence-based argument for this wall. Not the emotional tripe, but something actually based in fact. Convert some people to your cause since you seem to believe the wall is a worthy project.
A border wall can be effective. A border wall can cause more problems.
How it is approached matters. If it is framed in xenophobic terms, in a way which makes people who are here legally feel like second class citizens, it could breed hopelessness and feed recruits to gangs who are already here. That is one example of how a bad approach can cause the kind of problem which the wall's promoters claim they want to prevent.
His mandate is to make Mexico pay for the wall.
He promised taxpayers wouldn't have to pay for it. Now he is saying government will stay shut down until taxpayers pay for what he said we wouldn't have to pay for.
He has no mandate to blackmail us into doing what he promised we wouldn't have to do.
Israel's wall is 440 miles. The U.S. Mexican border is 2500 miles, and the logistics, not to mention the cost are a nightmare. You can't compare the two.
Why don't we just fine the piss out of employers and jail them if they hire illegals? We could even make money from it! You know the KISS principal!
Tijuana has a store with a pic showing a 32' ladder and one piece too. I think they will sell out.
You are over thinking this.
Most Americans do not see a need for a border wall. There is no evidence it will be effective. There is little justification for the building and maintenance of such a structure. The fencing and security that currently exist have enjoyed strong bipartisan support. But Trump supporters seem dead set on forcing the other two thirds of Americans to believe the idea that this wall is essential. That there is a crisis of some sort without it. That we need 10,000 military troops there rather than 2,000 troops in Syria because the threat is so dire.
You aren't selling the wall to the rest of America. You are imposing it on us. You go down this road, then if you manage to get it built I could see it being torn down by your fellow Americans the next time the pendulum swings.
Here is your chance. Produce a coherent, rational, and evidence-based argument for this wall. Not the emotional tripe, but something actually based in fact. Convert some people to your cause since you seem to believe the wall is a worthy project.
No overthinking.
Simple logic to easily dispatch your claim that what he is doing is in keeping with a promise which he had a mandate to fulfill.
Logic is easy for some of us.
Most Americans do not see a need for a border wall. There is no evidence it will be effective. There is little justification for the building and maintenance of such a structure. The fencing and security that currently exist have enjoyed strong bipartisan support. But Trump supporters seem dead set on forcing the other two thirds of Americans to believe the idea that this wall is essential. That there is a crisis of some sort without it. That we need 10,000 military troops there rather than 2,000 troops in Syria because the threat is so dire.
You aren't selling the wall to the rest of America. You are imposing it on us. You go down this road, then if you manage to get it built I could see it being torn down by your fellow Americans the next time the pendulum swings.
Here is your chance. Produce a coherent, rational, and evidence-based argument for this wall. Not the emotional tripe, but something actually based in fact. Convert some people to your cause since you seem to believe the wall is a worthy project.
Israel's wall is 440 miles. The U.S. Mexican border is 2500 miles, and the logistics, not to mention the cost are a nightmare. You can't compare the two.
Why don't we just fine the piss out of employers and jail them if they hire illegals? We could even make money from it! You know the KISS principal!
Most Americans do not see a need for a border wall. There is no evidence it will be effective. There is little justification for the building and maintenance of such a structure. The fencing and security that currently exist have enjoyed strong bipartisan support. But Trump supporters seem dead set on forcing the other two thirds of Americans to believe the idea that this wall is essential. That there is a crisis of some sort without it. That we need 10,000 military troops there rather than 2,000 troops in Syria because the threat is so dire.
You aren't selling the wall to the rest of America. You are imposing it on us. You go down this road, then if you manage to get it built I could see it being torn down by your fellow Americans the next time the pendulum swings.
Here is your chance. Produce a coherent, rational, and evidence-based argument for this wall. Not the emotional tripe, but something actually based in fact. Convert some people to your cause since you seem to believe the wall is a worthy project.
It panders to his isolationist base. Some know that it really won't prevent the inflow of illegals but they like the fact that it's a giant "middle finger" to brown people.
Keeping his word on a promise that people clearly cared about and thus formed part of the foundation for why we voted for him, which created a mandate.
....
The answer to that question is simple: As Obama said, elections have consequences, and Trump was elected on (among other things) building the wall.
I didn't vote for him, and would love to see Trump out of office as quickly as possible... however, on the issue of a border barrier (wall, fence, etc.), I support its completion and augmenting it with tech and human resources. The Democrats will find out that they are on the wrong side of history on this one.
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