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Trump's lies show a contempt for the idea of reason, cultivates "the habits of autocracy"

j brown's body

"A Soros-backed animal"
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"...with regard to political lying, is to focus on the decision to lie — to affirmatively act to mislead the public about a genuine crisis. Politics is not the place for perfect honesty, but some measure of truth telling is necessary to the project of collective self-government. It is incumbent on political leaders, specifically, to strive for some correspondence to reality when they make their case to the public. They set the terms of political discourse and contestation. They define the boundaries of what’s fair and what’s foul. And their words and actions affect the public at large. Ordinary people take cues from leaders when they try to decide what it means, for themselves, to be political.

When political leaders lie with abandon — when they do so flagrantly with no other concern than their most narrow interest or when they do so to attack innocent people in the service of demagoguery — they are telling their supporters that this is what it means to engage in political life. They are trying to build a culture of dishonesty that erodes trust and makes collective action all the more difficult. They are weakening the values and the virtues that facilitate republican self-government.

Democracy is a discipline. It is a habit. It must be cultivated so that we can learn to act democratically — so that it becomes a part of who we are. Part of the discipline of democracy is meeting others as equals, fellow citizens with whom you can reason and deliberate.


To lie without shame about everything — even something as dire as a natural disaster — is to show contempt for the idea that you can reason with or persuade another person. It is to attempt to shape their reality so that they can’t really disagree. It is to demand obedience to a narrative. It is to cultivate the habits of autocracy."

Link
 
Yet teh most common thing I get from libs, is that for some reason, my speech and ideas are not valid, so I and my words should be dismissed.


We have no chance of "reason" or as I put it, "serious or honest debate" becuase liberals insist on defining every issue in such a way that there is not legitimate way to disagree.

And if you do disagree, they call you an ist of a phobe of some sort, and try to destroy you.



AND if the left ever gets "hate speech" laws passed, then any attempt at dissent will be classifed as some form of "hate" and everyone who dares to stand out from the brainless mob and speak the Truth, will be arrested.
 
Wow. So articulate and well written. It must be nice to be able to write so well! It expresses the idea very well.

I was talking to a Trump supporter a while back. I asked him if this level of mendacity was something they were OK with in a politician. Their response was that all politicians are crooks and liars. So we might as well have one who accomplishes their agenda.

But there has to be some limits. Yes I know that, like the article says, politics is not the place for perfect honesty. But Donald Trump is just absolutely ridiculous now and has taken lying and dishonesty to caricaturish extremes.
 
Yet teh most common thing I get from libs, is that for some reason, my speech and ideas are not valid, so I and my words should be dismissed.


We have no chance of "reason" or as I put it, "serious or honest debate" becuase liberals insist on defining every issue in such a way that there is not legitimate way to disagree.

And if you do disagree, they call you an ist of a phobe of some sort, and try to destroy you.



AND if the left ever gets "hate speech" laws passed, then any attempt at dissent will be classifed as some form of "hate" and everyone who dares to stand out from the brainless mob and speak the Truth, will be arrested.

Is it really that hard to accept that they were not eating the pets?
 
"...with regard to political lying, is to focus on the decision to lie — to affirmatively act to mislead the public about a genuine crisis. Politics is not the place for perfect honesty, but some measure of truth telling is necessary to the project of collective self-government. It is incumbent on political leaders, specifically, to strive for some correspondence to reality when they make their case to the public. They set the terms of political discourse and contestation. They define the boundaries of what’s fair and what’s foul. And their words and actions affect the public at large. Ordinary people take cues from leaders when they try to decide what it means, for themselves, to be political.

When political leaders lie with abandon — when they do so flagrantly with no other concern than their most narrow interest or when they do so to attack innocent people in the service of demagoguery — they are telling their supporters that this is what it means to engage in political life. They are trying to build a culture of dishonesty that erodes trust and makes collective action all the more difficult. They are weakening the values and the virtues that facilitate republican self-government.

Democracy is a discipline. It is a habit. It must be cultivated so that we can learn to act democratically — so that it becomes a part of who we are. Part of the discipline of democracy is meeting others as equals, fellow citizens with whom you can reason and deliberate.


To lie without shame about everything — even something as dire as a natural disaster — is to show contempt for the idea that you can reason with or persuade another person. It is to attempt to shape their reality so that they can’t really disagree. It is to demand obedience to a narrative. It is to cultivate the habits of autocracy."

Link
Well said Sir. May I ask what is the answer at the moment?It's like America is delirious. Out of control with so much intolerance toward one another. The "us and them"mentality.
 
Wow. So articulate and well written. It must be nice to be able to write so well! It expresses the idea very well.

I was talking to a Trump supporter while back. I asked him if this level of mendacity was something they were OK with a politician. Their response was that all politicians are crooks and liars. So we might as well have one who accomplishes their agenda.

But there has to be some limits. Yes I know that, like the article says, politics is not the place for perfect honesty. But Donald Trump is just absolutely ridiculous now and has taken lying and dishonesty to caricaturish extremes.

Trump's lie about the election being stolen from him and his corrupt effort to overturn it are direct attacks on our democratic principles. All his lies since are to set up his next direct attack this November.
 
Yet teh most common thing I get from libs, is that for some reason, my speech and ideas are not valid, so I and my words should be dismissed.


We have no chance of "reason" or as I put it, "serious or honest debate" becuase liberals insist on defining every issue in such a way that there is not legitimate way to disagree.

And if you do disagree, they call you an ist of a phobe of some sort, and try to destroy you.



AND if the left ever gets "hate speech" laws passed, then any attempt at dissent will be classifed as some form of "hate" and everyone who dares to stand out from the brainless mob and speak the Truth, will be arrested.

Deliberately lying about how you were not going to believe what his top people were finding on Obama’s secret birth certificate for six years straight, or stolen elections in 2020, or Haitians eating cats and dogs, etc, etc… it’s not just expressing a different point of view, or expressing things as you see them. We now know this was all just deliberately making stuff up out of whole cloth.

I mean, if you’re going to be a lying politician, you have to have some tact and intelligence about it. Donald Trump is like the five-year-old with chocolate smeared all over their mouth insisting they did not eat the chocolate chip cookies.

And what’s funny is people still believe him.
 
Deliberately lying about how you’re not going to believe what his top people were finding in Obama’s secret birth certificate for six years straight, or stolen elections in 2020, or Haitians eating cats and dogs, etc, etc… it’s not just a different point of view. We now know this was all just making stuff up out of whole cloth.

I mean, if you’re going to be a lying politician, you have to have some tact and intelligence about it. Donald Trump is like the five-year-old with chocolate smeared all over their mouth insisting they did not eat the chocolate chip cookies.

And what’s funny is people still believe him.

"Lying is loyalty." Trump delights in watching his supporters debase themselves by supporting his outrageous lies.
 
Is it really that hard to accept that they were not eating the pets?


I note that you did not address my point at all. Kind of makes my point, not that you can hear me.
 
Deliberately lying about how you were not going to believe what his top people were finding on Obama’s secret birth certificate for six years straight, or stolen elections in 2020, or Haitians eating cats and dogs, etc, etc… it’s not just expressing a different point of view, or expressing things as you see them. We now know this was all just deliberately making stuff up out of whole cloth.

I mean, if you’re going to be a lying politician, you have to have some tact and intelligence about it. Donald Trump is like the five-year-old with chocolate smeared all over their mouth insisting they did not eat the chocolate chip cookies.

And what’s funny is people still believe him.


Nothing in your post addressed anything in my post.


Who ordered the fbi and cia to cover up Hunter Biden's laptop?
 
Wow. So articulate and well written. It must be nice to be able to write so well! It expresses the idea very well.

I was talking to a Trump supporter a while back. I asked him if this level of mendacity was something they were OK with in a politician. Their response was that all politicians are crooks and liars. So we might as well have one who accomplishes their agenda.

But there has to be some limits. Yes I know that, like the article says, politics is not the place for perfect honesty. But Donald Trump is just absolutely ridiculous now and has taken lying and dishonesty to caricaturish extremes.
Along those lines an old high school buddy of mine told me that he'd vote for an axe murderer if it meant stopping illegals from entering the country. Pretty much the mindset
 
Along those lines an old high school buddy of mine told me that he'd vote for an axe murderer if it meant stopping illegals from entering the country. Pretty much the mindset


Not wanting your territory invaded, is a pretty normal response. Healthy even.
 
Truth,is dependant on who believes it. Lies are dependant who does not believe it. Truth,is dependant on who does not believe it. Lies are dependant on who does believe it.
 
"I HATE TAYLOR SWIFT" Proof his brain is rotting away. Listen to his broken sentences as he can't recall his last word so he flips to something else. Pay attention to the people sitting behind him as they know the old man has lost it.
 
Not wanting your territory invaded, is a pretty normal response. Healthy even.
Uh .... NO! There's nothing "healthy" about voting for an ax murderer.
In fact, it falls under the category of "sick in the head".
 
How silly. Harris has had a very successful career, by any reasonable measure. Certainly a far more successful career as a public servant than the unrepentant recidivist fraud Trump has had.
 
Trump's mood swings while speaking at rally's suggest bi-polarism.

In 2022, University of Montana researchers found that Trump speaks at a fourth-grade level.....


The 78 year old DonOld Trump is the oldest candidate ever for the office of US President.
 
Nothing in your post addressed anything in my post.


Who ordered the fbi and cia to cover up Hunter Biden's laptop?
Laptop. Laptop.
laptoplaptoplaptoplaptop LAPTOP!
 
This is part of the “fake news” gambit.

Only believe what the former POTUS says….
 
Not wanting your territory invaded, is a pretty normal response. Healthy even.
Those illegal immigrants? They're being lured into your country by people who want to make big bucks off cheap labour. It's never going to end until you go after the people doing the luring.
Why is even one illegal immigrant arrested at work and nobody on the hiring side arrested?
Wealthy, influential people don't want illegal immigration stopped, and you think Trump will stop it? Give your head a shake.
 
Yet teh most common thing I get from libs, is that for some reason, my speech and ideas are not valid, so I and my words should be dismissed.
They should be dismissed because the people lying to you are openly admitting they are lying to you. And yet you keep believing and defending them. That's just weird.

‘If I Have to Create Stories… That’s What I’m Going to Do’​

-JD Vance
_________________________
The only question now is why you insist so passionately on believing and propagating things you know are lies. That's just weird. It got Trump voters killed at 3 times the rate of everyone else during Covid. That's a pretty steep price to pay to insist on continuing to believe a liar who is openly admitting to you they are lying.

https://www.wgbh.org/news/national/...-covid-death-rates-misinformation-is-to-blame
 
It was the lie and coverup that changed the 2020 election.
You reckon? Kinda like the FBI announcing they were reopening the investigation into Clinton's e-mails two weeks before the election in '16? Changed the election like that?
How did that reopened investigation turn out? I can't recall. I remember how the election turned out but not the investigation.
 
Those illegal immigrants? They're being lured into your country by people who want to make big bucks off cheap labour. It's never going to end until you go after the people doing the luring.
Why is even one illegal immigrant arrested at work and nobody on the hiring side arrested?
Wealthy, influential people don't want illegal immigration stopped, and you think Trump will stop it? Give your head a shake.
It's well known that before Trump first assumed elected office, many of the maids in his own hotels were "illegals" - so he's never had a problem with the undocumented until it became politically expedient.
 
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