The GOP is gunning for pre-existing condition protections (1 Viewer)

[Greenbeard]

The GOP has famously voted dozens and dozens of times, including as recently as last year, to repeal the ACA and its protections for pre-existing conditions. They have failed repeatedly but in the meantime the Trump administration has worked to weaken pre-existing condition protections administratively, while also signing onto a GOP lawsuit that is arguing right now that the protections for pre-existing conditions in the ACA are unconstitutional and have to end.

The same people backing that lawsuit--Scott Walker, Josh Hawley, and others--to bring back pre-existing conditions are cutting ads lying to voters about how they would never endanger those protections. Brazen, but disgusting.

Republicans tried to kill Obamacare. Now they're embracing its most popular part.

WASHINGTON — If you’ve covered American politics over the last eight years, one of the more stunning developments of the 2018 midterms is how Republicans who have attempted to demolish Obamacare are touting its protections for those with pre-existing conditions. Of course, that’s come as Democrats have made pre-existing conditions the centerpiece of their campaigns.

Here’s GOP Senate candidate Josh Hawley in Missouri: “We've got two perfect little boys. Earlier this year, we learned that our oldest has a rare chronic disease. Pre-existing condition — we know what that means,” he says to camera in a TV ad. “I support forcing insurance companies to cover ALL pre-existing conditions. And Claire McCaskill knows it. You deserve a senator who’s driven to fix this mess — not one just trying to hang on to her office.”

But as attorney general of Missouri, Hawley signed on to a conservative lawsuit in February 2018 arguing that Obamacare — and everything in it, including protections for pre-existing conditions — is unconstitutional. “Once the heart of the ACA — the individual mandate — is declared unconstitutional, the remainder of the ACA must also fall,” the lawsuit states.

Even as the candidates are lying, McConnell oddly enough is pointing out the obvious:

Republicans Will Repeal Obamacare If They Get The Chance, Mitch McConnell Says

Republicans could make another run at repealing the Affordable Care Act if they retain control of Congress next year, the Senate’s GOP leader said on Wednesday.

The statement, which Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) made in an interview with Reuters, came in response to a question about what the GOP had accomplished since President Donald Trump took office ― and what business McConnell felt was unfinished.

Now Trump has joined in:

Trump tweets laughable lie about GOP support of coverage for pre-existing conditions

President Donald Trump, whose administration asked a court to end Obamacare’s protections for people with pre-existing medical conditions just last month, claimed “All Republicans support people with pre-existing conditions” in a tweet on Thursday.

This is what happens when sociopaths seek or obtain power.

 

[trouble13]

The GOP has famously voted dozens and dozens of times, including as recently as last year, to repeal the ACA and its protections for pre-existing conditions. They have failed repeatedly but in the meantime the Trump administration has worked to weaken pre-existing condition protections administratively, while also signing onto a GOP lawsuit that is arguing right now that the protections for pre-existing conditions in the ACA are unconstitutional and have to end.

The same people backing that lawsuit--Scott Walker, Josh Hawley, and others--to bring back pre-existing conditions are cutting ads lying to voters about how they would never endanger those protections. Brazen, but disgusting.

Republicans tried to kill Obamacare. Now they're embracing its most popular part.


Even as the candidates are lying, McConnell oddly enough is pointing out the obvious:

Republicans Will Repeal Obamacare If They Get The Chance, Mitch McConnell Says


Now Trump has joined in:

Trump tweets laughable lie about GOP support of coverage for pre-existing conditions


This is what happens when sociopaths seek or obtain power.

Do you agree with the mandate requiring everyone to buy insurance?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I467 using Tapatalk

 

[Greenbeard]

Do you agree with the mandate requiring everyone to buy insurance?

Yes, because I support pre-existing condition protections.

 

[MrPeanut]

It's interesting to live at a time where politicians feel comfortable enough to just blatantly lie over and over again. There isn't even an attempt to just bend words anymore. You'd think that with the internet they would've become more careful about what they say, but I guess if they aren't punished for it they might as well keep going.

 

[trouble13]

Yes, because I support pre-existing condition protections.

The reason I ask is not including preconditions is exactly what motivates the young and healthy to purchase insurance.

By law they can't drop you for something you get while insured. The net results are very similiar. The big difference is some people choose to gamble with their health needs. Some are fine and some lose, but in the end it was their choice. I'm not seeing what's wrong with that approach.


Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I467 using Tapatalk

 

[mike2810]

The reason I ask is not including preconditions is exactly what motivates the young and healthy to purchase insurance.


Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I467 using Tapatalk

Person A is young and healthy and no insurance. The person is living pay check to pay check. They are involved in an accident that breaks both legs, arms and back. Without insurance who going to pick up the tab to fix the person? Just because one is healthy does not mean they should not carry health insurance. You never know when you are going to need it.

Playing devil's advocate, why should a good driver purchase car insurance when they never have been in an accident?

 

[Casca XV]

The GOP has famously voted dozens and dozens of times, including as recently as last year, to repeal the ACA and its protections for pre-existing conditions. They have failed repeatedly but in the meantime the Trump administration has worked to weaken pre-existing condition protections administratively, while also signing onto a GOP lawsuit that is arguing right now that the protections for pre-existing conditions in the ACA are unconstitutional and have to end.

The same people backing that lawsuit--Scott Walker, Josh Hawley, and others--to bring back pre-existing conditions are cutting ads lying to voters about how they would never endanger those protections. Brazen, but disgusting.

Republicans tried to kill Obamacare. Now they're embracing its most popular part.


Even as the candidates are lying, McConnell oddly enough is pointing out the obvious:

Republicans Will Repeal Obamacare If They Get The Chance, Mitch McConnell Says


Now Trump has joined in:

Trump tweets laughable lie about GOP support of coverage for pre-existing conditions


This is what happens when sociopaths seek or obtain power.

When sociopaths obtain power we get things like Obamacare.

America has the best health care in the world and everybody has and has always had full access to it.

Its only problem it's expensive, which is a problem originally caused by Leftist policies and made worse by Obamacare.

 

[trouble13]

Person A is young and healthy and no insurance. The person is living pay check to pay check. They are involved in an accident that breaks both legs, arms and back. Without insurance who going to pick up the tab to fix the person? Just because one is healthy does not mean they should not carry health insurance. You never know when you are going to need it.

Playing devil's advocate, why should a good driver purchase car insurance when they never have been in an accident?

The answer is the same to both your hypotheticals. If you can not afford the finacial repercussions from an accident you should purchase protection. If you can than you have nothing to worry about.

Question for you about the poor person who can't afford insurance but gets hurt. If he can't afford insurance what good is the mandate doing that person? If the deductible is too high for him to benefit from having insurance, what good does it for them to carry it?

ACA does not fix the problem. In fact it makes it worse in many ways.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I467 using Tapatalk

 

[mike2810]

The answer is the same to both your hypotheticals. If you can not afford the finacial repercussions from an accident you should purchase protection. If you can than you have nothing to worry about.

Question for you about the poor person who can't afford insurance but gets hurt. If he can't afford insurance what good is the mandate doing that person? If the deductible is too high for him to benefit from having insurance, what good does it for them to carry it?

ACA does not fix the problem. In fact it makes it worse in many ways.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I467 using Tapatalk

Are you able to tell the future? How can anyone know when they may get sick or injured?

Are you ok with mandatory car insurance?

I am saying the ACA is the answer. I do believe that people should have some form of health insurance.

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

The reason I ask is not including preconditions is exactly what motivates the young and healthy to purchase insurance.

By law they can't drop you for something you get while insured. The net results are very similiar. The big difference is some people choose to gamble with their health needs. Some are fine and some lose, but in the end it was their choice. I'm not seeing what's wrong with that approach.


Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I467 using Tapatalk

Unless you think US society would be willing to see people dying on the steps of hospitals after they were refused care for lack of a means to pay for health care, eventually some of those that choose to gamble, will lose and cost the tax payers more than they would have, if they had insurance and regular medical check ups. But if you believe and are correct in that US society would be fine with people dying on the steps of hospitals, then your option would be the cheapest most cost effective method

 

[Tanngrisnir]

When sociopaths obtain power we get things like Obamacare.

America has the best health care in the world and everybody has and has always had full access to it.

Its only problem it's expensive, which is a problem originally caused by Leftist policies and made worse by Obamacare.

Huh. Literally nothing you just posted is true.

Quite a thing to behold.

 

[Gamewell45]

Person A is young and healthy and no insurance. The person is living pay check to pay check. They are involved in an accident that breaks both legs, arms and back. Without insurance who going to pick up the tab to fix the person? Just because one is healthy does not mean they should not carry health insurance. You never know when you are going to need it.

Playing devil's advocate, why should a good driver purchase car insurance when they never have been in an accident?

What type of accident? Auto? Walking down the street and struck by a motor vehicle? falling off of the roof?

 

[trouble13]

Are you able to tell the future? How can anyone know when they may get sick or injured?

Are you ok with mandatory car insurance?

I am saying the ACA is the answer. I do believe that people should have some form of health insurance.

The only auto insurance that is mandatory is liability. That protects others from damage you may cause and if you don't own a vehicle or use one on public roads your not required to carry it. That does not compare to mandatory health insurance. However as a matter of principle no I do not support mandating car insurance either. I put freedom above safety.

As far as you asking if I can tell the future, that's way out in left field. I never made any such claim. Insurance is a hedge against risk. If you do not want that hedge than the government should not force you to purchase it. If I wish to self insure myself, I should be free to do so.

You say ACA is the answer but you never addressed what I asked you in my previous post. What good does it do a poor person to pay for a policy that is too expensive to use or what good does requiring them to carry insurance if they are too poor to purchase it and end up accruing fines?

If ACA works where is the statically data showing less people died during the years ACA was in effect? ACA saves lives, right?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I467 using Tapatalk

 

[trouble13]

Unless you think US society would be willing to see people dying on the steps of hospitals after they were refused care for lack of a means to pay for health care, eventually some of those that choose to gamble, will lose and cost the tax payers more than they would have, if they had insurance and regular medical check ups. But if you believe and are correct in that US society would be fine with people dying on the steps of hospitals, then your option would be the cheapest most cost effective method

If it were up to me health care would look very different than the models we are debating. However if society did let people die just as you suggested I can guarantee you less people would risk not carrying insurance. I know that sounds cruel but it's no more cruel than those that got sick without insurance that demand care with no intention to pay the bill. However since nobody is going to let anyone die, I would not object to hospitals being able to garish people's wages to repay them for services rendered.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I467 using Tapatalk

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

If it were up to me health care would look very different than the models we are debating. However if society did let people die just as you suggested I can guarantee you less people would risk not carrying insurance. I know that sounds cruel but it's no more cruel than those that got sick without insurance that demand care with no intention to pay the bill. However since nobody is going to let anyone die, I would not object to hospitals being able to garish people's wages to repay them for services rendered.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I467 using Tapatalk

Re bold

Of course some would risk no health insurance. If they had a choice between food and rent vs health insurance they would go with the immediate needs of food and rent and forgo health insurance.

 

[Cattle Company]

Amazing how the greedy democrat crooks pretend to care about our health. It is a leftist healthcare power grab. You don't want fools in charge of your health.

One should think of fascism not as the complete opposite of socialism and communism, but yet another kindred spirit in extreme leftist political ideologies that were competing for the hearts and minds of the populous. Not much has changed with fascist ideology of collectivism (another prized belief of the left) were individual twigs bundle together to make a strong piece of collective wood.

Allow this to be a possible warning sign of modern day ideology, as their quest will devolve into a loss of civility and violence as we move farther and farther left. As the left ideologies become more and more resembling a preacher preaching piety from the pulpit, “action” will be the next conclusive step. Peel back the leftist Orwellian language with nice sounding words like “Obamacare” and “Net Neutrality” to expose it for what it really is; fascist policies and huge government takeover in a pretty wrapper.

 

[GDViking]

The reason I ask is not including preconditions is exactly what motivates the young and healthy to purchase insurance.

By law they can't drop you for something you get while insured. The net results are very similiar. The big difference is some people choose to gamble with their health needs. Some are fine and some lose, but in the end it was their choice. I'm not seeing what's wrong with that approach.


Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I467 using Tapatalk

What is wrong with it is all procedures are ultimately paid for by those with Insurance by bigger costs.

 

[Casca XV]

Huh. Literally nothing you just posted is true.

Quite a thing to behold.

"Not true,"why because you say so?

Tenngender, Myself and others have hulmiated and caught you in so many lies so often that Im shocked you have not abandoned this profile.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

"Not true,"why because you say so?

Tenngender, Myself and others have hulmiated and caught you in so many lies so often that Im shocked you have not abandoned this profile.

No, because reality does.

And you've never caught me in a single lie. The ironic thing is, you have to lie to maintain that you did.

Please learn to spell better.

 

[GDViking]

Amazing how the greedy democrat crooks pretend to care about our health. It is a leftist healthcare power grab. You don't want fools in charge of your health.

One should think of fascism not as the complete opposite of socialism and communism, but yet another kindred spirit in extreme leftist political ideologies that were competing for the hearts and minds of the populous. Not much has changed with fascist ideology of collectivism (another prized belief of the left) were individual twigs bundle together to make a strong piece of collective wood.

Allow this to be a possible warning sign of modern day ideology, as their quest will devolve into a loss of civility and violence as we move farther and farther left. As the left ideologies become more and more resembling a preacher preaching piety from the pulpit, “action” will be the next conclusive step. Peel back the leftist Orwellian language with nice sounding words like “Obamacare” and “Net Neutrality” to expose it for what it really is; fascist policies and huge government takeover in a pretty wrapper.

It is very entertaining to watch cons twist, turn, flip and roll over trying to disassociate themselves with the right wing philosophy of fascism.

Fascism is a right wing ideology, own it or stop mentioning it...

https://rense.com/general37/char.htm

 

[trouble13]

Re bold

Of course some would risk no health insurance. If they had a choice between food and rent vs health insurance they would go with the immediate needs of food and rent and forgo health insurance.

Do you think the mandate somehow changes that?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I467 using Tapatalk

 

[trouble13]

What is wrong with it is all procedures are ultimately paid for by those with Insurance by bigger costs.

The biggest problem I see is a lack of cost control. Insurance companies love when people demand more things covered and use more services. It justifies premium hikes. They rather make a 1% profit off a billion than a million. The entire concept of insurance as its currently set up is flawed. IMO this problem started when we started using HMOs. The unintended consequences is what we are living with today.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I467 using Tapatalk

 

[Casca XV]

No, because reality does.

And you've never caught me in a single lie. The ironic thing is, you have to lie to maintain that you did.

Please learn to spell better.

You do realize people can look at past post?

I misspelled your handle on purpose... Come on NPC try to keep up.

 

[Hari Seldon]

Amazing how the greedy democrat crooks pretend to care about our health. It is a leftist healthcare power grab. You don't want fools in charge of your health.

One should think of fascism not as the complete opposite of socialism and communism, but yet another kindred spirit in extreme leftist political ideologies that were competing for the hearts and minds of the populous. Not much has changed with fascist ideology of collectivism (another prized belief of the left) were individual twigs bundle together to make a strong piece of collective wood.

Allow this to be a possible warning sign of modern day ideology, as their quest will devolve into a loss of civility and violence as we move farther and farther left. As the left ideologies become more and more resembling a preacher preaching piety from the pulpit, “action” will be the next conclusive step. Peel back the leftist Orwellian language with nice sounding words like “Obamacare” and “Net Neutrality” to expose it for what it really is; fascist policies and huge government takeover in a pretty wrapper.

I like fiction as well but lean toward SF.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

You do realize people can look at past post?

I misspelled your handle on purpose... Come on NPC try to keep up.

Indeed, they can. And you cannot cite a single lie I've posted.

Please learn to spell better.