Wahhabis

[Disputatious71]

No it wasn't.. that was taken over by the Dutch and Portuguese.. The Arabian trade routes were obsolete and by then the Marib Dam had collapsed.

Then maybe you can explain this to me about Sultan Selim III ...

Ottoman military reform efforts begin with Selim III (1789–1807) who made the first major attempts to modernize the army along European lines.

Source
Exactly how does one modernize an army along European lines IF one does not trade or interact with Western countries ????

 

[sharon]

Then maybe you can explain this to me about Sultan Selim III ...
Source
Exactly how does one modernize an army along European lines IF one does not trade or interact with Western countries ????

Did you know that Turkey is NOT in Saudi Arabia?

The History of Saudi Arabia

The Islamic Empire
Less than 100 years after the birth of Islam, the Islamic Empire extended from Spain to parts of India and China. Although the political centers of power had moved out of the Arabian Peninsula, trade flourished in the area.

Also, a large number of pilgrims began regularly visiting the peninsula, with some settling in the two holy cities of Makkah and Madinah. These pilgrims facilitated the exchange of ideas and cultures between the people of the peninsula and other civilizations of the Arab and Muslim worlds.

The emergence of Arabic as the language of international learning was another major factor in the cultural development of the Arabian Peninsula. The Muslim world became a center for learning and scientific advances during what is known as the “Golden Age.” Muslim scholars made major contributions in many fields, including medicine, biology, philosophy, astronomy, arts and literature. Many of the ideas and methods pioneered by Muslim scholars became the foundation of modern sciences.

The Islamic Empire thrived well into the 17th century, when it broke up into smaller Muslim kingdoms. The Arabian Peninsula gradually entered a period of relative isolation, although Makkah and Madinah remained the spiritual heart of the Islamic world and continued to attract pilgrims from many countries.

 

[SheWolf]

I met somebody from Saudi Arabia once, and he said that the royal family are America's puppets... The conversation didn't go much further, but I always found his statement interesting and wonder if it's a common held belief there.

Another thing that really strikes me, is if Saudi Arabia were an American citizen instead of a foreign state... there would be so much controversy and readiness to pull the plug on government support and making Saudi Arab support itself and not be dependent on the Federal government.

Why is it less controversial for the American government send foreign people and foreign governments money and support than it is to help it's own people and citizens in need?

 

[Disputatious71]

Did you know that Turkey is NOT in Saudi Arabia?

The History of Saudi Arabia

The Islamic Empire
Less than 100 years after the birth of Islam, the Islamic Empire extended from Spain to parts of India and China. Although the political centers of power had moved out of the Arabian Peninsula, trade flourished in the area.

Also, a large number of pilgrims began regularly visiting the peninsula, with some settling in the two holy cities of Makkah and Madinah. These pilgrims facilitated the exchange of ideas and cultures between the people of the peninsula and other civilizations of the Arab and Muslim worlds.

The emergence of Arabic as the language of international learning was another major factor in the cultural development of the Arabian Peninsula. The Muslim world became a center for learning and scientific advances during what is known as the “Golden Age.” Muslim scholars made major contributions in many fields, including medicine, biology, philosophy, astronomy, arts and literature. Many of the ideas and methods pioneered by Muslim scholars became the foundation of modern sciences.

The Islamic Empire thrived well into the 17th century, when it broke up into smaller Muslim kingdoms. The Arabian Peninsula gradually entered a period of relative isolation, although Makkah and Madinah remained the spiritual heart of the Islamic world and continued to attract pilgrims from many countries.

The Ottoman Empire may not have conquered the Arabian peninsula yet, but that does not prove Arabia during that time was not a trade hub with connection to the West as you are attempting to falsely state. If nothing else it reinforces the fact that Arabia did in fact have dealing with neighbors and the West unless you can also cite a source that proves the Ottoman Empire did not know Mecca and the Arabian peninsula existed too !

 

[sharon]

The Ottoman Empire may not have conquered the Arabian peninsula yet, but that does not prove Arabia during that time was not a trade hub with connection to the West as you are attempting to falsely state. If nothing else it reinforces the fact that Arabia did in fact have dealing with neighbors and the West unless you can also cite a source that proves the Ottoman Empire did not know Mecca and the Arabian peninsula existed too !

Oh man..

The Ottomans dominated the Arabian Peninsula by 1500..

Are you a teenager?

 

[Disputatious71]

Oh man..

The Ottomans dominated the Arabian Peninsula by 1500..

Are you a teenager?

Well then we are back to my question to you ...

Then maybe you can explain this to me about Sultan Selim III ...

Ottoman military reform efforts begin with Selim III (1789–1807) who made the first major attempts to modernize the army along European lines.

Source
Exactly how does one modernize an army along European lines IF one does not trade or interact with Western countries ????

I am unsure why you again wish to prove your ignorance by failing to guess my age, or why that would be relevant to your sophistry and inability to cite a source proving no Weustern contact during the 18th century when the Arabian penninsula was in fact a center of trade during the spice & silk trade of the 18th century....

 

[sharon]

Well then we are back to my question to you ...

Then maybe you can explain this to me about Sultan Selim III ...

Source
Exactly how does one modernize an army along European lines IF one does not trade or interact with Western countries ????

I am unsure why you again wish to prove your ignorance by failing to guess my age, or why that would be relevant to your sophistry and inability to cite a source proving no Weustern contact during the 18th century when the Arabian penninsula was in fact a center of trade during the spice & silk trade of the 18th century....

Do you recall what happened beginning in 1492?

Or did you think the Arabian Peninsula was trading with the Europeans in 1600? Dolt.

 

[Disputatious71]

Do you recall what happened beginning in 1492?

Or did you think the Arabian Peninsula was trading with the Europeans in 1600? Dolt.

Since the world did not end in 1492 nor 1600 and we are talking about the 18th century (which is the time frame for Muhammad ibn Abd al-Wahhab lived) you are still not proving your point by all this attempted obfuscation and avoidance of citing a source to prove that the Arabian peninsula was trade dead during that century and had no contact or knowledge of the West or Democratic principles which of us is the dolt again?

 

[sharon]

Since the world did not end in 1492 nor 1600 and we are talking about the 18th century (which is the time frame for Muhammad ibn Abd al-Wahhab lived) you are still not proving your point by all this attempted obfuscation and avoidance of citing a source to prove that the Arabian peninsula was trade dead during that century and had no contact or knowledge of the West or Democratic principles which of us is the dolt again?

I am sorry.. I DON'T HAVE TO PROVE A THING TO YOU.

I have been all over the Arabian Peninsula and I know its history quite well..

When I arrived they were living as people lived at the time of Christ..

And your utter lack of education is not my problem.

 

[Disputatious71]

I am sorry.. I DON'T HAVE TO PROVE A THING TO YOU.

I have been all over the Arabian Peninsula and I know its history quite well..

When I arrived they were living as people lived at the time of Christ..

And your utter lack of education is not my problem.

So one would think that with such personal experience and knowledge it would be easy to cite a source to back up your claims and opinions to prove they are not ignorant nor arrogant assumptions!

 

[Bodi]

Why do you like the nKn regime?

I think he was sad that N Korea wasn't on the Nuke List...

 

[American]

also it means follower of islam....

And muslim means?

 

[MKULTRABOY]

And muslim means?

Explodinator of infidels?

 

[Medusa]

And muslim means?

islamist is different from muslim ,muslims arent usually islamist.

 

[Oberon]

Well, there was no 'Saudi Arabia' until 1930 or so, so I don't understand what that argument is all about. Saudi Arabia is barely older than Israel. I guess nobody remembers the Ottoman Empire or something, which was indeed astride major trade routes, for a long time.

In any case, re the OP, I think most people who are moderately informed are aware of the Saudi support of Wahhabism, and also concerned about the Saudis financing Wahhabist mosques in the West; they've financed the majority of mosques in the US, some 75% of them according to the last sources I've seen, all Wahhabist.

 

[Oberon]

The Ottoman Empire may not have conquered the Arabian peninsula yet,

What was there to conquer?

 

[Oberon]

The United Nations Commission on Human Rights...isn't hate propaganda.

The Commission Momar Quadaffy Duck was chairman of. Yeah, it's neutral ... lol it just oozes credibility like no tomorrow.

 

[Risky Thicket]

And muslim means?

What do you mean, what does it mean? Seriously, man.

 

[sharon]

Since the world did not end in 1492 nor 1600 and we are talking about the 18th century (which is the time frame for Muhammad ibn Abd al-Wahhab lived) you are still not proving your point by all this attempted obfuscation and avoidance of citing a source to prove that the Arabian peninsula was trade dead during that century and had no contact or knowledge of the West or Democratic principles which of us is the dolt again?

Arab Spice Trade and Spread of Islam: SPICE Case

The Issue

From the seventh to the ninth centuries C.E. (Common Era), the Arabs maintained flourishing trade centers. They gained control over the spice trade around 960 B.C.E. (Before Common Era) and continued domination until 1100 C.E.

However, this study is concerned principally with the period from the beginning of Islam in the seventh century C.E. until its decline in the 12th century C.E., or more specifically from the 10th century C.E. when it really began to expand beyond the Arab lands.

The new religion was spread beyond the Arab lands through two primary methods. The first was conquest through war. The second, less violent, approach was that carried along the spice trade routes. This second approach was far preferable within the teachings of the new religion because it allowed for conversion by means other than force; the more violent path is expressly condemned in the Qur'an.

This case study then will be a historic look at the spread of Islam using the spice trade as its chief vehicle, as well as a discussion about data surrounding this agricultural trade's impact on the environment.

Case Study

 

[Disputatious71]

Arab Spice Trade and Spread of Islam: SPICE Case

The Issue

From the seventh to the ninth centuries C.E. (Common Era), the Arabs maintained flourishing trade centers. They gained control over the spice trade around 960 B.C.E. (Before Common Era) and continued domination until 1100 C.E.

However, this study is concerned principally with the period from the beginning of Islam in the seventh century C.E. until its decline in the 12th century C.E., or more specifically from the 10th century C.E. when it really began to expand beyond the Arab lands.

The new religion was spread beyond the Arab lands through two primary methods. The first was conquest through war. The second, less violent, approach was that carried along the spice trade routes. This second approach was far preferable within the teachings of the new religion because it allowed for conversion by means other than force; the more violent path is expressly condemned in the Qur'an.

This case study then will be a historic look at the spread of Islam using the spice trade as its chief vehicle, as well as a discussion about data surrounding this agricultural trade's impact on the environment.

Case Study

Back to the time frame and point one last time for you, maybe this time you can find something that proves your premise that their was no Western influence or knowledge of Western ideas !

Well then we are back to my question to you ...

Then maybe you can explain this to me about Sultan Selim III ...

Source
Exactly how does one modernize an army along European lines IF one does not trade or interact with Western countries ????

I am unsure why you again wish to prove your ignorance by failing to guess my age, or why that would be relevant to your sophistry and inability to cite a source proving no Weustern contact during the 18th century when the Arabian penninsula was in fact a center of trade during the spice & silk trade of the 18th century....

 

[sharon]

Back to the time frame and point one last time for you, maybe this time you can find something that proves your premise that their was no Western influence or knowledge of Western ideas !

Not in Saudi Arabia...

The spice trade was finished by the 12th century.

 

[Disputatious71]

Not in Saudi Arabia...

The spice trade was finished by the 12th century.

Seriously are you saying their were no spices traded in the world after the 12th century ? Are you also able to prove that their was absolutely no trade with Arabia and that all the Arabian ports were closed to outside influence ?

 

[longview]

I did not read this all the way through, but wasn't one of the purposes of the Portuguese explorers in the 13th century,
to bypass the Arab monopoly on the spice trade? (I know they were also looking for Prester John)
Later Columbus was looking for a western route to the indies for the same reason.

 

[Oberon]

I did not read this all the way through, but wasn't one of the purposes of the Portuguese explorers in the 13th century,
to bypass the Arab monopoly on the spice trade? (I know they were also looking for Prester John)
Later Columbus was looking for a western route to the indies for the same reason.

Partly; there were other competitors to bypass besides the ME traders, like Venice, and the Byzantines/Ottomans, to name a couple. 'Arabs' pretty much faded away quickly by the 7th Century; they didn't last long after the Prophet died. The preponderance of Arab names in ME history is pretty mis-leading; non-Arabs had adopted 'Arab' names for a long time afterwards in some areas, many of them were Seljuks, Jews, Persians, Armenians, and Greeks and maybe dozens of other ethnic groups. The Ottomans had a pretty diverse empire.

It was a hyper-competitive era; they all are, but Europe was in a period of developing rapidly and looking for markets and colonies.

 

[sharon]

Arab Spice Trade and Spread of Islam: SPICE Case

The Issue

From the seventh to the ninth centuries C.E. (Common Era), the Arabs maintained flourishing trade centers. They gained control over the spice trade around 960 B.C.E. (Before Common Era) and continued domination until 1100 C.E.

However, this study is concerned principally with the period from the beginning of Islam in the seventh century C.E. until its decline in the 12th century C.E., or more specifically from the 10th century C.E. when it really began to expand beyond the Arab lands.

The new religion was spread beyond the Arab lands through two primary methods. The first was conquest through war. The second, less violent, approach was that carried along the spice trade routes. This second approach was far preferable within the teachings of the new religion because it allowed for conversion by means other than force; the more violent path is expressly condemned in the Qur'an.

This case study then will be a historic look at the spread of Islam using the spice trade as its chief vehicle, as well as a discussion about data surrounding this agricultural trade's impact on the environment.

Case Study

Read it for yourself................