Mira
DP Veteran
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- May 17, 2009
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What does Democracy mean to any dignified human being ?
What does democracy mean to Egyptians and other Arabs? What are their expectations?
Is this a revolution, or a civil war? Who's pulling the puppet strings here?
Despite it all, we braved it. We believed we are doing what’s right and were encouraged by all those around us who couldn’t believe what was happening to their country. What he did galvanized the people, and on Tuesday, despite shutting down all major roads leading into Cairo, we managed to get over 2 million protesters in Cairo alone and 3 million all over Egypt to come out and demand Mubarak’s departure. Those are people who stood up to the regime’s ruthlessness and anger and declared that they were free, and were refusing to live in the Mubarak dictatorship for one more day.
...
Now, just in case this isn’t clear: This protest is not one made or sustained by the Muslim Brotherhood, it’s one that had people from all social classes and religious background in Egypt. The Muslim Brotherhood only showed up on Tuesday, and even then they were not the majority of people there by a long shot. We tolerated them there since we won’t say no to fellow Egyptians who wanted to stand with us, but neither the Muslims Brotherhood not any of the Opposition leaders have the ability to turn out one tenth of the numbers of Protesters that were in Tahrir on Tuesday. This is a revolution without leaders. Three Million individuals choosing hope instead of fear and braving death on hourly basis to keep their dream of freedom alive. Imagine that.
The End is near. I have no illusions about this regime or its leader, and how he will pluck us and hunt us down one by one till we are over and done with and 8 months from now will pay people to stage fake protests urging him not to leave power, and he will stay “because he has to acquiesce to the voice of the people”. This is a losing battle and they have all the weapons, but we will continue fighting until we can’t. I am heading to Tahrir right now with supplies for the hundreds injured, knowing that today the attacks will intensify, because they can’t allow us to stay there come Friday, which is supposed to be the game changer. We are bringing everybody out, and we will refuse to be anything else than peaceful. If you are in Egypt, I am calling on all of you to head down to Tahrir today and Friday. It is imperative to show them that the battle for the soul of Egypt isn’t over and done with. I am calling you to bring your friends, to bring medical supplies, to go and see what Mubarak’s gurantees look like in real life. Egypt needs you. Be Heroes.
What does Democracy mean to any dignified human being?
it means something quite different to a fundamentalist muslim male than it does to, oh, say, anthony weiner of lonGAH island
hello
How many muslim males do you know, face to face? I bet fewer than 1.
Maybe, maybe not. But he can certainly look at that vast expansion of "democracy" known as the Middle East and make a deduction or two.
The most democratic country in the Middle East is.....Iraq. Thanks, Mr. Bush.
I see you didn't bother to read the information I provided, even though it came from a conservative news source.
Let me ask you a question: How many of those dictators and thugs would have remained in power for 20 or 30 years without infusions of cash and weapons from the U.S., and our government's tacit support?
We were accessories to their crimes against their people.
I don't dispute it, or agree with it. I was saying that at this point, we don't know much of anything about this. It's a fluid situation still being controlled by an infintesimally small percentage of Egyptian people (we think they're Egyptian, but who knows?).
Instead of posting this nonsense, I'd suggest that your time might be better spent doing some research.
Oh, get off your I-know-everything high horse. It's a tired act.
You don't know what's going on. None of us do.
Remember Iran? At first, it was a bunch of students protesting the Shah, and by and large, we sympathized with them. Even supported them. But eventually, when the "useful idiots" were finished, the radical Islamic heavies came in and took control, and now Iran is what it is.
No one knows where this is headed. Mubarak is getting what he asked for, but the next face of Egypt is anyone's guess.
Why don't you post some more about how Arabs don't like freedom? That's helpful.
Have you an ounce of integrity, or do you just throw baseless insults at people to get your rocks off? I never said that, and you know it.
Maybe, maybe not. But he can certainly look at that vast expansion of "democracy" known as the Middle East and make a deduction or two.
Baseless? Perhaps you should pay more attention to what you post:
This was in regards to me asking the Prof how many muslim males he actually knows.
OK, and so you took that and deducted that I said Arabs don't like freedom. I guess I'm not getting it.
The Middle East is a collection of nations run by dictatorships and/or Islamic militant regimes, but that doesn't mean there aren't Arabs who want freedom.
Actually al-Qaeda hates the Muslim Brotherhood.
Who has funded and aligned themselves with most of those dictators?
Here's some answers to your questions in a compelling blog post from Pajamas Media:
Michael Totten » Sandmonkey’s Last Post
To those of you who are so sure that we should continue to support Mubarak and that this will result in an Islamic theocracy...
I would only ask...what if you're wrong?
I do not, as a rule of thumb, pray. But my hopes are always with people, in Egypt and elsewhere, who are willing to risk everything for freedom.
OK, whole new direction to this, but I'll play along. Yes, the United States has (and England, France, Russia, China, Japan, etc, etc, etc). As has EVERY world power since the beginning of time. But when we decide to do something about it (Saddam), you say we need to stay out of their business and respect their sovereignty.
The fact is, the Middle East - the cradle of civilization - still grapples with the most basic human rights that western civilization takes virtually for granted. You kind of have to deal with the lesser of two evils. This part of the world doesn't seem to grasp "democracy" or "freedom" as we do, which is why they gravitate to what they've known, dicatorships and fundamental Islamic rule.
OK, whole new direction to this, but I'll play along. Yes, the United States has (and England, France, Russia, China, Japan, etc, etc, etc). As has EVERY world power since the beginning of time. But when we decide to do something about it (Saddam), .
After days of delicate public and private diplomacy, the United States openly broke with its most stalwart ally in the Arab world on Wednesday, as the Obama administration strongly condemned violence by allies of President Hosni Mubarak of Egypt against protesters and called on him to speed up his exit from power.
Egypt’s government hit back swiftly. The Foreign Ministry released a defiant statement saying the calls from “foreign parties” had been “rejected and aimed to incite the internal situation in Egypt.” And Egyptian officials reached out to reporters to make clear how angry they were at their onetime friend.
Separately, in an interview, a senior Egyptian government official took aim at President Obama’s call on Tuesday night for a political transition to begin “now” — a call that infuriated Cairo.
But the White House was not backing down. “I want to be clear,” said Robert Gibbs, the press secretary. “ ‘Now’ started yesterday.”
That's funny...
Are you suggesting you invaded Iraq because it had a dictator...
I don't remember that as one of the reasons...
Do you honestly, honestly, I mean looking yourself in the mirror kind of honestly, think that Bush's aim was to bring democracy to Iraq ??
Can you say regeim change?
10,000 %
There were the reasons for going in. Then there were the objectives we intended to achieve. The reasons for going in were multifold (WMD, Terrorists, violated UN Resolutions, Humanitarian Intervention). The objective was always to free Iraqis and bring Democracy to Iraq that would be a model for the rest of the Middle East. This was said repeatedly by the representatives of the Bush administration. Were you not listening?
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