Whites Need Not Apply?[W:68]

DA60 · Aug 2, 2014

PirateMk1 said:
Yes actually. Racism by whites toward others in this country is nonexistent by most any degree of measure. Racism of ANY kind by ANYONE is exceptionally limited to may as well be nonexistent. What you call racism is simply not. Its called culture and societal dynamics. Believe me having been overseas I know what racism is, especially the kind employed by the powers that be. You want a really good example go to China or South East Asia or to any country in the Middle East, Kuwait and the UAE whom are supposedly enlightened with plenty of Western comforts should be interesting. To be blunt racism here is mostly a figment of peoples imaginations anymore, its mostly people trying to game the system or make a buck or some perceived slight. If you want the real deal, you need to leave the country. If a real racists showed up most people would be shocked A) B) they wouldn't know what to do. Social dynamics exist the world over, there are always minorities and they are always going to feel they are getting the shaft in someway. Its called life.

I missed the US part. :3oops:

Well, that is the most ignorant statement I have read on this site in quite some time.

It's also completely impossible to prove.

'rac·ism [rey-siz-uhm]
noun
1. a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.
2. a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.
3. hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.'

Racism | Define Racism at Dictionary.com

By definition, racism is a belief. It is impossible to know what the belief's of people you do not know is. So to accurately say that racism by whites in America is nonexistent, then you would have to know what EVERY SINGLE 'WHITE' PERSON IN AMERICA THINKS.
And since you cannot and do not know this, then your statement is totally unprovable, ridiculous and should be treated as such.

I know I will.

And don't bother debating me on this... I am not wasting one further second debating such a ludicrous statement as the one you made...life is WAY too short and your mind is clearly WAY too closed.

I pity anyone that feels as you do about this.

Good day.

AlbqOwl · Aug 2, 2014

rabbitcaebannog said:
Being individuals will say that no one has the same exact experiences, but with that said, black history does have its own special history hence the name black before the word history. I see nothing wrong with the recruiting of a well qualified black man to teach a course specific to Black American History if this community so desires.

Then you see no problem in recruiting a well qualified white man to teach a course specific to those of European ancestry? It also has it own special history that includes mostly the whitest of Caucasians. Don't you see what an evil slippery slope such a policy would create? If it is wrong to favor white people, then it is wrong to favor black people or vice versa. Such a mentality keeps the races separate, divided, and perpetuates a chronic racism that is never allowed to die. Until we can see skin color as of no more importance to who and what we are than is eye color or hair color, we are racists who promote racism.

joG · Aug 2, 2014

rabbitcaebannog said:
Probably, but what is your point? Local communities still have sway on school policies for the most part. I'd be surprised if this wasn't the case in CA.

If the teachers' ie the schools are paid out of general taxes, I do not see why the parents should have a say in teacher selection.
It is the local government making a decision and I would tend to think that they cannot make decisions to select according to color.

rabbitcaebannog · Aug 2, 2014

AlbqOwl said:
Then you see no problem in recruiting a well qualified white man to teach a course specific to those of European ancestry? It also has it own special history that includes mostly the whitest of Caucasians. Don't you see what an evil slippery slope such a policy would create? If it is wrong to favor white people, then it is wrong to favor black people or vice versa. Such a mentality keeps the races separate, divided, and perpetuates a chronic racism that is never allowed to die. Until we can see skin color as of no more importance to who and what we are than is eye color or hair color, we are racists who promote racism.

Such courses are different and often specific to race and/or culture. If I had a pick, I would choose a person close to whatever the course taught and may even have direct experience with the culture/history (for instance someone that had direct experience with the civil rights movement and is a candidate for teaching black American history.) It would be equally important for such a person to have excellent qualification for teaching. I see nothing wrong with trying to recruit such a person. Direct experience for any course is important. To pretend it's not and it's racist is not looking at reality.

rabbitcaebannog · Aug 2, 2014

joG said:
If the teachers' ie the schools are paid out of general taxes, I do not see why the parents should have a say in teacher selection.
It is the local government making a decision and I would tend to think that they cannot make decisions to select according to color.

Schools are decentralize for a reason. There is nothing wrong for people of a community to have sway in educational decisions.

Mason66 · Aug 2, 2014

ecofarm said:
No matter where a black person goes, they will suffer injustice/privilege in regard to housing, employment and the justice system. There is no escape.

Blacks must deal with injustice every day of their lives and in every aspect of their lives.

Denying the existence of racism in the US is nonsense.

You think there is no justice for a black man in America.

He is discriminated against no matter where he goes or what he does.

I would hate to go through life thinking like you, but of course it isn't true.

In case you don't know, everybody must deal with injustice to whatever degree in their lives.

Mason66 · Aug 2, 2014

JumpinJack said:
Smurfs are blue. Is that a minority color? This little fella' looks like he could teach cultural studies.

View attachment 67170560

I am not sure about that. He is kind of small.

I don't think the students would see him when he was sitting in his chair or even standing in front of the class.

Summerwind · Aug 2, 2014

AlbqOwl said:
Yes there is because it assumes a black person is more qualified based purely on the color of his skin. He isn't. He can be just as out of touch with the experience of many black Americans as a white man can be out of touch with the experience of many white Americans. It is as racist to think that all the people of a particular race in any given class will see things the same, think alike, or share a common experience as it is foolish to assume that a person who hasn't experienced something is incapable of understanding it. Cultural studies should not be about individual experience. Cultural studies should be focused on history and the effects of various dynamics and policy on society as a whole. The teacher should be competent to teach that, and skin color is 100% unimportant re whether he or she will be competent.

It's pretty doubtful, in the USA, for a minority individual, regardless of immediate familial socio-economic level, to be unaffected by racism. Just not at all likely. And if, and that's a REALLY BIG IF, by some chance a minority individual and his immediate family are lucky enough in the USA to have never experienced racism, they surely have an extended family and/or friends that have and therefore are nonetheless more aware than a white who has never and has no relatives/friends that have.

Kal'Stang · Aug 2, 2014

ecofarm said:
My position is not that injustice is "institutionalized", though I used that term once in trying to explain this concept to you. I wouldn't have used that term, but the concept seemed entirely beyond you and I was trying to make it more simple.

None of those links that I presented is of you talking to me. In fact you used it on a different poster in each of those links. So yeah...looks like you used it more than once and use it quite often. And as I said, I could bring up more posts.

ecofarm said:
Let's not use incorrect terminology any more, ok? I understand you were confused, and you are not misrepresenting me on purpose, it's just that you did not understand the concept. Now, let's see if we can correct this. Here is the proper term, please try to use it in the future so as to not misrepresent your opponent's position. I've told you this before, and you failed to understand, so I'm really hoping that you can grasp this and stop misrepresenting your opponent's position (which is really a scummy thing to do).

I understand the concept just fine. Its a BS concept meant to excuse racism by anyone that isn't white.

ecofarm said:
Let's remember that you do not get to decide how to frame my position incorrectly. Let's keep in mind that misrepresenting someone else's position is wrong. Here's the real deal, do try to remember this time:

Actually I have every right to define your position they way that I see it. You put it out there and as such it is open for criticism and rejection. In order to do such one must define it as defining is exactly what every single one of us do. Its human nature.

ecofarm said:
"Systemic racism"

I was trying to define systemic racism for you before, by referring to injustice/privilege existing in institutions, but the concept is not defined by institutions, it's defined by being systemic.

Sorry, but I am not responsible for what my ancestors did. :shrug:

ecofarm said:
Meaningless for two reasons:

1. Social power dynamics are not decided by numbers. They are decided by power. Numbers and power sometimes coincide, but not always. Remember: power, not numbers, is the important part.

Incorrect. Power by its very nature when concerning people can only be enforced due to numbers. Or do you not believe in voting?

ecofarm said:
2. Societal injustice/privilege is examined at the national or global scale, not local. This is important because it recognizes that whites can escape racial bigotry and blacks cannot.

Societal injustice/privilege can be measured just as easily locally as it can be measured nationally or globally. And fyi, blacks can move also to escape racial bigotry also. Let's make a bet. 1 months DP donation that I can name a place in which a black can move to in order to escape racial bigotry.

Mason66 · Aug 2, 2014

ecofarm said:
I'm in a good mood, so I'm gonna try to explain why that statement is apologism:

Superiority is inherent to bigotry. Pretending otherwise apologizes for bigotry in attempting to claim it is something other than false superiority.

Do you believe superiority is not inherent to bigotry? If that's the case, you're wrong and you need to re-examine the concept.

Do you think blacks do not think they are superior to whites?

Jaygodmedia · Aug 2, 2014

any human with a degree and said area of study and whom is a good teacher should be allowed to teach. it is 2014 not 1914 omg get over the racist crap already.

ecofarm · Aug 2, 2014

Mason66 said:
You think there is no justice for a black man in America.

False, I make no such claim. Again, you've run to absolutes and that's a pathetic debate "tactic".

He is discriminated against no matter where he goes or what he does.

That is true. Blacks do not get a fair shake in housing, employment and the justice system. Unjust discrimination is systemic and permeates our system. Racism exists.

I would hate to go through life thinking like you, but of course it isn't true.

I don't care what you think about my positions. This is not personal. I debate for the audience.

In case you don't know, everybody must deal with injustice to whatever degree in their lives.

Of course, but we're discussing racial injustice. Please attempt to maintain context. Dropping context is as pathetic as employing absolutes.

Mason66 · Aug 2, 2014

rabbitcaebannog said:
Being individuals will say that no one has the same exact experiences, but with that said, black history does have its own special history hence the name black before the word history. I see nothing wrong with the recruiting of a well qualified black man to teach a course specific to Black American History if this community so desires.

So, in your opinion, there should be 3 teachers for this course throughout the year, right?

The black man can teach about blacks, the Asian can teach about Asians, if that is possible, and the middle eastern can teach about the middle east.

Do you think that is plausible?

Mason66 · Aug 2, 2014

ecofarm said:
False, I make no such claim. Again, you've run to absolutes and that's a pathetic debate "tactic".

That is true. Blacks do not get a fair shake in housing, employment and the justice system. Unjust discrimination is systemic and permeates our system. Racism exists.

I don't care what you think about my positions. This is not personal. I debate for the audience.

Of course, but we're discussing racial injustice. Please attempt to maintain context. Dropping context is as pathetic as employing absolutes.

You use absolutes so that leaves the door open for me to do so as well.

I assume you have proof that blacks don't get a fair shake, whatever that means, in housing, employment and the justice system.

You are trying to convince people of something that is not there.

If that is entertainment for you, have at it.

ecofarm · Aug 2, 2014

Kal'Stang said:
Societal injustice/privilege can be measured just as easily locally as it can be measured nationally or globally.

Of course, but the only relevant measurement is the national or global scale when discussing societal (permeating) injustice.

And fyi, blacks can move also to escape racial bigotry also.

Not within the US. The option of moving to a ghetto is, in itself, racial injustice.

Let's make a bet. 1 months DP donation that I can name a place in which a black can move to in order to escape racial bigotry.

Dropping context (national) is pathetic. I'm not impressed. A black could isolate from society, any idiot sees this (BS) possibility.

Mason66 · Aug 2, 2014

ecofarm said:
Of course, but the only relevant measurement is the national or global scale when discussing societal (permeating) injustice.

Not within the US. The option of moving to a ghetto is, in itself, racial injustice.

Dropping context (national) is pathetic. I'm not impressed. A black could isolate from society, any idiot sees this (BS) possibility.

Why is that the measure when it is the local situation that affects the individual?

rabbitcaebannog · Aug 2, 2014

Mason66 said:
So, in your opinion, there should be 3 teachers for this course throughout the year, right?

The black man can teach about blacks, the Asian can teach about Asians, if that is possible, and the middle eastern can teach about the middle east.

Do you think that is plausible?

Rotating teachers would be a good concept since it is a district and they can be full time and rotate through schools as the course is being taught.

ecofarm · Aug 2, 2014

Mason66 said:
Why is that the measure when it is the local situation that affects the individual?

Because it's possible to change localities. Changing localities, for a black person, doesn't make a difference.

Racial injustice is avoidable for whites, it is not avoidable for blacks.

Mason66 · Aug 2, 2014

rabbitcaebannog said:
Rotating teachers would be a good concept since it is a district and they can be full time and rotate through schools as the course is being taught.

That disrupts students. Not a good plan.

Mason66 · Aug 2, 2014

ecofarm said:
Because it's possible to change localities. Changing localities, for a black person, doesn't make a difference.

Racial injustice is avoidable for whites, it is not avoidable for blacks.

So again with the absolute. There is nowhere in the country that a black person can live without being discriminated against.

Do you know any black people that agree with you?

rabbitcaebannog · Aug 2, 2014

Mason66 said:
That disrupts students. Not a good plan.

It doesn't disrupt students.

ecofarm · Aug 2, 2014

Mason66 said:
Do you think blacks do not think they are superior to whites?

I don't think all whites hold superiority to blacks, why would I think all blacks do so?

The important thing to realize is that a black believing he is superior to whites means nothing to white people at a societal, systemic, scale. Of course, a white being a racial bigot carries societal, systemic, impacts for blacks.

A black being a racial bigot means nothing to me socially. It will never affect my housing, employment or justice at a societal level. It's pissing in the wind, socially. The reverse, of course, is different. When a white is a racial bigot it carries a real, systemic - inescapable, threat to the minority.

Kal'Stang · Aug 2, 2014

ecofarm said:
Racial bigotry =/= racism. The former is an individual act, the latter is a social construct dependent upon and defined by social power dynamics. When racial bigotry is supported by national or global social power dynamics, it is racism. Without the support of social power dynamics (at a scale that permeates all sectors of society), racial bigotry is insignificant regarding societal impacts, and thereby very different.

This is why your whole argument is BS. You expand your position to encompass as much as possible while ignoring that social power dynamics in a small town can be quite different than even a whole nation. This is actually reflected in how the founding fathers of this nation set up our system of government. They understood what you apparently either don't know or refuse to acknowledge. Can you tell me why it is that a town can make individual rules/laws for itself? Why that town has its own "president" in the form of a mayor? Why it has its own "senate" in the form of the city council? Or to expand this, can you tell me why each state has its own "president" in the form of a governor? It's own senate board?

There is a reason that our country has so many layers of government. Can you tell me why?

ecofarm said:
I have a question for you:

Do you believe the preservation of the "white race" and "white culture" is a just cause?

Going by this....

ecofarm said:
Preserve as in keep other races out, not as in stagnate.

No.

Kal'Stang · Aug 2, 2014

ecofarm said:
Of course, but the only relevant measurement is the national or global scale when discussing societal (permeating) injustice.

Correction. The only relevant measurement to YOU is national or global. Because anything else would prove you wrong.

ecofarm said:
Not within the US. The option of moving to a ghetto is, in itself, racial injustice.

Are you saying that all blacks live in ghettos? I'm pretty sure that is racist in and of itself. And sorry, but you don't get to limit it to just the US. You brought up the word "global" and as such you must stick by it in all counts. Otherwise you are just moving the goal posts to suit your needs. Which is dishonest debate tactics.

ecofarm said:
Dropping context (national) is pathetic. I'm not impressed. A black could isolate from society, any idiot sees this (BS) possibility.

I wasn't dropping context. You specifically brought in the global aspect. Therefore you must accede to your own argument...or disregard it.

ecofarm · Aug 2, 2014

Mason66 said:
So again with the absolute. There is nowhere in the country that a black person can live without being discriminated against.

Systemic injustice is what it is.

Do you know any black people that agree with you?

Of course. For example: all sociologists agree... black, white or otherwise.

Whites Need Not Apply?[W:68]

Mutliple Choice - Check all statement you see as true:

A white person should not teach minority children.

A person of a minority race cannot teach white children.

Race is not a factor on a person's competency to teach anything.

Making the race of a teacher an issue is in itself racist.

I have a completely different perspective and will explain.

More options

DA60

AlbqOwl

joG

rabbitcaebannog

rabbitcaebannog

Mason66

Mason66

Summerwind

Hot Flash Mama

Kal'Stang

Mason66

Jaygodmedia

ecofarm

global liberation

Mason66

Mason66

ecofarm

global liberation

Mason66

rabbitcaebannog

ecofarm

global liberation

Mason66

Mason66

rabbitcaebannog

ecofarm

global liberation

Kal'Stang

Kal'Stang

ecofarm

global liberation

Whites Need Not Apply?[W:68]

Mutliple Choice - Check all statement you see as true:

A white person should not teach minority children.

A person of a minority race cannot teach white children.

Race is not a factor on a person's competency to teach anything.

Making the race of a teacher an issue is in itself racist.

I have a completely different perspective and will explain.

Hot Flash Mama

global liberation

global liberation

global liberation

global liberation

global liberation

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