Thanks George, Our Boys Died For China

[calamity]

Well the postmortem on the Gulf War is in.

“The Chinese are the biggest beneficiary of this post-Saddam oil boom in Iraq,” said Denise Natali, a Middle East expert at the National Defense University in Washington. “They need energy, and they want to get into the market.”

Before the invasion, Iraq’s oil industry was sputtering, largely walled off from world markets by international sanctions against the government of Saddam Hussein, so his overthrow always carried the promise of renewed access to the country’s immense reserves. Chinese state-owned companies seized the opportunity, pouring more than $2 billion a year and hundreds of workers into Iraq, and just as important, showing a willingness to play by the new Iraqi government’s rules and to accept lower profits to win contracts.

“We lost out,” said Michael Makovsky, a former Defense Department official in the Bush administration who worked on Iraq oil policy. “The Chinese had nothing to do with the war, but from an economic standpoint they are benefiting from it, and our Fifth Fleet and air forces are helping to assure their supply.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/03/w...enefits-of-iraq-oil-boom.html?ref=world&_r=1&

Looks like the Republican War sure paid off...if you're Chinese.

 

[Fisher]

Or when Israel/US bomb Iran. It is totally disingenuous to pick an arbitrary date and say that because we have not received X amount of benefit by this date, then a war is a failure. This will take at least a generation, probably two, to properly assess.

 

[rocket88]

Considering China paid for it....

 

[Fiddytree]

And if the U.S. actually profited from the conflict (as we should have: if you're going to get a war, you should get oil) you wouldn't like that even more. A little more intellectual honesty would be appreciated.

 

[Dittohead not!]

Considering China paid for it....

but I think they expect us to pay them back.

 

[ARealConservative]

Well the postmortem on the Gulf War is in.


Looks like the Republican War sure paid off...if you're Chinese.

typical "centrist"

democrats were in control of the senate.

this was a bipartisan war.

 

[Fisher]

but I think they expect us to pay them back.

Oh I think they would be just as happy taking our stuff. How many Chinese factories do you suppose could fit into Yellowstone? It has a good water supply and lots of trees to build with.

 

[calamity]

typical "centrist"

democrats were in control of the senate.

this was a bipartisan war.

Nonsense. The Senate was pretty much even: 50-49. And, 21 of the Democrats voted against the Resolution, while only 1 Republican did.

In the house:

Less than 3% of the GOP voted against the war resolution. But, over 60% of the D's voted against it.

Not exactly "bipartisan".

Like I said, GOP's war.

 

[Heebie Jeebie]

They make out only if you buy the false argument that the war was only about the oil.

 

[fmw]

Well the postmortem on the Gulf War is in.


Looks like the Republican War sure paid off...if you're Chinese.

We didn't go to war to take Iraq's oil. That wasn't the purpose and that is not what we did. You can argue whether or not that was sensible, if you like, but it was clearly not an oil based adventure.

 

[Middleground]

Nonsense. The Senate was pretty much even: 50-49. And, 21 of the Democrats voted against the Resolution, while only 1 Republican did.

In the house:

Less than 3% of the GOP voted against the war resolution. But, over 60% of the D's voted against it.

Not exactly "bipartisan".

Like I said, GOP's war.

Not only that, but they were fed false intelligence all the while being rushed to decision.

 

[ARealConservative]

Nonsense. The Senate was pretty much even: 50-49.

as I stated, the democrats had the majority. They share this war. partisan shills can lie all they want

 

[ARealConservative]

Not only that, but they were fed false intelligence all the while being rushed to decision.

based on the evidence on hand, I was against the Iraq war from the get go.

I find your apologist approach nutty

 

[Porchev]

Nonsense. The Senate was pretty much even: 50-49. And, 21 of the Democrats voted against the Resolution, while only 1 Republican did.

In the house:

Less than 3% of the GOP voted against the war resolution. But, over 60% of the D's voted against it.

Not exactly "bipartisan".

Like I said, GOP's war.

It looks pretty bipartisan to me:

 

[calamity]

We didn't go to war to take Iraq's oil. That wasn't the purpose and that is not what we did. You can argue whether or not that was sensible, if you like, but it was clearly not an oil based adventure.

I actually agree. The result written about in the op bears that statement out.

 

[calamity]

It looks pretty bipartisan to me:View attachment 67148451

Not really

 

[ARealConservative]

Not really

58% of the body they controlled approved the war.

 

[Middleground]

based on the evidence on hand, I was against the Iraq war from the get go.

I find your apologist approach nutty

Yeah, well not everyone is as smart, astute and clarvoyant as yourself.

And yes, some Dems saw through the bull****, but many didn't. Certainly the American public were mostly marching to the drums of war. It's easy to forget that at the time, the press was at it's worse (apart from the Knight-Ridder guys who were spot on), and many were feeling a post 9/11 warm and fuzzy jingoistic glow that altered clear and sound thinking.

 

[ARealConservative]

Yeah, well not everyone is as smart, astute and clarvoyant as yourself.

And yes, some Dems saw through the bull****, but many didn't..

42% of democrats in the senate were smart enough.

60% in the house.

why didn't they fall for the false evidence?

Certainly the American public were mostly marching to the drums of war. It's easy to forget that at the time, the press was at it's worse (apart from the Knight-Ridder guys who were spot on), and many were feeling a post 9/11 warm and fuzzy jingoistic glow that altered clear and sound thinking

yes, the American public. Not the republican public. The American public. yet partisan shills love to attribute this war to political ideology.

 

[WCH]

but I think they expect us to pay them back.

Let them eat oil!

 

[Middleground]

42% of democrats in the senate were smart enough.

60% in the house.

why didn't they fall for the false evidence?

In most cases, a party will stick with it's own, no? The fact that Over 80 Dems voted out of party lines is true testament that they fell victim to the propaganda.

 

[CaptinSarcastic]

Or when Israel/US bomb Iran. It is totally disingenuous to pick an arbitrary date and say that because we have not received X amount of benefit by this date, then a war is a failure. This will take at least a generation, probably two, to properly assess.

Realistically, all war represents a failure. That doesn't mean it must be avoided at all costs, but should be avoided if possible.

Is there ANY doubt that avoiding war with Iraq was not only possible, but the preferable option if you are anyone except the war industry?

 

[ARealConservative]

In most cases, a party will stick with it's own, no? The fact that Over 80 Dems voted out of party lines is true testament that they fell victim to the propaganda.

it is a a testament to this having broad bipartisan support.

 

[calamity]

58% of the body they controlled approved the war.

Here's how it was: the GOP, as usual, was in lock-step with over 97% of them approving the war action. The Democrats, however, were split. In the Senate 60% of them (call those 6 of 10 "the weasels") voted for war, while in the house 60% voted against it--in the House, only 40% were weasels.

That's not bipartisan. That's politics.

 

[ARealConservative]

Here's how it was: the GOP, as usual, was in lock-step with over 97% of them approving the war action. The Democrats, however, were split. In the Senate 60% of them (call those 6 of 10 "the weasels") voted for war, while in the house 60% voted against it--in the House, only 40% were weasels.

That's not bipartisan. That's politics.

bi·par·ti·san [bahy-pahr-tuh-zuhn]
adjective
representing, characterized by, or including members from two parties or factions