The senate trial of president trump

[bongsaway]

Should the senate trial include witness?

 

[OldFatGuy]

Should the senate trial include witness?

What senate trial?

 

[Mycroft]

Should the senate trial include witness?

Depends...

If you are talking about the prosecutor, the House has already interviewed witnesses...some even in public. They can present that testimony at the trial and there'll be no need to call those witnesses to speak further. In fact, by calling them, the prosecutor runs the risk of defense attorney questioning that could expose lack of credibility.

If you are talking about people who have not been heard from yet, the risk to the prosecution is even greater. There's no guarantee that such a witness will give any information that supports the prosecution and a great danger that the witness will give information that damages the prosecutor's case.

In my opinion, the prosecutor should run with what they have if they think it's enough to win their case. If they don't think it's enough, then they should never have brought the case in the first place.

 

[bongsaway]

Depends...

If you are talking about the prosecutor, the House has already interviewed witnesses...some even in public. They can present that testimony at the trial and there'll be no need to call those witnesses to speak further. In fact, by calling them, the prosecutor runs the risk of defense attorney questioning that could expose lack of credibility.

If you are talking about people who have not been heard from yet, the risk to the prosecution is even greater. There's no guarantee that such a witness will give any information that supports the prosecution and a great danger that the witness will give information that damages the prosecutor's case.

In my opinion, the prosecutor should run with what they have if they think it's enough to win their case. If they don't think it's enough, then they should never have brought the case in the first place.

How about we hear from the people trump blocked from testifying and see some of the documents he refused to turn over?

How the right can claim we don't need to hear from them is mind boggling.

Who ever heard of a trial with no witnesses?

 

[tres borrachos]

Should the senate trial include witness?

Sure. All trials include witnesses, whether political as this one is or in our court systems. Both sides should call witnesses that are relevant to what's being debated.

 

[ludin]

Should the senate trial include witness?

Sure the WB and his 6 supposed sources lets find out how this mess started to begin with.
other than that no. there doesn't have to be any witnesses.

 

[ludin]

How about we hear from the people trump blocked from testifying and see some of the documents he refused to turn over?

How the right can claim we don't need to hear from them is mind boggling.

Who ever heard of a trial with no witnesses?

this is political not legal remember?
McConnell is under no obligation to help schiff make his case.
that was schiffs job to make his case. he failed that is not mcconnells problem.

 

[danielpalos]

Should the senate trial include witness?

Sure, sufficient to ensure the interest of Justice.

 

[Obscurity]

Sure the WB and his 6 supposed sources lets find out how this mess started to begin with.
other than that no. there doesn't have to be any witnesses.

I'm fine with entertaining your authoritarian request, so long as Bolton, Pompeo, Mulveney, and Trump himself are called as witnesses.

I have no more tolerance for the kult45 personality brigade telling me who I shouldn't hear from.

 

[Obscurity]

this is political not legal remember?
McConnell is under no obligation to help schiff make his case.
that was schiffs job to make his case. he failed that is not mcconnells problem.

He didn't fail, and the majority of individual human beings polled agree with his postulation.

 

[ludin]

I'm fine with entertaining your authoritarian request, so long as Bolton, Pompeo, Mulveney, and Trump himself are called as witnesses.

I have no more tolerance for the kult45 personality brigade telling me who I shouldn't hear from.

there is nothing authoritarian about it. The constitution give the senate sole power of the trial.
they can call or not call any witness they want.

please don't use words when you don't understand what they mean.

 

[ludin]

He didn't fail, and the majority of individual human beings polled agree with his postulation.

actually they don't. support among independents slipped to 44% after the hearing and in the days after.
the hearing was a complete disaster.

When you have 17 people get up and say we have no evidence of any extortion or bribery it pretty much blows your accusations out of the water.

Support falls for Trump's impeachment, removal from office: CNN poll | TheHill

 

[Obscurity]

actually they don't. support among independents slipped to 44% after the hearing and in the days after.
the hearing was a complete disaster.

When you have 17 people get up and say we have no evidence of any extortion or bribery it pretty much blows your accusations out of the water.

Support falls for Trump's impeachment, removal from office: CNN poll | TheHill

One poll doesn't make the case, and since when did you think polls are suddenly viable? After Trump, you lot disavowed polls.

Moreover, no, the hearings were not a disaster.

That's purely your opinion, because you are choosing NOT To see what he did as wrong, and you're choosing to IGNORE precedent here, and you're ignoring future presidential behavior and how letting him off the hook for this will impact it.

Of course, when President Bernie Sanders does something similar (He never would, since he has morals and is principled, FYI, unlike your dear leader) I will be sure to accept your support AGAINST impeaching him.

Ever do the right wing ignore what they enable in their blind quest for political wins.

 

[Obscurity]

there is nothing authoritarian about it. The constitution give the senate sole power of the trial.
they can call or not call any witness they want.

please don't use words when you don't understand what they mean.

What's authoritarian is insisting the WB testify - even though their testimony is unnecessary. Forcing them to be outed to the rabid horde of sickening followers of the dear leader makes them a real target.

I do not trust any Trump voter to remain peaceful, not after all of this.

 

[ludin]

One poll doesn't make the case, and since when did you think polls are suddenly viable? After Trump, you lot disavowed polls.

Moreover, no, the hearings were not a disaster.

If people are not buying what you are selling and they were before you started your sales pitch then yes it is a disaster.

That's purely your opinion, because you are choosing NOT To see what he did as wrong, and you're choosing to IGNORE precedent here, and you're ignoring future presidential behavior and how letting him off the hook for this will impact it.

He didn't do anything wrong. We have multiple witnesses that heard the phone call and testified to the phone call that there was no extortion or bribery including the president of another country.
again no matter how much you believe a lie it will still be a lie. i am sorry that schiff got your hopes up for this big thing, but without evidence and multiple people denying
what happened the accusations fall flat. this is why facts are so important and is much needed vs just baseless accusations.
leftist still haven't learned their lesson from Kanvanaugh.

Of course, when President Bernie Sanders does something similar (He never would, since he has morals and is principled, FYI, unlike your dear leader) I will be sure to accept your support AGAINST impeaching him.

your projections are wrong. I have no problem impeaching a president and removing him from office when he has committed a crime. Unlike you and other leftist i do not believe in witch hunts or
digging until i find a crime. which is unconstitutional.

Ever do the right wing ignore what they enable in their blind quest for political wins.

again that is what leftist do. your projections are getting old.

 

[Obscurity]

If people are not buying what you are selling and they were before you started your sales pitch then yes it is a disaster.



He didn't do anything wrong. We have multiple witnesses that heard the phone call and testified to the phone call that there was no extortion or bribery including the president of another country.
again no matter how much you believe a lie it will still be a lie. i am sorry that schiff got your hopes up for this big thing, but without evidence and multiple people denying
what happened the accusations fall flat. this is why facts are so important and is much needed vs just baseless accusations.
leftist still haven't learned their lesson from Kanvanaugh.



your projections are wrong. I have no problem impeaching a president and removing him from office when he has committed a crime. Unlike you and other leftist i do not believe in witch hunts or
digging until i find a crime. which is unconstitutional.



again that is what leftist do. your projections are getting old.

My projections? Your entire argument sums up to this: Leftist bad.

In every single debate that's your tactic. Every single one.

Tell me what point there is in discussing anything here with you?

 

[ludin]

What's authoritarian is insisting the WB testify - even though their testimony is unnecessary. Forcing them to be outed to the rabid horde of sickening followers of the dear leader makes them a real target.

I do not trust any Trump voter to remain peaceful, not after all of this.

that is not authoritarian at all. He is the starter of this entire mess and he is a key supposed fact witness even though he has 0 knowledge of the actual event.
we do know that he is a liberal hack and he worked for the joe biden campaign. we need to find out where he got his information from and question those people.
he is very much a key part of this entire thing and it is important to find out exactly why he did what he did.

that is not authoritarian at all. as i said you shouldn't use words you don't understand.

so far the only people shooting other people are leftists.
the only violence is from the left. again your blinders and partisanship is there for everyone to see.

 

[Obscurity]

that is not authoritarian at all. He is the starter of this entire mess and he is a key supposed fact witness even though he has 0 knowledge of the actual event.
we do know that he is a liberal hack and he worked for the joe biden campaign. we need to find out where he got his information from and question those people.
he is very much a key part of this entire thing and it is important to find out exactly why he did what he did.

that is not authoritarian at all. as i said you shouldn't use words you don't understand.

so far the only people shooting other people are leftists.
the only violence is from the left. again your blinders and partisanship is there for everyone to see.

More rash generalizations. And no, leftists aren't the only ones "shooting" people. I know you didn't trust the intelligence agencies (Until you suddenly did with regard to Suleimani, convenient!) but they explicitly state right wing terrorism in this country is at an all time high. Those include - shocking, I know - shootings.

Look, if you want to live in a dream inside a dream, that's your business. I'm not here to argue with partisans who project everything even when confronted with reality.

 

[ludin]

My projections? Your entire argument sums up to this: Leftist bad.

Nothing to do with what i said. My argument is that the leftist in congress failed in their attempted coup.

In every single debate that's your tactic. Every single one.

again you are projecting your own tactics at other people.

Tell me what point there is in discussing anything here with you?

I am simply countering your hyperbolic partisanship.
sorry you don't like it, but we do not have to tolerate your baseless accusations.
I know i know leftist hate it when people stand up to them but tough luck.

Try debating with a bit of honesty and things will change, but i know you won't
so there you have it. your baseless accusations no longer fly anymore.

 

[Mycroft]

How about we hear from the people trump blocked from testifying and see some of the documents he refused to turn over?

How the right can claim we don't need to hear from them is mind boggling.

Who ever heard of a trial with no witnesses?

The House had every opportunity to get that blocked information. In fact, they dropped one suit that had that very purpose. The prosecutors can certainly insist on calling for that testimony and those documents, but it will only result in the resumption of the lawsuit. Personally, I don't think the Senate will support going through that. But hey...it's up to the prosecutors.

btw, sworn testimony is always admissible in a trial, so the notion of "a trial with no witnesses" is not true.

 

[Obscurity]

Nothing to do with what i said. My argument is that the leftist in congress failed in their attempted coup.



again you are projecting your own tactics at other people.



I am simply countering your hyperbolic partisanship.
sorry you don't like it, but we do not have to tolerate your baseless accusations.
I know i know leftist hate it when people stand up to them but tough luck.

Try debating with a bit of honesty and things will change, but i know you won't
so there you have it. your baseless accusations no longer fly anymore.

You can't even consider the notion you're wrong. That's the alltogether obscene part of this conversation. You literally cannot escape your cognitive dissonance.

Trump ordered the MILITARY AID HELD. Ordered it. As reported. Evidenced in EMAILS. That is the cartoon PROOF you guys said you needed to support this, and the goalposts simply Move now to -well, no, you didn't convince me.

That's the issue.

NOTHING will convince you. That is IRONCLAD now. Nothing will convince you, at all.

And thus, there is no reason to discuss this, because YOU AREN'T BEING HONEST, while insisting its me who isn't being honest.

 

[less right]

Tell me what point there is in discussing anything here with you?

I ask myself that before I respond to any Trump supporter.

It keeps my post count down, but on the plus side, it minimizes frustration and wasted time.

 

[Obscurity]

I ask myself that before I respond to any Trump supporter.

It keeps my post count down, but on the plus side, it minimizes frustration and wasted time.

Mr Self Destruct has become a political movement, it seems. I am dealing with endless hordes of replicant Eraserheads!

 

[ludin]

More rash generalizations. And no, leftists aren't the only ones "shooting" people. I know you didn't trust the intelligence agencies (Until you suddenly did with regard to Suleimani, convenient!) but they explicitly state right wing terrorism in this country is at an all time high. Those include - shocking, I know - shootings.

Look, if you want to live in a dream inside a dream, that's your business. I'm not here to argue with partisans who project everything even when confronted with reality.

I never said anything about suleimani until recently. Then what i did is my own investigative work and look up facts about the guy.
He is responsible for numerous attacks against US forces and american. He was Iran's number 1 general for CIA style attacks.
he worked with known terrorist organizations to accomplish those attacks. you will find that i condemn any kind of domestic terrorist or violence.
all of those people should be arrested and charged accordingly. i have stated this numerous times. but this has noting and i mean nothing to do with what i posted.
which again is typical leftist debate tactics.

again you are projecting what you do on other people. projections are fallacies not arguments.
if you don't like opposing view points then you should go to another debate board where they are all leftist
and will agree with everything you say. there are plenty of them out there.

 

[less right]

Mr Self Destruct has become a political movement, it seems. I am dealing with endless hordes of replicant Eraserheads!

You are. I hope you find it entertaining because it will never be productive. It's proven impossible to debate alternate facts.