You haven't proven it was only metadata. You seem under a delusion that I will take your word for it.... I don't.
Metadata collection is not spying. I know you've been told that before, so I don't understand why you keep asking.
Oh, okay. You know some people actually have experience in this field, right?We do far more than metadata collection, that's a government lie you are repeating.
Oh, okay. You know some people actually have experience in this field, right?
Oh, okay. You know some people actually have experience in this field, right?
We do far more than metadata collection, that's a government lie you are repeating.
35P, US Army. That's uhhh...a little bit more than "IT".
You haven't proven you aren't the one behind the program, and here attempting to lay down a false trail. Why should we believe you when you say you aren't?
Of course I'm behind the program. What better way to support the NSA than denounce it? Snowden is computer generated hologram - his girlfriend was made up in a conference room in an underground bug proof bomb proof room at Ft. Meade. :mrgreen:
well I'm glad you are finally admitting it. I shall link this post whenever the subject comes up again, so that people know who to yell at.
Rev has a few tours under his belt. I don't know if he was a siginter, but he probably has familiarity with collection.
Meh. Maybe? I was a 35M in my first two assignments and at the time (2005) the easiest way to get a language (which I badly wanted, for a couple unrelated reasons) was to switch over to a Papa, because you need one to do that, and they had a substantial in-call. I was shocked at what was common knowledge in the HUMINT world that no one knew in the SIGINT world and vice versa.
Likewise, I've had limited experience with military folks that either 1) weren't in MI at all or 2) didn't have substantial exposure to them (senior action arm NCOs, field grade officers), but it's been my experience that unless you're intel, you have virtually no idea how collection works.
(And, of course, reading threads on DP make me positive that 99% of people don't know anything at all about it, let alone SIGINT)
:shrug: my own exposure is coming from the perspective of an all source guy. I never got into world of warcraft = not allowed to do SIGINT in the Marine Corps.
Limited experience, however, suggests that you are right about the failure to cross-talk well. Ideally the way you beat that is by creating multidisciplinary teams that are co-located and work on the same problem set together... and organizationally that gives senior intel guys little to nothing to do, and so they naturally resist it. I've been in places that have overcome that institutional roadblock, and it works awesome.
But why would most Americans know about collection? Heck, I went years as an all source guy before I had to sit down and look at even the basics of GSM infrastructure - and I was in a SCIF, reading SIGINT reports.
Ideally the way you beat that is by creating multidisciplinary teams that are co-located and work on the same problem set together...
Of course we do. However, the program that everyone has been trying to grant Snowden some kind of weird, sick, hero status over is a metadata collection prrogram.
35P, US Army. That's uhhh...a little bit more than "IT".
Of course we do. However, the program that everyone has been trying to grant Snowden some kind of weird, sick, hero status over is a metadata collection prrogram.
They are called Stations.
I consider any person who respects the US Constitution, and attempts to reveal to the public crimes against that document, to be a hero.
Diane Roark, Thomas Drake, Mr. Binney, Edward Snowden, Daniel Ellsberg, Bradley Manning.
Those are the "few good men" in government, and I'm grateful to them for revealing government crimes.
It's more than "metadata". And do you know what you can decode as to who is doing what with just "metadata"?
Hell enough that we "kill people" because of what they decoded:
Ex-NSA Chief: ‘We Kill People Based on Metadata’ - ABC News
Oh but we don't do that domestically, we just collect the data....
What the NSA is spying on us:
1. The NSA collects every American's phone records (normally to see who you or I called, required a warrant in the past).
2. The PRISM program lets the NSA access private user data on leading online services
3. The NSA engages in offensive hacking operations
4. The NSA taps long-distance internet connections including domestic.
5. The NSA intercepted data flowing within Google and Yahoo data centers
6. The NSA tracks cell phone locations around the world.
7. From 2001 to 2011, the NSA collected vast amounts of information about Americans' internet usage
8. The NSA has undermined the security of encryption products
The last one is huge. if you come out with encryption and don't provide them a key, you get shut down./
You listened, you don't really implement systems, correct me if I am wrong. what you do vs what the NSA does is sort of bush league.
It's more than "metadata". And do you know what you can decode as to who is doing what with just "metadata"?
Hell enough that we "kill people" because of what they decoded:
Ex-NSA Chief: ‘We Kill People Based on Metadata’ - ABC News
1. The NSA collects every American's phone records (normally to see who you or I called, required a warrant in the past).
2. The PRISM program lets the NSA access private user data on leading online services
3. The NSA engages in offensive hacking operations
4. The NSA taps long-distance internet connections including domestic.
5. The NSA intercepted data flowing within Google and Yahoo data centers
6. The NSA tracks cell phone locations around the world.
7. From 2001 to 2011, the NSA collected vast amounts of information about Americans' internet usage
8. The NSA has undermined the security of encryption products
Uh.... yeah. Metadata as a subject includes things like "locational data". When you've got the phone number of Abu McJihad, leader of the Jihad Army of the Jihadi's for Jihad (JAJJ), having his communications device pinging off a tower and broadcasting his location is useful as all get out.
:shrug: can you point to any drone strikes on US soil that have been fed by metadata collection? It seems like random **** blowing up would be fairly difficult to hide.
The Judiciary has signed off multiple times on the metadata collection program which is also:
Yup. That is their Title 10 responsibility. There is another organization called the "CIA" which engages in offensive HUMINT operations, actually going out and spying on people through Mark 1 eyeballs rather than via their networks. Heck, there is another organization - the NGA - which spies on people through sattelites which it uses to take pictures!!!! :shock:
Seriously, man. Don't discredit a reasonable constitutional question by going overboard and accusing the NSA of fully lawful (and in fact, required) actions.
As they should. If Abu McJihad decides to contact his good buddy Ahmed McKillTheInfidels via their gmail accounts to do some joint op planning, the idea that we shouldn't pay attention to their correspondence because the email bounces off one of google's servers between Libya and Tunisia is self-destructively idiotic.
See #4
As well they should. Although actually your VLR does this
I think you are confusing "the NSA" with "google".
:shrug: welcome to the 21st Century, where national security depends on this stuff. You wouldn't like the alternative (effective government takeover of the major providers) any better.
35Ps often work at NSA. There is no "vs". You can't even go to the training for it without a TS//SCI and access to NSAnet.
For example, I haven't been to the facility in San Antonio; otherwise, there's not a RSOC I haven't had business to conduct in at some point or another. And yes, I've held jobs where they paid for me to go get my CompTIA certs on company time, although I assume they have some type of shelf-life and I'm no longer technically certified.
Hey! That was my job in Anbar! But here's the tiny little fact that's a little bit important in this whole discussion: NSA can't look at the metadata that's stored without a specific warrant. They just store it, because Verizon and AT&T and whatnot were not doing so (I dunno if that changed, I don't deal with that anymore), and NSA wanted to be able to go back through it if it needed to and realized it couldn't subpoena these companies for information they actually no longer had.
Wow! A cryptography agency breaks encryption!?!?!?! I'm shocked! A spy agency having to do with SIGINT conducts offensive operations on computers!? Noooooooo! Like what did you think this agency did, dude? What do you think it should do?
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