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The rise of Hitler

joluoto

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A new youtube series by Indy Neidell and Spartacus Olsen



A series about the fall of the Weimar Republic starting in 1930, with Hitler's local election success in Thuringia (why am I not surprised it's Thuringia), and the acceptance of the Young Plan.
 
Episode 2



February 1930. The death of Horst Wessel.
 
A new youtube series by Indy Neidell and Spartacus Olsen



A series about the fall of the Weimar Republic starting in 1930, with Hitler's local election success in Thuringia (why am I not surprised it's Thuringia), and the acceptance of the Young Plan.

Im supporting the time ghost army.
 

Episode 3: March 1930. Chancellor Müller's grand coalition government falls, Doctor Brüning's government is formed but without the support of the SPD this government seem weak. President Hindenburg might have other plans, called Article 48 though.
 
The Nazi Party, it's a rise is a prime example of how fragile Democracy can be, and how easily it is to be manipulated.
 
Since this series is about the political history of late Weimar and alot of political parties are name dropped, I thought I'd go through the most relevant Weimar parties. So I decided I start at the left and move right.

KPD: Kommunistische Partei Deutschlands, the Communist Party. Very revolutionary at this point in time, against the Weimar Republic and basically all other parties. Very pro USSR, disruptive in the Reichstag. Alot of marches, manifestations, and street fights with the Nazis.

SPD: Sozialdemokratische Partei Deutschlands, the Social Democrats. The largest political party in the Weimar Republic, and the party that played a large role in the foundation of the republic. Participates in coalition governments with the bourgeois parties from time to time, but the relations between the moderate left and right are often tense. The Bourgeois parties often tries to isolated SPD as much as KPD and NSDAP, which of course just weakens the moderate parties overall.

Speaking of the bourgeois, let's move over to them:

DDP: Deutsche Demokratische Partei, the German Democratic Party is a social liberal centrist party. It's small but has loyal followers, and are pretty much in the middle of the road on all questions. Often part of government coalitions, and the bourgeois party most open to cooperation with SPD.

Zentrum: Zentrumspartei, the Catholic Center party is a party that mostly attracts Catholic voters. It's usually the largest bourgeois party. Often part of governments, centrist economic views, but very social conservative social views, Christian tradtions and so on. Is basically the forerunner of CDU.

BVP: Bayerische Volkspartei, If Zentrum is the forerunner of CDU, BVP is the forerunner of CSU. A Conservative regionalist party that dominated Bavarian politics, and because Bavaria was a large State they has quite alot influence in the Reichstag

DVP: Deutsche Volkspartei, The German People's Party was a liberal- conservative right wing party. It was very pro free markets and anti- socialist, and often quite conservative on social questions, but also a staunch supporter of the Weimar Republic.

DNVP: Deutschnationale Volkspartei, if the last few parties were pro- Weimar, the German National People's Party was not. DNVP was pretty much Nazi Light. They were pro- authoritarian, a and was the party alot of old monarchists ended up in. Nationalist, Conservative, Anti- Semitic, Anti- Socialist, Anti- Catholic, but importantly they were not really were popular outside old aristocratic and industrialist elites. Unlike the Nazis they were somewhat willing to work with the other bourgeois parties, but only to a certain extent. In the end they drifted alot towards the Nazis, and just ended up as a Nazi support party.

And then we leave the bourgeois parties behind and we finally get to:
NSDAP: Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei, In the 1928 election the Nazis had only got 12 seats in the Reichstag and only 2.73% of the vote. But by 1930 they were very much a party in ascendancy, with local election successes and growing loud and violent group of supporters. Spoiler: In the september 1930 election the Nazis will come second behind the SPD with 107 seats and 18.3% support. But still the democratically inclined partied held a majority. NSDAP + KPD + DNVP controlled 225 seats, which is still less than half of the total 577, but we are close to a situation where the Reichstag becomes deadlocked, especially with the moderate parties often not able to cooperate, and even smaller parties that has managed to get a few seats starting to wield their little influence to derail things. The Nazis under leaders such as Hitler, Röhm, Göbbels and the Strasser brothers were able to capitalize on the political chaos and dissatisfaction of the political system among especially the lower middle classes, and presented an alternative of an aggressive authoritarian system, which seemed more and more appealing.
 
I just watched a documentary about the “Night of the Long Knives,” Hitler and the SS’s purge of the Brown Shirts of the SA. Made me think of Trump’s call for one day of unleashing the police to do violence with impunity. To be fair, his staff said he was joking, no doubt in the same good taste about as the joke in front of the widow.
 
I just watched a documentary about the “Night of the Long Knives,” Hitler and the SS’s purge of the Brown Shirts of the SA. Made me think of Trump’s call for one day of unleashing the police to do violence with impunity. To be fair, his staff said he was joking, no doubt in the same good taste about as the joke in front of the widow.
The "Night of the Long Knives" was basically getting rid of Nazis with different visions of Nazism than Hitler (such as the Strasserists) and get rid of Ernst Röhm and the SA that had now become a burden to the party post takeover. The allies the party had needed while still trying to get into power had become an inconvenience now when they were in charge. There could be no internal dissent allowed in Hitler's party.
 
in the us too many equate hitler with germany
I equate Hitler and Nazism with rabid-right-wing politics.

I've always known what happened in 1920's-1930's Germany could happen anywhere, anytime - that all nations and societies can be susceptible to adopting and acting on this and similar ideologies.
 
Episode 4.


The beginning of the Brüning government. It's both is and is not a coalition government, and DNVP is both part of and not part of the government. And the Communist Reich Youth Day in Leipzig demonstrations ends in violence. Also Jazz is a grand conspiracy against the German people.
 
The problem is Germans didn't have the hindsight we have when they elected him.

If he had said "I'm going to go full on mental and try and take over Europe and Russia and kill millions in the process" I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have won.
I'm sure they would have elected someone who wasn't insane.
 
The problem is Germans didn't have the hindsight we have when they elected him.

If he had said "I'm going to go full on mental and try and take over Europe and Russia and kill millions in the process" I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have won.
I'm sure they would have elected someone who wasn't insane.
The thing is: he kinda did say that. He was talking about Lebensraum in eastern Europe, conquest and revenge on the Entente allies from WW1 alot.
 
The thing is: he kinda did say that. He was talking about Lebensraum in eastern Europe, conquest and revenge on the Entente allies from WW1 alot.

Not to the extent he actually ended trying though.

I'm not defending him I'm just saying he managed to fool the German people into electing a complete madman.
 
I equate Hitler and Nazism with rabid-right-wing politics.

fascists don't care which party they use to gain power, there is a good study of nazism that basically supports the Idea that the nazis were hard core Leftists.

a view i hold


1729635489541.webp

Liberal Fascism: The Secret History of the American Left, From Mussolini to the Politics of Meaning Hardcover – January 8, 2008​


by Jonah Goldberg (Author)


“Fascists,” “Brownshirts,” “jackbooted stormtroopers”—such are the insults typically hurled at conservatives by their liberal opponents. Calling someone a fascist is the fastest way to shut them up, defining their views as beyond the political pale. But who are the real fascists in our midst?


Liberal Fascism offers a startling new perspective on the theories and practices that define fascist politics. Replacing conveniently manufactured myths with surprising and enlightening research, Jonah Goldberg reminds us that the original fascists were really on the left, and that liberals from Woodrow Wilson to FDR to Hillary Clinton have advocated policies and principles remarkably similar to those of Hitler's National Socialism and Mussolini's Fascism.

Contrary to what most people think, the Nazis were ardent socialists (hence the term “National socialism”). They believed in free health care and guaranteed jobs. They confiscated inherited wealth and spent vast sums on public education. They purged the church from public policy, promoted a new form of pagan spirituality, and inserted the authority of the state into every nook and cranny of daily life. The Nazis declared war on smoking, supported abortion, euthanasia, and gun control. They loathed the free market, provided generous pensions for the elderly, and maintained a strict racial quota system in their universities—where campus speech codes were all the rage. The Nazis led the world in organic farming and alternative medicine. Hitler was a strict vegetarian, and Himmler was an animal rights activist.

Do these striking parallels mean that today’s liberals are genocidal maniacs, intent on conquering the world and imposing a new racial order? Not at all. Yet it is hard to deny that modern progressivism and classical fascism shared the same intellectual roots. We often forget, for example, that Mussolini and Hitler had many admirers in the United States. W.E.B. Du Bois was inspired by Hitler's Germany, and Irving Berlin praised Mussolini in song. Many fascist tenets were espoused by American progressives like John Dewey and Woodrow Wilson, and FDR incorporated fascist policies in the New Deal.

Fascism was an international movement that appeared in different forms in different countries, depending on the vagaries of national culture and temperament. In Germany, fascism appeared as genocidal racist nationalism. In America, it took a “friendlier,” more liberal form. The modern heirs of this “friendly fascist” tradition include the New York Times, the Democratic Party, the Ivy League professoriate, and the liberals of Hollywood. The quintessential Liberal Fascist isn't an SS storm trooper; it is a female grade school teacher with an education degree from Brown or Swarthmore.

These assertions may sound strange to modern ears, but that is because we have forgotten what fascism is. In this angry, funny, smart, contentious book, Jonah Goldberg turns our preconceptions inside out and shows us the true meaning of Liberal Fascism.

https://www.amazon.com/Liberal-Fascism-American-Mussolini-Politics/

I've always known what happened in 1920's-1930's Germany could happen anywhere, anytime - that all nations and societies can be susceptible to adopting and acting on this and similar ideologies.

yes, any nation can adopt this kind of thinking if the Oligarchs at the Top wanna go that direction.

basically that is the direction of the usa, the Oligarchs create events like 911 and then say we need to cut Liberty by introducing the Patriot Act (misnamed of course) and then fund the 'terrorism wars'.

the sheep have no clue, which is standard equipment for sheep on this and EVERY forum i visit. LOL, some of them even think i am pushing this deranged......meh never mind.

blessings all. hope you can get yur facts straight and continue.

bye.

.
 
fascists don't care which party they use to gain power, there is a good study of nazism that basically supports the Idea that the nazis were hard core Leftists.

a view i hold


View attachment 67538984

Liberal Fascism: The Secret History of the American Left, From Mussolini to the Politics of Meaning Hardcover – January 8, 2008​


by Jonah Goldberg (Author)


“Fascists,” “Brownshirts,” “jackbooted stormtroopers”—such are the insults typically hurled at conservatives by their liberal opponents. Calling someone a fascist is the fastest way to shut them up, defining their views as beyond the political pale. But who are the real fascists in our midst?

Liberal Fascism offers a startling new perspective on the theories and practices that define fascist politics. Replacing conveniently manufactured myths with surprising and enlightening research, Jonah Goldberg reminds us that the original fascists were really on the left, and that liberals from Woodrow Wilson to FDR to Hillary Clinton have advocated policies and principles remarkably similar to those of Hitler's National Socialism and Mussolini's Fascism.

Contrary to what most people think, the Nazis were ardent socialists (hence the term “National socialism”). They believed in free health care and guaranteed jobs. They confiscated inherited wealth and spent vast sums on public education. They purged the church from public policy, promoted a new form of pagan spirituality, and inserted the authority of the state into every nook and cranny of daily life. The Nazis declared war on smoking, supported abortion, euthanasia, and gun control. They loathed the free market, provided generous pensions for the elderly, and maintained a strict racial quota system in their universities—where campus speech codes were all the rage. The Nazis led the world in organic farming and alternative medicine. Hitler was a strict vegetarian, and Himmler was an animal rights activist.

Do these striking parallels mean that today’s liberals are genocidal maniacs, intent on conquering the world and imposing a new racial order? Not at all. Yet it is hard to deny that modern progressivism and classical fascism shared the same intellectual roots. We often forget, for example, that Mussolini and Hitler had many admirers in the United States. W.E.B. Du Bois was inspired by Hitler's Germany, and Irving Berlin praised Mussolini in song. Many fascist tenets were espoused by American progressives like John Dewey and Woodrow Wilson, and FDR incorporated fascist policies in the New Deal.

Fascism was an international movement that appeared in different forms in different countries, depending on the vagaries of national culture and temperament. In Germany, fascism appeared as genocidal racist nationalism. In America, it took a “friendlier,” more liberal form. The modern heirs of this “friendly fascist” tradition include the New York Times, the Democratic Party, the Ivy League professoriate, and the liberals of Hollywood. The quintessential Liberal Fascist isn't an SS storm trooper; it is a female grade school teacher with an education degree from Brown or Swarthmore.

These assertions may sound strange to modern ears, but that is because we have forgotten what fascism is. In this angry, funny, smart, contentious book, Jonah Goldberg turns our preconceptions inside out and shows us the true meaning of Liberal Fascism.

https://www.amazon.com/Liberal-Fascism-American-Mussolini-Politics/



yes, any nation can adopt this kind of thinking if the Oligarchs at the Top wanna go that direction.

basically that is the direction of the usa, the Oligarchs create events like 911 and then say we need to cut Liberty by introducing the Patriot Act (misnamed of course) and then fund the 'terrorism wars'.

the sheep have no clue, which is standard equipment for sheep on this and EVERY forum i visit. LOL, some of them even think i am pushing this deranged......meh never mind.

blessings all. hope you can get yur facts straight and continue.

bye.

.
Strange. Hitler went after socialists and communists. What was he thinking? And he presided over construction of the autobahn while Ike presided over construction of the interstate system. Coincidence or something more ominous? Both Adolf Hitler and Cesar Chavez were vegetarians, didn’t like people smoking in their presence, and played with German shepherds. Ominous.

Suggest you go with another theme.
 
Strange. Hitler went after socialists and communists. What was he thinking? And he presided over construction of the autobahn while Ike presided over construction of the interstate system. Coincidence or something more ominous? Both Adolf Hitler and Cesar Chavez were vegetarians, didn’t like people smoking in their presence, and played with German shepherds. Ominous.

cut to the chase.

Left and Right are artificial constructs that work with the Dialectic left vs right. so let's drop that and get with the Real moral issue: Right vs Wrong.

when i look at a political issue as a Christian, it is NOT left or right politics but Right of Wrong and True of False.

in this Election my issue is Baby Killing and abortion, my faith says abortion is Wrong, Wrong Wrong. doesn't matter if a Blue/Red criminal waffles on the issue, it is still wrong.

with political thinking like that, most issues are Easy Peasy. and it doesn't really matter if hitler was Right or Left.

what matters is that hitler was: WRONG, immoral, murderer and despicable to throw a few descriptors at the guy.

Suggest you go with another theme.

i did and came up with a BETTER way to judge the issue or most other issues here at DP

maybe i can find an Expert article on this and pound the Pulpit on this over in Beliefs.


blessings. bye


.
 
cut to the chase.

Left and Right are artificial constructs that work with the Dialectic left vs right. so let's drop that and get with the Real moral issue: Right vs Wrong.

when i look at a political issue as a Christian, it is NOT left or right politics but Right of Wrong and True of False.

in this Election my issue is Baby Killing and abortion, my faith says abortion is Wrong, Wrong Wrong. doesn't matter if a Blue/Red criminal waffles on the issue, it is still wrong.

with political thinking like that, most issues are Easy Peasy. and it doesn't really matter if hitler was Right or Left.

what matters is that hitler was: WRONG, immoral, murderer and despicable to throw a few descriptors at the guy.



i did and came up with a BETTER way to judge the issue or most other issues here at DP

maybe i can find an Expert article on this and pound the Pulpit on this over in Beliefs.


blessings. bye


.
Actually, what you say is a good way of looking at things. On abortion, I am pro-choice, but believe that Clinton put it well when he said that abortions should be “safe, legal, and rare.” My problem with some conservatives on the issue is that they often oppose sex ed and making birth control more accessible, things that might make abortions less frequent. Question, not a challenge, for you: My wife and I terminated a pregnancy some years ago when tests showed fatal fetal abnormalities. (We had a ceremony afterward, attended by a Catholic priest and former priests friends of mine, planted a tree and wildflowers.) The child would have died in her womb had we not done so. Regarding your position, if you were in charge, what hoops would we have had to jump through to get permission to terminate the pregnancy?
 
Actually, what you say is a good way of looking at things.

thank you. we need a Good Thread on the Dialectic and how the Fascists/others/Oligarchs use that to control people. divide and conquer is an easier elementary way of saying almost what it means.

thesis > anti thesis > synthesis for the desired outcome they wanted all along, in fact if there is no opposition they will create 'controlled opposition' to their plans. thus controlling both sides of the conflict, kinda handy in controlling people.

i believe Fox news to be Controlled opposition to CNN/CNBC news. Tucker was fired because he was a Real Conservative beyond his paycheck, so he is tossed under the bus and Fox news shows real controlled opposition colors.


On abortion, I am pro-choice, but believe that Clinton put it well when he said that abortions should be “safe, legal, and rare.”

better than, kill them all and let God sort them out; but not by much.


My problem with some conservatives on the issue is that they often oppose sex ed and making birth control more accessible, things that might make abortions less frequent.

sex ed should not be taught in schools because it undermines a child's faith.



SNIP, 5000 words....

 
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