Sports in the public education system. (1 Viewer)

[Baralis]

My father and I were discussing this the other day and we both agreed that we do not feel that sports is a appropriate expenditure for our public schools. Many schools across the nation have a pretty fair percentage of thier expenses go into sports programs. We feel while entertaining it is a poor use of educational funds, funds that would be much better used in curricular programs.

Do you think sports programs are something that should be removed from the public education system?

What are some of the pros and cons to sports programs in your opinion?

 

[Sanitas]

My father and I were discussing this the other day and we both agreed that we do not feel that sports is a appropriate expenditure for our public schools. Many schools across the nation have a pretty fair percentage of thier expenses go into sports programs. We feel while entertaining it is a poor use of educational funds, funds that would be much better used in curricular programs.

Do you think sports programs are something that should be removed from the public education system?

What are some of the pros and cons to sports programs in your opinion?

I've been thinking about this a lot, actually. In many European countries, if you want to play a sport, you go to a community center. America is really the only country in which the education system funds so much cash into so many sports. I think it's a poor allocation of funds.

 

[WI Crippler]

While I do think that athletics play too big of a role in some public high schools, I would not be in favor of eliminating them. There are life lessons to be learned on the field of play that you cannot teach in a classroom.

 

[Harry Guerrilla]

My father and I were discussing this the other day and we both agreed that we do not feel that sports is a appropriate expenditure for our public schools. Many schools across the nation have a pretty fair percentage of thier expenses go into sports programs. We feel while entertaining it is a poor use of educational funds, funds that would be much better used in curricular programs.

Do you think sports programs are something that should be removed from the public education system?

What are some of the pros and cons to sports programs in your opinion?

I disagree with sports in school, too many times did I see school administrators turn a blind eye to the kids who played sports.

Sports aren't education.

 

[JW Frogen]

I do not agree with sports in public schools. I played some sports in High School and it kept me away from drink and drugs.


It was not until I was an adult that I got to enjoy drink and drugs.

No sport is school I say, other than gang related contest.

 

[Real Korimyr #9]

Many schools across the nation have a pretty fair percentage of thier expenses go into sports programs. We feel while entertaining it is a poor use of educational funds, funds that would be much better used in curricular programs.

I think this is much of the problem. High school sports have become an extension of college sports which have become an extension of professional sports, and are thus little more than exploitation of the students and distraction from the purpose of the institution, and from the purpose of including sports programs in the first place.

Do you think sports programs are something that should be removed from the public education system?

Absolutely not. Sports teach discipline and confidence, and in a proper environment teach both the hunger for competition and victory and the skills needed for successful cooperation. They promote physical fitness, personal development, and goal-oriented behaviors.

I think much of the problem is that they are treated as entertainment or worse as an external source of revenue for the schools, and thus participation is limited to only the best athletes and in many ways the sports programs are allowed to overshadow the other programs and purposes of the school system-- especially in places that have a very strong sports culture.

I am not certain how to correct for this, because it's largely a cultural attitude. However, I think offering more sports and more encouragement for less-talented athletes to participate in them would go a long way.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

The problem with sports in the public education system is NOT that they exist, but HOW they exist. Sports can teach very valuable lessions...sportsmanship, competition, cooperation, teamwork, discipline, and quite a bit else. Lots of life lessons to be learned. Unfortunately, sports, for the most part, are relegated to only those who can excel. For sports to truly work in public education and for students to get out of them the assets that they can, sports need to be mandated and need to be enacted on a level system, to all skill levels can participate. Interscholastic, intermural, recreation, etc... This would help to reduce some of the "athlete" status, as everyone would participate. The way sports exist now, helps to create divisions and leaves many out in the cold from learing some of the lessons sports can teach.

 

[Harry Guerrilla]

The problem with sports in the public education system is NOT that they exist, but HOW they exist. Sports can teach very valuable lessions...sportsmanship, competition, cooperation, teamwork, discipline, and quite a bit else. Lots of life lessons to be learned. Unfortunately, sports, for the most part, are relegated to only those who can excel. For sports to truly work in public education and for students to get out of them the assets that they can, sports need to be mandated and need to be enacted on a level system, to all skill levels can participate. Interscholastic, intermural, recreation, etc... This would help to reduce some of the "athlete" status, as everyone would participate. The way sports exist now, helps to create divisions and leaves many out in the cold from learing some of the lessons sports can teach.

Cap I disagree mainly because sports aren't my interest and in the time that they were it was only to get my fathers attention, which didn't work.

The sports I've always been interested in can't be mandated or operated by a school. I'm an outdoorsy guy, love nature and the natural world.
I want to go hunting and enjoy archery, schools don't do anything like that.

They may be able to teach wilderness skills but in a limited capacity.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

Cap I disagree mainly because sports aren't my interest and in the time that they were it was only to get my fathers attention, which didn't work.

The sports I've always been interested in can't be mandated or operated by a school. I'm an outdoorsy guy, love nature and the natural world.
I want to go hunting and enjoy archery, schools don't do anything like that.

They may be able to teach wilderness skills but in a limited capacity.

I never played sports in high school. Didn't see the value in it. But working with teens for so many years, I see a lot of value in participating...excelling is much less important. As far as the sports that you are interested in, not everything could be offered, but archery was at my school.

 

[Harry Guerrilla]

I never played sports in high school. Didn't see the value in it. But working with teens for so many years, I see a lot of value in participating...excelling is much less important. As far as the sports that you are interested in, not everything could be offered, but archery was at my school.

We were cut from the same cloth at times I believe.

There is value in participating, totally agree.
Some students prefer brainy sports over more athletic sports but their participation is marginalize and ridiculed by even the administration.

Archery I would have loved so much, but it's a danger for school liability as far as they are concerned. We didn't have it.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

We were cut from the same cloth at times I believe.

Yeah, even though we seem, on the surface quite different, politically, you are one libertarian that I find a lot of common ground on...in a lot of areas.

There is value in participating, totally agree.
Some students prefer brainy sports over more athletic sports but their participation is marginalize and ridiculed by even the administration.

Since this thread was about sports, I did not expand on my "overall plan". In CC's world, every student would participate in one extra-curricular activity, each quarter/semester. Wouldn't matter whether it was athletic, musical, dramatic, or academic. Football would qualify. Cheerleading would qualify. The play would qualify. Academic decathalon would qualify. The only requirement for the activity would be at least twice/week meetings with some sort of quarterly/semester goal. This activity would NOT have to confined to school. If the activity was outside of school, it would need to be approved, and there would need to be an advisor. These activities would count towards credit, as the type of social learning that would occur would be invaluable for the student in life.

Archery I would have loved so much, but it's a danger for school liability as far as they are concerned. We didn't have it.

Maybe I'm dating myself. We had it in the late '70s.

 

[Lightdemon]

I never played sports in high school. Didn't see the value in it. But working with teens for so many years, I see a lot of value in participating...excelling is much less important. As far as the sports that you are interested in, not everything could be offered, but archery was at my school.

Not all of us went to high school with Sparticus, mind you... :mrgreen:


I think sports are great for school. Being competitive, a team player, and all that jazz...But one important thing that I noticed from my athletic students is that they possess a particular type of intelligence (Gardner's Theory). I mean, I had one student who's memory was so bad he couldn't remember what happened in 1776. However, he was quite the expert when it came to the playbook he had to memorize. It's understandable as the playbook is more spatial and tactical, while the history text is more abstract and not particularly visible with the basic senses.

 

[Oftencold]

I agree completely. I have always thought that sports and schools are a bad combination.

In the first place, they tend to displace the primary purposes of schools and become a central function for many kids and a fair number of the staff.

In the second place, contrary to what we've all heard I've usually found school sports to be detrimental to personal development, and more liken to produce narcissistic clods than effective citizens.

 

[Fiddytree]

Well, I never had the interest in it during my time in the public schools, but it is obvious to me that they should exist. If school were merely an academic matter, we would help prevent those of primary athletic achievement from being able to at least become interested in academics, or even providing a decent basis for when the particular student does not have his or her athletic ability to financially support them.

Furthermore, it would be a basic assumption that if indeed Americans are in the middle of a silent health crisis, this is a good way to ease those unhealthy habits and further develop athletic skills.

Granted, I was nerd, and they were jock, and jocks did not always treat 'nerds' so kindly, but let's not become clouded by that.

 

[Fiddytree]

Not all of us went to high school with Sparticus, mind you... :mrgreen:


I think sports are great for school. Being competitive, a team player, and all that jazz...But one important thing that I noticed from my athletic students is that they possess a particular type of intelligence (Gardner's Theory). I mean, I had one student who's memory was so bad he couldn't remember what happened in 1776. However, he was quite the expert when it came to the playbook he had to memorize. It's understandable as the playbook is more spatial and tactical, while the history text is more abstract and not particularly visible with the basic senses.

Indeed. However, what would be nice is if teachers would supply at least one simulation mode, let's say, a political decision making simulation (Cuban Missile Crisis comes to mind). Divide people out into groups, assign them roles, give them specific intelligence reports in a packet, have them read & evaluate what they have. Get them interacting with the other groups to figure out what to do, etc.

Abstraction does not always need to be so.

 

[Orion]

I played hockey for 10 years and was a life guard from age 16-19, but none of that had anything to do with school. I found high school sports to be underfunded, the instruction to be poor, and I had little interest in mingling with my classmates.

I find sports leagues where people voluntarily come to spend their time and money have a better level of sportsmanship beyond the entertainment value. They take time and energy to show up once or twice a week to practice and have scrimmages, and people look forward to seeing each other.

In school, and especially high school, there is too much social tension, awkwardness, cliques, etc... and then, because of developmental differences, people who are naturally amazing and those who naturally suck.

I'm in favor of sports programs that let people do the kind of sport they want. Team sports like football, soccer, hockey... should all be optional. Some people just like to lift weights. I disagree that competition is necessary.

 

[Lightdemon]

Indeed. However, what would be nice is if teachers would supply at least one simulation mode, let's say, a political decision making simulation (Cuban Missile Crisis comes to mind). Divide people out into groups, assign them roles, give them specific intelligence reports in a packet, have them read & evaluate what they have. Get them interacting with the other groups to figure out what to do, etc.

Abstraction does not always need to be so.

I've done those type of exercises, and believe me it's still very abstract even when the students got a lot of references. It's not that students don't know what the objective/purpose of the exercise is, but they fail to grasp or comprehend the context of the events.

If we use the Cuban Missile Crisis as an example, the students would have to know beforehand about the Red Scare (usually about Alger Hiss and McCarthy,etc), they'll also need to understand the role that the CIA has taken during that time (covert operations and regime change, etc), they'll also have to understand about MAD. Without these little things, the students would have trouble putting the event into proper context. And each of those things are abstract in and of itself.

Abstract thought is a given for studying history. I can make it more hands-on, make my students "live the moment", but abstract thought is still a requirement.

 

[Sanitas]

There is value in participating, totally agree.
Some students prefer brainy sports over more athletic sports but their participation is marginalize and ridiculed by even the administration.

Archery I would have loved so much, but it's a danger for school liability as far as they are concerned. We didn't have it.

I agree that there is value in sports/general competition. I actually just watched Usain Bolt win gold in Berlin. Anyways, I took track & field in the beginning of high school. In retrospect, I should have stuck with it all the way through high school. If I did I would be vastly better at running by now. The problem was that it took up six out of seven days a week. Personally, I enjoy my free time. I love to run, but it shouldn't be something that encroaches on school work or certain personal time. Other than track, I played for the chess team last year, and joined a lot of community service clubs. I'm active in my free time, though. I love to hike, bike, kayak, play capture the flag w/ friends, frisbee, etc. However, being on a team provides great experience with working in that sort of manner, as long as the coach is alright at his or her job. I don't like the idea of eradicating sports within schools. We need to change the way our sports system works. If we do, it would be very beneficial toward the learning environment within our educational system.

 

[pro-bipartisan]

Our country would be even fatter and stupider if it weren't for sports; High school students wouldn't be running and working out and they would have no motivation to show up for school.