The NEW NAFTA

[Pedestrian]

Looking at the trade deal President Donald Trump struck with Mexico this week, you might ask, "A Republican did this?" Yes, a GOP president and supposed conservative wants to replace the North American Free Trade Agreement with a pact that may as well have been dictated by Big Labor.

Trade deals are intended to foster more vigorous commerce between nations and lower prices for consumers.

This new NAFTA, if approved, would do the opposite. Trump has built in a number of protectionist measures that will surely curtail trade between the two nations and sharply drive up the cost of automobiles.

This is protectionism at its worst.

Why ? Because it's to try and protect labor instead of what trade deals really do...protect capital. (profits)

I guess that protectionism is just ok, like ICs, (integrated circuits) Harley Davidson, (years back) and US Steel in the 70s
to mention just 3.

I am not against this deal, so let's see if the capitalist majority in congress approves this. I say they do not.

Canada wants to talk. Again...we'll see.

Car buyers will pay for new NAFTA deal

 

[LincolnRossiter]

Looking at the trade deal President Donald Trump struck with Mexico this week, you might ask, "A Republican did this?" Yes, a GOP president and supposed conservative wants to replace the North American Free Trade Agreement with a pact that may as well have been dictated by Big Labor.

Trade deals are intended to foster more vigorous commerce between nations and lower prices for consumers.

This new NAFTA, if approved, would do the opposite. Trump has built in a number of protectionist measures that will surely curtail trade between the two nations and sharply drive up the cost of automobiles.

This is protectionism at its worst.

Why ? Because it's to try and protect labor instead of what trade deals really do...protect capital. (profits)

I guess that protectionism is just ok, like ICs, (integrated circuits) Harley Davidson, (years back) and US Steel in the 70s
to mention just 3.

I am not against this deal, so let's see if the capitalist majority in congress approves this. I say they do not.

Canada wants to talk. Again...we'll see.

Car buyers will pay for new NAFTA deal

Early prediction...these modifications are DOA. If they make it through the Canadians, they won't make it through Congress. And that's irrespective of whether the Dems take power in the house in January or not. Dems will oppose them because they hate Trump. And there are enough free trade Republicans left to oppose them on principle.

 

[Howard the Duck]

Early prediction...these modifications are DOA. If they make it through the Canadians, they won't make it through Congress. And that's irrespective of whether the Dems take power in the house in January or not. Dems will oppose them because they hate Trump. And there are enough free trade Republicans left to oppose them on principle.

The house has nothing to do with ratifying treaties.

 

[Grand Mal]

Early prediction...these modifications are DOA. If they make it through the Canadians, they won't make it through Congress. And that's irrespective of whether the Dems take power in the house in January or not. Dems will oppose them because they hate Trump. And there are enough free trade Republicans left to oppose them on principle.

Trump has put a deadline on the deal- Canada has to buy in by Friday (tomorrow). There's a threat built in, tariffs on cars coming into the US from Canada.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/freeland-nafta-lighthizer-washington-1.4802992

Basically, Canada is being pressured to buy into a deal that was reached without them at the table, and apparently Trump feels urgency to have it signed. My guess- some general, agreement-in-principle deal will be reached, Trump will announce that he's got the job done and details will be worked out behind closed doors so something can go to Congress before November.

 

[LincolnRossiter]

The house has nothing to do with ratifying treaties.

NAFTA's a trade agreement. Not a treaty as such. It had to be passed by the house originally (it was passed 234-200 in November, 1993), so changes will have to be approved by the House (and Senate, of course).

Glad to help.

 

[Casper]

Looking at the trade deal President Donald Trump struck with Mexico this week, you might ask, "A Republican did this?" Yes, a GOP president and supposed conservative wants to replace the North American Free Trade Agreement with a pact that may as well have been dictated by Big Labor.

Trade deals are intended to foster more vigorous commerce between nations and lower prices for consumers.

This new NAFTA, if approved, would do the opposite. Trump has built in a number of protectionist measures that will surely curtail trade between the two nations and sharply drive up the cost of automobiles.

This is protectionism at its worst.

Why ? Because it's to try and protect labor instead of what trade deals really do...protect capital. (profits)

I guess that protectionism is just ok, like ICs, (integrated circuits) Harley Davidson, (years back) and US Steel in the 70s
to mention just 3.

I am not against this deal, so let's see if the capitalist majority in congress approves this. I say they do not.

Canada wants to talk. Again...we'll see.

Car buyers will pay for new NAFTA deal

No deal has been approved by those that matter, it is not NAFTA since it is only with the Mexicans and Canada is not going to go along with the "deal" the Mexican President made, which also has to be approved by the Mexican government.
No, regardless of the details, this is faaar from a done deal.

 

[Mycroft]

Looking at the trade deal President Donald Trump struck with Mexico this week, you might ask, "A Republican did this?" Yes, a GOP president and supposed conservative wants to replace the North American Free Trade Agreement with a pact that may as well have been dictated by Big Labor.

Trade deals are intended to foster more vigorous commerce between nations and lower prices for consumers.

This new NAFTA, if approved, would do the opposite. Trump has built in a number of protectionist measures that will surely curtail trade between the two nations and sharply drive up the cost of automobiles.

This is protectionism at its worst.

Why ? Because it's to try and protect labor instead of what trade deals really do...protect capital. (profits)

I guess that protectionism is just ok, like ICs, (integrated circuits) Harley Davidson, (years back) and US Steel in the 70s
to mention just 3.

I am not against this deal, so let's see if the capitalist majority in congress approves this. I say they do not.

Canada wants to talk. Again...we'll see.

Car buyers will pay for new NAFTA deal

You see...that's the beauty of this US-Mexico deal...it has something everyone wants (except Canada, maybe).

Republicans: US economic boosts, potential for businesses to move back to the US, more employment, increased tax revenue

Democrats: Union support and wage increases (in Mexico, at least).

Mexico: Agriculture advantages, wage increases, union incentives.

Trump: Increased content of origin, IP protections, periodic renegotiation, eliminate tariffs and subsidies and a lot more. All stuff he campaigned on.

Now...to be clear, this isn't a "New NAFTA". It's a deal between the US and Mexico. Canada, if they choose to, can sign on to it. If they don't, then the old NAFTA is dead and Canada will have to negotiate their own, separate deal with the US and their own deal with Mexico.

Whether Congress approves this US-Mexico deal depends. As you say, they might want to "stick it to Trump" and outright oppose it. If they do, though, they will pay a steep political price because they will, in effect, be telling everyone that they don't care about the American economy, American workers, the Mexican economy or Mexican workers. That might play well with their useful idiot leftwing nutjobs, but the workers, the businesses and Wall Street will rip them a new one. 2020 will be a very bad election year for those who oppose this deal, whether they are Republicans or Democrats.

Canada? Because of their own actions, they have been put between a rock and a hard place. If they don't sign on to this deal, Trump will slap 25% tariffs on autos they export to the US. If they do sign on, this is what they have to agree to:

open their telecommunications and banking sector (eliminate non tariff barriers).
eliminate soft-wood (lumber) and aeronautics subsidies.
begin a process of lowering their assembly use of Chinese/Asian goods.
accept the rules of origin for North American manufacturing.
eliminate protectionist tariffs on dairy and farm products.
accept the U.S-Mexico terms for arbitration and dispute resolution.​

They don't like either choice. It'll be interesting to see how that works out.

 

[danarhea]

No deal has been approved by those that matter, it is not NAFTA since it is only with the Mexicans and Canada is not going to go along with the "deal" the Mexican President made, which also has to be approved by the Mexican government.
No, regardless of the details, this is faaar from a done deal.

Actually, the US and Mexico have only agreed on a framework. The US and North Korea also agreed on a framework, but we saw how that went. Let me see if the US and Mexico can agree on the details, which they have not even started working on yet. So, at this time, in other words, where's the beef?

 

[Visbek]

I prefer the phrase "I Can't Believe It's Not NAFTA!"

Trump has put a deadline on the deal- Canada has to buy in by Friday (tomorrow).

Trump didn't set the deadline. The deadline is because of the Mexican elections. The new president takes office on December 1st, and there is a 90 day delay between approving the changes and the earliest signature date. If the deal isn't signed by Friday, then it's the responsibility of the new president of Mexico. He's making sounds that he will sign it, but... who knows? Pena Nieto is immune to public pressure, because he's out of office; Lopez Obrador doesn't have that luxury. The more likely problem, though, is that AMLO will make a few extra demands.

Trump can't just cancel NAFTA, and strike a bilateral deal with Mexico, on his own. They both require acts of Congress, who is already making noise that Canada must be included. Mexico also wants a trilateral deal, not bilateral.

I.e. it's the typical Trump botch job, the biggest wuss in town trying to act all tough (typical bully behavior) while everyone around him is trying to be an adult, and get a PR win out of basically making no major changes to NAFTA.

 

[Casper]

Actually, the US and Mexico have only agreed on a framework. The US and North Korea also agreed on a framework, but we saw how that went. Let me see if the US and Mexico can agree on the details, which they have not even started working on yet. So, at this time, in other words, where's the beef?

Correct, so far it is all pie in the sky.

 

[Casper]

You see...that's the beauty of this US-Mexico deal...it has something everyone wants (except Canada, maybe).

Republicans: US economic boosts, potential for businesses to move back to the US, more employment, increased tax revenue

Democrats: Union support and wage increases (in Mexico, at least).

Mexico: Agriculture advantages, wage increases, union incentives.

Trump: Increased content of origin, IP protections, periodic renegotiation, eliminate tariffs and subsidies and a lot more. All stuff he campaigned on.

Now...to be clear, this isn't a "New NAFTA". It's a deal between the US and Mexico. Canada, if they choose to, can sign on to it. If they don't, then the old NAFTA is dead and Canada will have to negotiate their own, separate deal with the US and their own deal with Mexico.

Whether Congress approves this US-Mexico deal depends. As you say, they might want to "stick it to Trump" and outright oppose it. If they do, though, they will pay a steep political price because they will, in effect, be telling everyone that they don't care about the American economy, American workers, the Mexican economy or Mexican workers. That might play well with their useful idiot leftwing nutjobs, but the workers, the businesses and Wall Street will rip them a new one. 2020 will be a very bad election year for those who oppose this deal, whether they are Republicans or Democrats.

Canada? Because of their own actions, they have been put between a rock and a hard place. If they don't sign on to this deal, Trump will slap 25% tariffs on autos they export to the US. If they do sign on, this is what they have to agree to:

open their telecommunications and banking sector (eliminate non tariff barriers).
eliminate soft-wood (lumber) and aeronautics subsidies.
begin a process of lowering their assembly use of Chinese/Asian goods.
accept the rules of origin for North American manufacturing.
eliminate protectionist tariffs on dairy and farm products.
accept the U.S-Mexico terms for arbitration and dispute resolution.​

They don't like either choice. It'll be interesting to see how that works out.

Interesting until it starts costing the American People. So far trump had made no deals, broken a few, yes, made any, nope. Sooner or later even the trump supporters are going to realize that trump has no idea how to negotiate actual deals.

 

[WarmPotato]

Trump can't get anything done until we learn the results of the midterms... (everyone is worried about re-election)

 

[Mycroft]

Interesting until it starts costing the American People. So far trump had made no deals, broken a few, yes, made any, nope. Sooner or later even the trump supporters are going to realize that trump has no idea how to negotiate actual deals.

The US-Mexico deal is complete. It encompasses thousands of pages. The only thing holding it up is giving Canada a bit of time to decide if they are onboard with it, then submitting it to Congress and Congress approving or not.

The negotiations are a done deal.

If it is approved, it will be a benefit to both the US and Mexico.

 

[LincolnRossiter]

The US-Mexico deal is complete.

The only thing holding it up is...Canada deciding if they are onboard

[and] Congress approving or not.

So what you're saying is it's about as "done" as DPRK's denuclearization was.

Thanks for the fresh take, as always.

 

[Mycroft]

So what you're saying is it's as about as "done" as DPRK's denuclearization was.

No, that's not what I said. Do you have a reading comprehension problem?

(It would probably help with your problem if you actually read everything I said instead of cutting snippets and reading those...as you did in the quote.)

 

[LincolnRossiter]

No, that's not what I said. Do you have a reading comprehension problem?

(It would probably help with your problem if you actually read everything I said instead of cutting snippets and reading those...as you did in the quote.)

I don't believe I have a reading comprehension problem. You wrote that a deal with Mexico was complete. You followed that up with the qualification that "the negotiations are done." And you further qualified that they were "done," save the very necessary and very uncertain concurrence of two deeply interested parties (the Canadian government and Congress).

So your original assertion about anything being "done" is entirely inaccurate.

I, too, have observed that reading comprehension is a problem on the interwebs. Apparently, so is the clear conveyance of information.

 

[Bucky]

Trump has put a deadline on the deal- Canada has to buy in by Friday (tomorrow). There's a threat built in, tariffs on cars coming into the US from Canada.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/freeland-nafta-lighthizer-washington-1.4802992

Basically, Canada is being pressured to buy into a deal that was reached without them at the table, and apparently Trump feels urgency to have it signed. My guess- some general, agreement-in-principle deal will be reached, Trump will announce that he's got the job done and details will be worked out behind closed doors so something can go to Congress before November.

Looking at the trade deal President Donald Trump struck with Mexico this week, you might ask, "A Republican did this?" Yes, a GOP president and supposed conservative wants to replace the North American Free Trade Agreement with a pact that may as well have been dictated by Big Labor.

Trade deals are intended to foster more vigorous commerce between nations and lower prices for consumers.

This new NAFTA, if approved, would do the opposite. Trump has built in a number of protectionist measures that will surely curtail trade between the two nations and sharply drive up the cost of automobiles.

This is protectionism at its worst.

Why ? Because it's to try and protect labor instead of what trade deals really do...protect capital. (profits)

I guess that protectionism is just ok, like ICs, (integrated circuits) Harley Davidson, (years back) and US Steel in the 70s
to mention just 3.

I am not against this deal, so let's see if the capitalist majority in congress approves this. I say they do not.

Canada wants to talk. Again...we'll see.

Car buyers will pay for new NAFTA deal

No deal has been approved by those that matter, it is not NAFTA since it is only with the Mexicans and Canada is not going to go along with the "deal" the Mexican President made, which also has to be approved by the Mexican government.
No, regardless of the details, this is faaar from a done deal.

I am calling it right now. A deal with Canada will be completed within the next 24 hours. Expect a deal with China before the new year.

The news from the Financial Markets is even better than anticipated. For all of you that have made a fortune in the markets, or seen your 401k’s rise beyond your wildest expectations, more good news is coming!


https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/30/tru...those-who-have-made-a-fortune-in-markets.html

In Trump we Trust!

 

[Casper]

I am calling it right now. A deal with Canada will be completed within the next 24 hours. Expect a deal with China before the new year.

The news from the Financial Markets is even better than anticipated. For all of you that have made a fortune in the markets, or seen your 401k’s rise beyond your wildest expectations, more good news is coming!


https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/30/tru...those-who-have-made-a-fortune-in-markets.html

In Trump we Trust!

Well if You say do Bucky, me thinks you are beginning to like getting egged. See ya in 24.....

 

[Bucky]

Well if You say do Bucky, me thinks you are beginning to like getting egged. See ya in 24.....

I will be here and I am confident a deal will be done!

 

[Casper]

I will be here and I am confident a deal will be done!

Good luck....,.

 

[Mycroft]

I don't believe I have a reading comprehension problem. You wrote that a deal with Mexico was complete. You followed that up with the qualification that "the negotiations are done." And you further qualified that they were "done," save the very necessary and very uncertain concurrence of two deeply interested parties (the Canadian government and Congress).

So your original assertion about anything being "done" is entirely inaccurate.

I, too, have observed that reading comprehension is a problem on the interwebs. Apparently, so is the clear conveyance of information.

Whether Canada joins in or not won't stop the US-Mexico deal from being submitted to Congress. Trump is giving them a limited amount of time (their deadline is tomorrow) to decide.

In any case, my point...the one you ignored...is that the negotiations between the US and Mexico are over. The deal between the two countries has been made and is only waiting on Congress.

So yes...you do have a reading comprehension problem.

 

[LincolnRossiter]

Whether Canada joins in or not won't stop the US-Mexico deal from being submitted to Congress. Trump is giving them a limited amount of time (their deadline is tomorrow) to decide.

In any case, my point...the one you ignored...is that the negotiations between the US and Mexico are over. The deal between the two countries has been made and is only waiting on Congress.

So yes...you do have a reading comprehension problem.

The negotiations between the US and Mexico are over when all parties are satisfied with the terms. Maybe you just have a “being a dumb-dumb” problem.

Not my call, though.

 

[Grand Mal]

I am calling it right now. A deal with Canada will be completed within the next 24 hours. Expect a deal with China before the new year.

The news from the Financial Markets is even better than anticipated. For all of you that have made a fortune in the markets, or seen your 401k’s rise beyond your wildest expectations, more good news is coming!


https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/30/tru...those-who-have-made-a-fortune-in-markets.html

In Trump we Trust!

Depends what you call a deal. A general agreement-in-principle with Trump declaring victory? Sure. Doesn't matter what happens after, it'll be someone else's fault. A trade agreement between three countries with all the 'i's dotted and 't's crossed? Forget it. There's no deal on earth that'll pass three legislatures and still let Trump declare victory. He's still gonna be threatening tariffs when the mid-terms roll along and the House changes hands.

 

[Grand Mal]

Whether Canada joins in or not won't stop the US-Mexico deal from being submitted to Congress. Trump is giving them a limited amount of time (their deadline is tomorrow) to decide.

In any case, my point...the one you ignored...is that the negotiations between the US and Mexico are over. The deal between the two countries has been made and is only waiting on Congress.

So yes...you do have a reading comprehension problem.

The Mexico deal has been sent to Congress? You sure about that?

 

[ElChupacabra]

The negotiations between the US and Mexico are over when all parties are satisfied with the terms. Maybe you just have a “being a dumb-dumb” problem.

Not my call, though.

Yep. The US administration is trying to pressure Mexico and Canada to sign so Pena Nieto can be the one to approve it for Mexico, but they're not there yet.