AngryOldGuy
double secret probation
- Joined
- Aug 3, 2013
- Messages
- 2,917
- Reaction score
- 658
- Location
- Phx,Az
- Gender
- Male
- Political Leaning
- Very Conservative
hahahahahh good onemales models did them in
John F. Kennedy - 1961-1963
Lyndon B. Johnson - 1963-1969
Richard Nixon - 1969-1974
Gerald Ford - 1974-1977
Jimmy Carter - 1977-1981
Ronald Regan - 1981-1989
George Bush Sr. - 1989-1993
Bill Clinton - 1993-2001
George W. Bush - 2001-2009
Barack Obama - 2009-pres.
As far as effectiveness goes, I have to say Richard Nixon. Vision wise I like Kennedy, however because of his premature death I can't honestly state him as our best. For example his handling of the failure of the Bay Of Pigs Invasion.
Victory has a thousand fathers, but defeat is an orphan.
-John F. Kennedy
Your point is wrong. As the democrat president he worked WITH the opposition party to accomplish some extraordinary things. Those are the same characteristics that made Reagan a good leader. He was a smart politician. He knew when to say no, and knew when to say yes. We dont have a monarchy...the president is the EXECUTIVE branch. he helped work to ensure we had an effective LEGISLATIVE branch. He didnt fight it at ever turn and block it.
Where you lose it completely is when you claim Obama is a more effective leader. Seriously? He is childish, petty, ineffective, and weak.
No doubt Clinton benefitted from having an active GOP congress. Doesnt change the facts. He was able to work with them and knew when to go along as well as when to push back.He worked with them only after they forced him to. Remember the shut down? Reagan actually came up with stuff on his own and then got it done. Youre making my point exactly. All of the credit Clinton gets is because he happened to be there while other people were doing stuff.
No doubt Clinton benefitted from having an active GOP congress. Doesnt change the facts. He was able to work with them and knew when to go along as well as when to push back.
Lets see....lets compare Clinton's record with those that you revere as "Great and inspiring world leaders". I think the results speak for themselves.How anyone could ever say that Clinton was the best boggles the mind. Clinton made a mockery of the POTUS. He disgraced the office..........He could have been a good president but he blew it.
I don't believe questions like this are fair. The most recent 30 years is too recent to make a completely valid judgement... good or bad... on any President. To really know you have to see how their actions and policies shook out. What may have been popular at the time may prove to be a boondoggle, and visa versa.
You are attributing the lesson that bonehead Cheney gleaned from Reagan's Presidency, not anything Reagan himself said and/or may have believed.
That being said... was Cheney wrong? I believe his sentiment was/is repugnant, but let's ask what he meant.
Did he mean "deficits don't matter" as a matter of fiscal policy, and debt should be used to effect policy?
Or, did he mean "deficits don't matter" as a political consideration? That they could run up a deficit and not suffer political fallout for it. Shoot, maybe even gain politically.
Either one is repugnant, but if it is the latter one (political) then he wasn't necessarily wrong... in the sense that in spite of people's whining and moaning over the deficit and debt we still elect and re-elect politicians that are willing to spend us into oblivion. Especially Congress, which is where the real purse strings are anyway.
...and this is why I say we need to see how things shake out. I have long been a Reagan admirer, for the same reasons you state. But, he also greatly increased the drug war and gave us things like civil asset forfeiture which has caused uncountable damage since then. He may have won the Cold war, but replaced it with a war on his own people. Nothing noble about that.
Blast! A pox on the Generation X kids coming on and voting for Reagan and Clinton. :2mad:
STOOOPPPP!! :stop:
Don't be blinded by their relatively recent fame! Focus of the demi-god of camelot, John F. Kennedy!!! :sword:
A vote for Kennedy is a vote to the people!!! :ind:
LOL
Why wouldn't that be that Reagan was like a JFK-Dem since JFK came first? And yes, JFK was socially conservative, except with his own personal behavior. He didn't come around on civil rights quickly either, like Reagan. JFK may not be great to some, but he belongs in the poll, that's all.
nevertheless history will show that it was on his watch that socialized healthcare began and heralded the downfall of the nation which is the goal of the left so he will be the numbah one prez in their books years from now but it lead to WWIII which wasn't such a good thing.
hah yeah I'd forgotten about that, what with Syria & Egypt in flames and Iran boasting about their 18,000 centrifuges. Just like every Demonrat Presidential failure before him he will leave office with the foreign policy of our nation in a complete shambles. Before JFK got his head blown off he nearly got us into a nuclear exchange with the USSR LBJ handed Nixon Nam which he had already lost. Carter lost Iran to the Islamic whackjobs and looked like an idiot for 444 days, hah Raygun got the hostages released and for good measure won the cold war that Truman had started? Course ol Harry gave us North Korea so go figure. Hell Clinton took the wrong side in Yugoslavia and shoulda whacked Osama Bin Laden and saved us from the war on terror!Obama got the Nobel Peace Prize as a sitting President.
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