The hypocrisy of the pro-life movement

[j brown's body]

"The traditional pro-life argument comes from different religious and secular sources, but they all rest on a common belief: From the moment of conception, an unborn child is a separate human life. ...From that standpoint, the Alabama Supreme Court’s decision in February holding that the state’s wrongful death statute applied to embryos frozen and preserved as part of the in vitro fertilization process should not have been surprising at all. ...First, Alabama Republicans panicked. The Republican-dominated Legislature raced to pass a law that granted I.V.F. clinics sweeping immunity from the state’s wrongful death statute.

On Wednesday, Trump reversed his previous position supporting a 20-week ban on abortion; ...he said the policy should instead be left up to the states. ...Trump’s advice to voters was to “follow your heart” and “do what’s right for your family, and do what’s right for yourself.” It’s “all about the will of the people,” he said. This is the most pro-choice position a Republican presidential candidate has taken since at least Gerald Ford. And how did the pro-life establishment respond? With mild criticism, but also with immediate support. As Politico reported this week, “Susan B. Anthony Pro-Life America, Students for Life, the Faith and Freedom Coalition, the Family Research Council, National Right to Life and CatholicVote reiterated their commitment Monday morning to electing Trump.”

On Tuesday, the Arizona Supreme Court upheld a statute from 1864 prohibiting virtually all abortions in the state. The Arizona Republican Kari Lake, who is running for her party’s nomination for Senate, immediately disagreed with the ruling, a reversal of her previous position supporting the state abortion ban. She also posted a statement promising that she would not support a federal abortion ban if elected senator.

The Alabama court taught us that. It presented the pro-life movement with a decision squarely rooted in its own logic, and much of the Republican Party said no, and it said no as loudly and emphatically as it could. Is it any wonder that Trump followed suit? Is it any wonder that MAGA is following his lead? ...For more than 40 years, the Republican Party has made the case that life begins at conception. Alabama’s Supreme Court agreed. Yet the Republican Party can’t live with its own philosophy. There is no truly pro-life party in the United States."

Link

Its often so much easier to be against something than to be for something. What's the future of the pro-life movement?

 

[Airyaman]

As I've said multiple times, the GOP is not pro life, they are pro-fetus. Once the child is born, it's on it's own. Plus, they are mostly pro death penalty, so again, not pro life.

 

[Integrityrespec]

"The traditional pro-life argument comes from different religious and secular sources, but they all rest on a common belief: From the moment of conception, an unborn child is a separate human life. ...From that standpoint, the Alabama Supreme Court’s decision in February holding that the state’s wrongful death statute applied to embryos frozen and preserved as part of the in vitro fertilization process should not have been surprising at all. ...First, Alabama Republicans panicked. The Republican-dominated Legislature raced to pass a law that granted I.V.F. clinics sweeping immunity from the state’s wrongful death statute.

On Wednesday, Trump reversed his previous position supporting a 20-week ban on abortion; ...he said the policy should instead be left up to the states. ...Trump’s advice to voters was to “follow your heart” and “do what’s right for your family, and do what’s right for yourself.” It’s “all about the will of the people,” he said. This is the most pro-choice position a Republican presidential candidate has taken since at least Gerald Ford. And how did the pro-life establishment respond? With mild criticism, but also with immediate support. As Politico reported this week, “Susan B. Anthony Pro-Life America, Students for Life, the Faith and Freedom Coalition, the Family Research Council, National Right to Life and CatholicVote reiterated their commitment Monday morning to electing Trump.”

On Tuesday, the Arizona Supreme Court upheld a statute from 1864 prohibiting virtually all abortions in the state. The Arizona Republican Kari Lake, who is running for her party’s nomination for Senate, immediately disagreed with the ruling, a reversal of her previous position supporting the state abortion ban. She also posted a statement promising that she would not support a federal abortion ban if elected senator.

The Alabama court taught us that. It presented the pro-life movement with a decision squarely rooted in its own logic, and much of the Republican Party said no, and it said no as loudly and emphatically as it could. Is it any wonder that Trump followed suit? Is it any wonder that MAGA is following his lead? ...For more than 40 years, the Republican Party has made the case that life begins at conception. Alabama’s Supreme Court agreed. Yet the Republican Party can’t live with its own philosophy. There is no truly pro-life party in the United States."

Link

Its often so much easier to be against something than to be for something. What's the future of the pro-life movement?

Be honest. You just want to kill babies in the womb because they inconvenience you. You have the ability in your state to vote on how you want "reproductive rights" to look. In some areas they will be more liberal, in some more regulated. So the people get to decide. I know you don't want the people to decide you want government to decide everything that you want or what you don't want. The rest of us have to put up with your crap. Now we all can structure our state around how we feel on this issue.

 

[Bok Tuklo]

As I've said multiple times, the GOP is not pro life, they are pro-fetus. Once the child is born, it's on it's own. Plus, they are mostly pro death penalty, so again, not pro life.

Oh, they don't even care about individuals in the womb. They will cut pre-natal care for thousands in a heartbeat if it meant Jeff Bezos could buy another gold toilet.

 

[BabaVoss]

"The traditional pro-life argument comes from different religious and secular sources, but they all rest on a common belief: From the moment of conception, an unborn child is a separate human life. ...From that standpoint, the Alabama Supreme Court’s decision in February holding that the state’s wrongful death statute applied to embryos frozen and preserved as part of the in vitro fertilization process should not have been surprising at all. ...First, Alabama Republicans panicked. The Republican-dominated Legislature raced to pass a law that granted I.V.F. clinics sweeping immunity from the state’s wrongful death statute.

On Wednesday, Trump reversed his previous position supporting a 20-week ban on abortion; ...he said the policy should instead be left up to the states. ...Trump’s advice to voters was to “follow your heart” and “do what’s right for your family, and do what’s right for yourself.” It’s “all about the will of the people,” he said. This is the most pro-choice position a Republican presidential candidate has taken since at least Gerald Ford. And how did the pro-life establishment respond? With mild criticism, but also with immediate support. As Politico reported this week, “Susan B. Anthony Pro-Life America, Students for Life, the Faith and Freedom Coalition, the Family Research Council, National Right to Life and CatholicVote reiterated their commitment Monday morning to electing Trump.”

On Tuesday, the Arizona Supreme Court upheld a statute from 1864 prohibiting virtually all abortions in the state. The Arizona Republican Kari Lake, who is running for her party’s nomination for Senate, immediately disagreed with the ruling, a reversal of her previous position supporting the state abortion ban. She also posted a statement promising that she would not support a federal abortion ban if elected senator.

The Alabama court taught us that. It presented the pro-life movement with a decision squarely rooted in its own logic, and much of the Republican Party said no, and it said no as loudly and emphatically as it could. Is it any wonder that Trump followed suit? Is it any wonder that MAGA is following his lead? ...For more than 40 years, the Republican Party has made the case that life begins at conception. Alabama’s Supreme Court agreed. Yet the Republican Party can’t live with its own philosophy. There is no truly pro-life party in the United States."

Link

Its often so much easier to be against something than to be for something. What's the future of the pro-life movement?

The MAGAs follow trump. When he talks about “the will of the people”, it never occurs to them how ironic it is - that they want to force everyone to conform to their beliefs while pretending to be all about ‘the will of the people”. It’s just a lie. We should respect people’s personal liberty and get the government out of these kinds of decisions.

Americans deserve better than the MAGA stupidity.

 

[j brown's body]

Be honest. You just want to kill babies in the womb because they inconvenience you. You have the ability in your state to vote on how you want "reproductive rights" to look. In some areas they will be more liberal, in some more regulated. So the people get to decide. I know you don't want the people to decide you want government to decide everything that you want or what you don't want. The rest of us have to put up with your crap. Now we all can structure our state around how we feel on this issue.

What do up think of the pro-life political leaders who are opposing the pro-life laws?

 

[j brown's body]

The MAGAs follow trump. When he talks about “the will of the people”, it never occurs to them how ironic it is - that they want to force everyone to conform to their beliefs while pretending to be all about ‘the will of the people”. It’s just a lie. We should respect people’s personal liberty and get the government out of these kinds of decisions.

Americans deserve better than the MAGA stupidity.

It's interesting that two of Trump's major accomplishments, overturning Roe and getting the vaccine out quickly, are now two issues he needs to run from.

 

[MSgt]

Be honest. You just want to kill babies in the womb because they inconvenience you.

Sure. It's also about saving the mom's health against a dying baby, so that she can maybe still, later, have babies. It's also about being raped. It's also about not being your business.

The sad thing about all of this "outrage" for the little babies is that you don't really give a damn. Like so many others, you are just caught up in yet another mindless conservative movement that is, yet again, proving its potential for damage (NeoCon, Trickle-Down, Culture Wars). Now we can add abortion to the list of failed conservative ideology. As you can see across the country (if you allow yourself to look), your Red States have thoroughly screwed this up. Anti-IVF laws in Alabama? Nineteenth-century laws celebrated in Arizona? Don't Islamists like to turn back the clock? Oh, and Texas? Over 26,000 rape babies were born in Texas alone since they banned abortion. And why were these raped women forced to have their rapists' babies, so that they can raise him/her with hate? So that you, a non-birth giving male, can sit back, smile, and feel good about how you get to tell women to shut their mouths, spread their legs, and do their duty.

And the hypocritical thing? Were it you who had to have a rapist's baby, you would head to the closet and grab a coat hanger while screaming about how you have a Right to control your own body. But...conservatives, especially the males, rarely think beyond shallow ideology, even when it proves a spectacular failure.

 

[BabaVoss]

It's interesting that two of Trump's major accomplishments, overturning Roe and getting the vaccine out quickly, are now two issues he needs to run from.

Abortion: We had settled law that allowed American women to choose how to live their lives for fifty years. Now we have chaos in many states and are moving backwards.


As for the vaccines, I believe he did more harm than good by offering alternative quackery and questioning the effectiveness of teh vaccines he now takes credit for…

Trump had no role in creating the vaccines to fight Covid-19. There is nothing in the record that warrants him taking “credit” for the vaccines. A review of events shows immigrants and immigrant-led companies created the vaccines.

In January 2020, Moderna’s French-born CEO Stéphane Bancel, who came to the U.S. as an international student and later immigrated to America, led the company to design a Covid-19 vaccine in two days. On February 24, 2020, the company announced the release of “the first batch of mRNA-1273, the company’s vaccine against the novel coronavirus, for human use.” Vials were shipped to the National Institutes of Health (NIH) for a Phase 1 study.

Trump Takes Credit For Vaccine Created By Others, Including Immigrants

Donald Trump cannot take credit for the vaccines. The record shows immigrants and immigrant-led companies created the vaccines.

www.forbes.com

 

[BabaVoss]

Sure. It's also about saving the mom's health against a dying baby, so that she can maybe still, later, have babies. It's also about being raped. It's also about not being your business.

The sad thing about all of this "outrage" for the little babies is that you don't really give a damn. Like so many others, you are just caught up in yet another mindless conservative movement that is, yet again, proving its potential for damage (NeoCon, Trickle-Down, Culture Wars). Now we can add abortion to the list of failed conservative ideology. As you can see across the country (if you allow yourself to look), your Red States have thoroughly screwed this up. Anti-IVF laws in Alabama? Nineteenth-century laws celebrated in Arizona? Don't Islamists like to turn back the clock? Oh, and Texas? Over 26,000 rape babies were born in Texas alone since they banned abortion. And why were these raped women forced to have their rapists' babies, so that they can raise him/her with hate? So that you, a non-birth giving male, can sit back, smile, and feel good about how you get to tell women to shut their mouths, spread their legs, and do their duty.

And the hypocritical thing? Were it you who had to have a rapist's baby, you would head to the closet and grab a coat hanger while screaming about how you have a Right to control your own body. But...conservatives, especially the males, rarely think beyond shallow ideology, even when it proves a spectacular failure.

Excellent post.

 

[Bodecea]

Be honest. You just want to kill babies in the womb because they inconvenience you. You have the ability in your state to vote on how you want "reproductive rights" to look. In some areas they will be more liberal, in some more regulated. So the people get to decide. I know you don't want the people to decide you want government to decide everything that you want or what you don't want. The rest of us have to put up with your crap. Now we all can structure our state around how we feel on this issue.

Why don't YOU be honest and admit it's all about con-trolling women's bodies.

 

[Mr Person]

Of course they don't give a shit about 'life'. It's all about control. "Anti-choice" is the way to put it: they're against the ability of a woman to make decisions about childbirth. Gotta keep 'em chained to a bible, as interpreted by men.

 

[Bodecea]

Sure. It's also about saving the mom's health against a dying baby, so that she can maybe still, later, have babies. It's also about being raped. It's also about not being your business.

The sad thing about all of this "outrage" for the little babies is that you don't really give a damn. Like so many others, you are just caught up in yet another mindless conservative movement that is, yet again, proving its potential for damage (NeoCon, Trickle-Down, Culture Wars). Now we can add abortion to the list of failed conservative ideology. As you can see across the country (if you allow yourself to look), your Red States have thoroughly screwed this up. Anti-IVF laws in Alabama? Nineteenth-century laws celebrated in Arizona? Don't Islamists like to turn back the clock? Oh, and Texas? Over 26,000 rape babies were born in Texas alone since they banned abortion. And why were these raped women forced to have their rapists' babies, so that they can raise him/her with hate? So that you, a non-birth giving male, can sit back, smile, and feel good about how you get to tell women to shut their mouths, spread their legs, and do their duty.

And the hypocritical thing? Were it you who had to have a rapist's baby, you would head to the closet and grab a coat hanger while screaming about how you have a Right to control your own body. But...conservatives, especially the males, rarely think beyond shallow ideology, even when it proves a spectacular failure.

Well said....I'd only add Alito's reliance on the words of two 18th century witch-hunters in his decision to strike down Roe.

 

[MSgt]

Well said....I'd only add Alito's reliance on the words of two 18th century witch-hunters in his decision to strike down Roe.

And do you know what the true betrayal in all of this is? Anti-abortion fathers have daughters.

- It is not just "libs" who get raped.
- It is not just "libs" who run into medical complications and have to make the decision to abort (or die).
- It is not just "libs" who discover that there is something wrong with the fetus, which will destroy its quality of life.

But do they care? No. They tell their daughters everyday that they don't matter and that their lives are worth only a sacrifice for the ideological cause.

 

[MSgt]

Abortion: We had settled law that allowed American women to choose how to live their lives for fifty years. Now we have chaos in many states and are moving backwards.

I blame Democrats.

- They were too weak and allowed McConnell to deny Obama his choice for a Supreme Court Justice (a first in American history).
- They were too weak and abstained from voting for Hillary, thereby handing Trump three appointments.

And now? Not only did they lose the House to Republicans, just two years after they tried to steal the 2020 Presidential election, but are also dumb enough to flirt around with this Kennedy moron.

 

[j brown's body]

It's there a place for anti-abortionists in the Republican Party anymore?

 

[Binary_Digit]

"The traditional pro-life argument comes from different religious and secular sources, but they all rest on a common belief: From the moment of conception, an unborn child is a separate human life. ...From that standpoint, the Alabama Supreme Court’s decision in February holding that the state’s wrongful death statute applied to embryos frozen and preserved as part of the in vitro fertilization process should not have been surprising at all. ...First, Alabama Republicans panicked. The Republican-dominated Legislature raced to pass a law that granted I.V.F. clinics sweeping immunity from the state’s wrongful death statute.

On Wednesday, Trump reversed his previous position supporting a 20-week ban on abortion; ...he said the policy should instead be left up to the states. ...Trump’s advice to voters was to “follow your heart” and “do what’s right for your family, and do what’s right for yourself.” It’s “all about the will of the people,” he said. This is the most pro-choice position a Republican presidential candidate has taken since at least Gerald Ford. And how did the pro-life establishment respond? With mild criticism, but also with immediate support. As Politico reported this week, “Susan B. Anthony Pro-Life America, Students for Life, the Faith and Freedom Coalition, the Family Research Council, National Right to Life and CatholicVote reiterated their commitment Monday morning to electing Trump.”

On Tuesday, the Arizona Supreme Court upheld a statute from 1864 prohibiting virtually all abortions in the state. The Arizona Republican Kari Lake, who is running for her party’s nomination for Senate, immediately disagreed with the ruling, a reversal of her previous position supporting the state abortion ban. She also posted a statement promising that she would not support a federal abortion ban if elected senator.

The Alabama court taught us that. It presented the pro-life movement with a decision squarely rooted in its own logic, and much of the Republican Party said no, and it said no as loudly and emphatically as it could. Is it any wonder that Trump followed suit? Is it any wonder that MAGA is following his lead? ...For more than 40 years, the Republican Party has made the case that life begins at conception. Alabama’s Supreme Court agreed. Yet the Republican Party can’t live with its own philosophy. There is no truly pro-life party in the United States."

Link

Its often so much easier to be against something than to be for something. What's the future of the pro-life movement?

As I understand it, a 16 week abortion ban would prevent only about 6% of pre-Dobbs abortions. That's not enough for the hardline pro-lifers. On the other hand, a total ban from the moment of conception is too much for independents. So the dumb dog that caught the car now has to choose between pissing off the base or pissing off the independents. They put themselves between a rock and a hard place and they deserve every bit of it for refusing to think beyond their own nose.

But IMO the big hypocrisy is that they don't GAF about unwanted kids after they're born. Welfare to help single moms? Nope, not from my tax dollars. Free school lunches? Nope, not from my tax dollars. Financial subsidies and assistance for day care? Nope, not from my tax dollars. Incredibly selfish.

 

[Ginger Ale]

I blame Democrats.

- They were too weak and allowed McConnell to deny Obama his choice for a Supreme Court Justice (a first in American history).
- They were too weak and abstained from voting for Hillary, thereby handing Trump three appointments.

And now? Not only did they lose the House to Republicans, just two years after they tried to steal the 2020 Presidential election, but are also dumb enough to flirt around with this Kennedy moron.

A painful lesson indeed.

 

[Ginger Ale]

Of course they don't give a shit about 'life'. It's all about control. "Anti-choice" is the way to put it: they're against the ability of a woman to make decisions about childbirth. Gotta keep 'em chained to a bible, as interpreted by men.

B I N G O and we aren't the only ones they have plans for.
Birth control, same sex marriage, and no-fault divorce are among the likely targets for elimination in a second Trump term if Christian nationalists are able to leverage positions in the administration to impose their priorities. Heidi Przybyla, national investigative correspondent for Politico, discusses new reporting on the major players in the Christian nationalist movement making plans for a potential second Trump term.

 

[Blue Dog]

It was one thing to say the words BAN ABORTION and campaign on such a slogan.

It becomes a much different discussion when an actual law goes into effect.

 

[j brown's body]

I blame Democrats.

- They were too weak and allowed McConnell to deny Obama his choice for a Supreme Court Justice (a first in American history).
- They were too weak and abstained from voting for Hillary, thereby handing Trump three appointments.

And now? Not only did they lose the House to Republicans, just two years after they tried to steal the 2020 Presidential election, but are also dumb enough to flirt around with this Kennedy moron.

Not sure how you don't allow McConnell to do that. He had the power to do it and he did it.

 

[MSgt]

Not sure how you don't allow McConnell to do that. He had the power to do it and he did it.

It broke a Constitutional norm. McConnell knew that, but took the attitude that "nothing say's I can't do it." It was more of the same dirty tricks that Republicans have been doing for years to assume power. From the Supreme Court slapping down racial gerrymandering cases, to actually trying to physically steal a Presidential election, the GOP has abandoned all sense of decorum and standard. Their Party leader, Donald Trump, actually argued that he never swore an oath to support the Constitution of the United States. I mean, fricken' what?!?! And their constituents love them for this treacherous and anti-American behavior.

In the meantime, Democrats are historically weak against everything. Doesn't matter what legislation they get passed. What common sense they preach. How better the economy and jobs look under them as compared to Republicans. They can never sell themselves or defend themselves. Check it:

- Johnson blows the door off into Vietnam to "fight communism," and Republicans still sell Democrats as communists, Marxists, but "weak on communism." Huh?!

- Republicans start two mismanaged wars, accusing Democrats of not supporting the Troop for wanting evidence over Iraq, Obama and Biden see us out of those wars, yet Republicans call the Democrats the "warmongers."


And what do Democrats do? Merely take it as the propaganda sweeps through Fox News and into the homes of the idiots who eat it up. Democrats are like a bowtie wearing dork outside of a Starbucks as two redneck morons point and laugh while picking their asses.

Ah, America. Getting biggly stupider by the year.

 

[BirdinHand]

It broke a Constitutional norm. McConnell knew that, but took the attitude that "nothing say's I can't do it." It was more of the same dirty tricks that Republicans have been doing for years to assume power. From the Supreme Court slapping down racial gerrymandering cases, to actually trying to physically steal a Presidential election, the GOP has abandoned all sense of decorum and standard. Their Party leader, Donald Trump, actually argued that he never swore an oath to support the Constitution of the United States. I mean, fricken' what?!?! And their constituents love them for this treacherous and anti-American behavior.

In the meantime, Democrats are historically weak against everything. Doesn't matter what legislation they get passed. What common sense they preach. How better the economy and jobs look under them as compared to Republicans. They can never sell themselves or defend themselves. Check it:

- Johnson blows the door off into Vietnam to "fight communism," and Republicans still sell Democrats as communists, Marxists, but "weak on communism." Huh?!

- Republicans start two mismanaged wars, accusing Democrats of not supporting the Troop for wanting evidence over Iraq, Obama and Biden see us out of those wars, yet Republicans call the Democrats the "warmongers."


And what do Democrats do? Merely take it as the propaganda sweeps through Fox News and into the homes of the idiots who eat it up. Democrats are like a bowtie wearing dork outside of a Starbucks as two redneck morons point and laugh while picking their asses.

Ah, America. Getting biggly stupider by the year.

So what do you want them to do? Attempt an insurrection?

You’re saying they are weak - they’re following law and precedent. That should be the expectation ALL politicians are held to.

The GOP losing the plot doesn’t mean we throw the entire system out.

 

[weaver2]

Be honest. You just want to kill babies in the womb because they inconvenience you.

Be honest. If you were pregnant, you'd be first in line the next morning to have it aborted.

 

[MSgt]

So what do you want them to do? Attempt an insurrection?

Defending themselves would be good enough. But, alas, they will not. But it's funny you say "insurrection." (<--- Later)

- Republicans have a history of destroying the economy, while Democrats are left to fix it. Ever hear about that in television ads?
- Republicans lied our Troops to their deaths in Iraq, while Democrats tried to stop it. They ever make it a point to talk about it or do they still cower under the "terrorist sympathizer" accusation?
- Republicans wrecked the country, AGAIN, by 2021, and because of Democrats we are in a far better place today by virtually every measurement. But is this the drum beat?
- Republicans told America that they are being invaded by rapists and murderers, yet just told America that they will be raped and murdered by invaders for Trump. Why is this not a consistent theme of the DNC?

No. Democrats are weak. And far too often, Democrats are too educated for their own good. You want to win a fight that you just can't get out of because the other guy insists on it? Time to make a fist. There is a ridiculous amount of horrific speeches, name-calling, and decrepit declarations from enough Republicans over the prior years to fill a 24/7 television ad about how Republicans represent their voters. Enough of Trump's domestic and foreign policy blunders to compare him horribly next to even less-than average Presidents in our history. Yet? Crickets.

Instead, Democrats take the irrational and untrue historical insults, while Republicans win elections in racially gerrymandered districts. Democrats fall silent on their positive legislation, while Republicans hop around, accuse the Democrats of being the "do nothings," and get elected. I mean, the country is in a far better place today, by virtually any measurement, since Democrats took Congress and the White House (2021~2023), yet even Democrats are whining about 81 year-old Biden while a mass portion of the population still looks upon Trump as if he's a youthful [77 year-old] Jesus Christ?! This is the idiot who wrecked the country, before he urged an actual "third-world shithole" insurrection! (<--- Told ya)

You’re saying they are weak - they’re following law and precedent. That should be the expectation ALL politicians are held to.

And two years after Republicans attacked the Capital, they simply took the House. Before this, they played nice while being falsely labeled "terrorist sympathizers, communists, Marxists, and fascists." But the important thing is that Democrats took the "high road" while Republicans obliterated Roe v. Wade!

The GOP losing the plot doesn’t mean we throw the entire system out.

Even as the entire system is being thrown out by those who will clearly stop at nothing to achieve and maintain power. Time to lose the plot. Time to return the underhanded filth with simple truth. But even that appears to be beneath a Democrat. Wouldn't want to hurt Republican feelings by calling them clearly deplorable and national traitors.