Willoughby
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Willoughby said:Surely the constitution of the United States does just not work.
Has it really made the US great in terms of politics or society.
United State's women got the vote relatively late.
The issue of segregation by race was not helped by the constitution.
How has the constitution actually helped the United States
Willoughby said:Surely the constitution of the United States does just not work.
Has it really made the US great in terms of politics or society.
Willoughby said:United State's women got the vote relatively late.
Willoughby said:The issue of segregation by race was not helped by the constitution.
Willoughby said:How has the constitution actually helped the United States
zymurgy said:The contitution has not been followed for over 100 years. We have scrapped it.
Willoughby said:Surely the constitution of the United States does just not work.
Has it really made the US great in terms of politics or society.
United State's women got the vote relatively late.
The issue of segregation by race was not helped by the constitution.
How has the constitution actually helped the United States
Willoughby said:sorry i think you have slightly misunderstood my point. it is probably me not explaining myself properly. Basically i was trying to aak the question:
The US constitution is looked on very favourably especially by americans but what makes it any better a constitution. In the Uk we don't have a constitution but we have a political system that is fairly money free and not dominated by interest groups. We wiped out racist elements quicker and don't have anything like the death penalty. In New Zealand, which also has no written constitution was the first to give universal suffrage.
My basic point is that shouldn't a constitution such as the United state's, which is prasied so highly, lead to a better political system/society or at least on a par with other countries that don't have constitutions or have weaker constitutions.
It seems to me that all it does it cloud the whole political system in semantics with everybody picking over what it actually means
Except the ones at GITMO, right?Originally posted by Trajan Octavian Titus
Because the Constitution is a guarantee and a safeguard to protect the natural rights of the people,
so who system is working better at the moment...We created our Constitution precisely because of the failure of your system of Government.
Willoughby said:so who system is working better at the moment...
also one thing that doesn't look democratic at all is the electoral college...can it be justified
and obviously our system of Government is working better than yours (and the rest of the worlds) at the moment and has been ever since its inception.
Willoughby said:any reasons for making this rather foolish sweeping statement??
a bullying nation? a self-obssessed nation? a rogue state?Look at what we are as a Nation.
Willoughby said:a bullying nation? a self-obssessed nation? a rogue state?
Willoughby said:a bullying nation? a self-obssessed nation? a rogue state?
cherokee said:How about this..... scrap the bible instead.
cherokee said:Me making this statement was un-called for on my part.How about this..... scrap the bible instead.
I Apologize to the religious members here for saying it.
England have good systems because past documents (ex: Magna Carta) and past court rulings that are held as precedent work together as a sort of "constitution."
List how we are these things and show me your proof..
The U.S. has attempted to pressure states into signing these bilateral agreements with it by adopting legislation requiring the suspension of military assistance and U.S. Economic Support Fund (ESF) aid to those States Parties which do not sign these agreements. ESF funding entails a wide range of governance programs including international counter-terrorism efforts, peace process programs, anti-drug trafficking initiatives, truth and reconciliation commissions, wheelchair distribution and HIV/AIDS education, among others. In 2003 the U.S. stopped military aid for 35 countries (among them nine European countries). U.S. law requires the cessation of such aid payments if a state is unwilling to sign the bilateral agreement (there are exceptions for NATO-members and allies such as Israel, Egypt, Australia and South Korea).
the above exemption for us soldiers, rejection of international law etc eteca self-obssessed nation?
a rogue state?
Willoughby said:now that i can agree with. this informal constitution rights mean that we have some safeguards to liberty but we don't spend endless hours desperatly trying to figure out what the constitution actually means!
Bullying - tying help to eastern european countries to a rejection of idea that american soilders can be prosecuted under international law:
the above exemption for us soldiers, rejection of international law etc etec
now this one is more the opinion of a large number of people around the world
but they would probably point to the support of some very dodgy countries such as Saudi arabia, pakistan, israel etc. the group of mercenry states that act for the US etc
of course these are all opinions. but i just think it would be good if americans considered every now and agian why they are so poorly regarded by the rest of the world!
etc etc etc, provide examples we do not violate international law, the international criminal court is a farce with only one intended goal which is to put the U.S. on trial by tyrants and despots and give them a sense of legitimacy and moral equivalency. The U.N. is already the soap box for dictators around the world and now you're suggesting that we hand over our soveriegnty to them too? What a joke.
Willoughby said:i accept that unforntuntly you have a superior military and economic power but maybe the UN and ICC wouldn't be such "a joke" (not that i agree with that) if you supported them properly and stuck to what they say. I think the main argument and problem with the US, that people have, are the double standards. Supporting oppressive regimes only when it helps you, supporting democracy only when it helps you, supporting terrorist organisations only when it helps you etc. Maybe try and make the US a force for good and peace in the world that would help a bit! Of course i am not saying that the UK is perfect in this respect or that any country is perfect but i just think that your power might be used for good more often!
Perhaps if the peoples in oppressive governments would look introspectively at their own corrupt institutions instead of trying to shift the blame on us then they would be able to change but as long as there's people like you out their giving these people legitimacy they will never change.
your obtuse statements regarding our support for tyrannical regimes is impossible to defend against unless you give specific empirical examples.
Willoughby said:its not just oppressive governments saying these things. Its religious leaders, governments in democracies, elected people in these democracies, ordinary people all over the world.
Well a case in point would be its whole attitude to Latin America:
Support for undemocratic govs., coups or insurgents movements in:
Guatemale
Honduras
Chilean coup of 1973
The US provided significant support for General Augusto Pinochet in Chile, who came into power in the Chilean coup and went on to commit many human rights abuses.
One of the latest examples of alleged US intervention in Latin America is the short-lived coup in Venezuela, where president Hugo Chávez was briefly overthrown on April 11, 2002. Some claim evidence pointed towards US involvement in the coup, especially when in 2004 unclassified information from National Endowment for Democracy showed that several thousand dollars were paid to Venezuelan institutions which promote the overthrow of Chávez and the end of the what is called the Bolivarian Revolution.
The U.S. was responsible for arming and training the notorious Atlacatl Battalion in El Salvador. They were responsible for the rape, torture, mutilation, and murder of civilians, including children. A famous example of this was the El Mozote massacre. When word of this massacre got out, it was dismissed by the U.S. government as communist propaganda. In 1992, the United Nation Truth Commission investigated the site of the massacre and found 143 skeletons, including 131 children under the age of twelve. The ammunition found around the site of the massacre was manufactured in Lake City, Missouri.
and outside Latin America:
Eygpt
Jordan
Saudi Arabia
Greece:
American support for the anti-communist government of George Papadopoulos in Greece (1967-1974), which many regarded as an oppressive military dictatorship and which compelled many prominent Greeks to flee Greece
UK- the US government never tried to stop open fund raising in the US for the IRA
Willoughby said:Bullying - tying help to eastern european countries to a rejection of idea that american soilders can be prosecuted under international law:
These agreements prohibit the surrender to the ICC of a broad scope of persons including current or former government officials, military personnel, and U.S. employees (including non-national contractors) and nationals. These agreements, which in some cases are reciprocal, do not always include an obligation by the United States to subject those suspected persons to investigation and/or prosecution:
the above exemption for us soldiers, rejection of international law etc etec
now this one is more the opinion of a large number of people around the world
but they would probably point to the support of some very dodgy countries such as Saudi arabia, pakistan, israel etc. the group of mercenry states that act for the US etc
of course these are all opinions. but i just think it would be good if americans considered every now and agian why they are so poorly regarded by the rest of the world!
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