Rand Paul Slams JD Vance's Defense of Strike on Alleged Venezuelan Cartel

Rogue Valley · Sep 8, 2025

Rand Paul slams JD Vance's defense of strike on alleged Venezuelan cartel

The Kentucky GOP senator wrote on social media that sentiments expressed by the vice president were "despicable" and "thoughtless."

www.newsweek.com

9.7.25
Republican Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky has slammed Vice President JD Vance, following his defense of a lethal American military strike against an alleged Venezuelan cartel. Paul is one of the few Republican senators who has been critical of some of the President Donald Trump administration's policies, including its tariffs, and the "One Big Beautiful Bill." As a libertarian Republican, the Kentucky senator has expressed criticism of military intervention, including over the strikes on Iran, something which has previously been and continues to be a splitting point in the Republican Party, with lawmakers including Georgia Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene criticizing military intervention.

On Tuesday, Trump announced that United States forces had struck a vessel allegedly carrying drugs in the southern Caribbean following its departure from Venezuela. Following this, Secretary of State Marco Rubio said in a post on X that the ship had been run by a "designated narco-terrorist organization," and said the action was a lethal strike. Following this, Trump said in a Truth Social post that the vessel had been operated by the Tren de Aragua gang, which has been designated by the State Department as a foreign terrorist organization. On Saturday, September 6, Vance wrote on X, "Killing cartel members who poison our fellow citizens is the highest and best use of our military."

I pretty much detest both Rand Paul and Pete Hegseth. That said, Senator Paul is right in condemning this attack by the US military. Congress was not informed before, during, or even after the attack. For all we know, that was a boat with 12 immigrants on board. But we will never know now because the boat was totally destroyed and all 12 passengers were killed. Cartel drug boats rarely have more than a few people on board due to weight being reserved for drugs. This should have been an interdiction by a drug-enforcement organization such as the DEA. Stop the boat, search it, demand identification from the passengers, and if drugs are present, tow the boat to the nearest friendly harbor. Using a USAF strike to preemptively kill everone aboard could be considered premeditated murder. I worry that our US military - now packed with Trump-installed officials in the Pentagon - will allow itself to be complicit in Trump crimes against foreigners, and against American citizens.

BitterPill · Sep 8, 2025

Rogue Valley said:
Rand Paul slams JD Vance's defense of strike on alleged Venezuelan cartel

The Kentucky GOP senator wrote on social media that sentiments expressed by the vice president were "despicable" and "thoughtless."

www.newsweek.com

I pretty much detest both Rand Paul and Pete Hegseth. That said, Senator Paul is right in condemning this attack by the US military. Congress was not informed before, during, or even after the attack. For all we know, that was a boat with 12 immigrants on board. But we will never know now because the boat was totally destroyed and all 12 passengers were killed. Cartel drug boats rarely have more than a few people on board due to weight being reserved for drugs. This should have been an interdiction by a drug-enforcement organization such as the DEA. Stop the boat, search it, demand identification from the passengers, and if drugs are present, tow the boat to the nearest friendly harbor. Using a USAF strike to preemptively kill everone aboard could be considered premeditated murder. I worry that our US military - now packed with Trump-installed officials in the Pentagon - will allow itself to be complicit in Trump crimes against foreigners, and against American citizens.

A normal drug-smuggling-by-small-boat scheme has a crew of one or two, so this must have been a super huge load of nefarious Venezuelan drugs that needed all the extra help.

MAGA.

iliveonramen · Sep 8, 2025

I just saw the headline when I originally the story of the strike but there were 11 people on a cigar boat? How do you have room for drugs? Once again, this administration seems to be lying to explain away their incompetence.

NOLA Dude · Sep 8, 2025

Rogue Valley said:
Rand Paul slams JD Vance's defense of strike on alleged Venezuelan cartel

The Kentucky GOP senator wrote on social media that sentiments expressed by the vice president were "despicable" and "thoughtless."

www.newsweek.com

I pretty much detest both Rand Paul and Pete Hegseth. That said, Senator Paul is right in condemning this attack by the US military. Congress was not informed before, during, or even after the attack. For all we know, that was a boat with 12 immigrants on board. But we will never know now because the boat was totally destroyed and all 12 passengers were killed. Cartel drug boats rarely have more than a few people on board due to weight being reserved for drugs. This should have been an interdiction by a drug-enforcement organization such as the DEA. Stop the boat, search it, demand identification from the passengers, and if drugs are present, tow the boat to the nearest friendly harbor. Using a USAF strike to preemptively kill everone aboard could be considered premeditated murder. I worry that our US military - now packed with Trump-installed officials in the Pentagon - will allow itself to be complicit in Trump crimes against foreigners, and against American citizens.

It didn't sound like you thought Rand Paul was credible when you posted this:

https://debatepolitics.com/threads/...future-administrations.533252/post-1079212129

BitterPill · Sep 8, 2025

NOLA Dude said:
It didn't sound like you thought Rand Paul was credible when you posted this:

https://debatepolitics.com/threads/...future-administrations.533252/post-1079212129

That, Sir, is a swing and a miss.

Rogue Valley didn't even make a statement regarding Rand's credibility in the post of his you presented.

That said, Rand is not credible.

He is a wayward Libertarian.

MAGA.

lwf · Sep 8, 2025

Rogue Valley said:
Rand Paul slams JD Vance's defense of strike on alleged Venezuelan cartel

The Kentucky GOP senator wrote on social media that sentiments expressed by the vice president were "despicable" and "thoughtless."

www.newsweek.com

I pretty much detest both Rand Paul and Pete Hegseth. That said, Senator Paul is right in condemning this attack by the US military. Congress was not informed before, during, or even after the attack. For all we know, that was a boat with 12 immigrants on board. But we will never know now because the boat was totally destroyed and all 12 passengers were killed. Cartel drug boats rarely have more than a few people on board due to weight being reserved for drugs. This should have been an interdiction by a drug-enforcement organization such as the DEA. Stop the boat, search it, demand identification from the passengers, and if drugs are present, tow the boat to the nearest friendly harbor. Using a USAF strike to preemptively kill everone aboard could be considered premeditated murder. I worry that our US military - now packed with Trump-installed officials in the Pentagon - will allow itself to be complicit in Trump crimes against foreigners, and against American citizens.

I agree that the boat should have been interdicted and those on board taken into custody. This strike may amount to summary execution, though military actions against groups like massive drug cartels who operate almost without limits are a gray area. If a cartel or any other criminal group is able to fortify themselves such that they can operate in the open and repel law enforcement with overwhelming force, then military intervention starts to approach legal justification, and the military has a different set of legal rules it operates under than law enforcement does.

But I seriously doubt the US Navy engaged in this strike without enough intelligence to determine exactly who was on board. This isn't something that can be covered up by the United States. That's probably why it was announced immediately, not unlike the Bin Laden raid was. If this was a boat full of fishermen or migrants or any other innocents, then someone knows who they were and what they were doing. It won't take long to get their names. The only way we wouldn't find out who these people were is if they were engaged in clandestine activity and didn't want anyone to know who they were, what they were doing, or where they were going.

If it was a cartel operation as claimed then only the cartel knows who these people were, and they are unlikely to reveal this. If it was anyone else, then their families and friends know who they were and anyone who does even a cursory investigation into this incident could dig this information up with supporting evidence with little effort. That's the next step here: Third party investigation. Either it will find these people's identities, or it will hit a brick wall of armed cartel soldiers.

Rogue Valley · Sep 8, 2025

NOLA Dude said:
It didn't sound like you thought Rand Paul was credible when you posted this:

https://debatepolitics.com/threads/sen-paul-says-ukraine-aid-package-would-‘tie-the-hands’-of-future-administrations.533252/post-1079212129

As I said in the OP, I detest Rand Paul (who sucks up to Valdimir Putin) but I agree with his denunciation of this deadly US attack on the high seas.

CaughtInThe · Sep 8, 2025

Why shouldn't Trump and Vance murder anybody they want?

The Supreme Court is going to have their back. MAGAs will have their back. Fox News is going to have their back.

Rogue Valley · Sep 8, 2025

lwf said:
I agree that the boat should have been interdicted and those on board taken into custody. This strike may amount to summary execution, though military actions against groups like massive drug cartels who operate almost without limits are a gray area. If a cartel or any other criminal group is able to fortify themselves such that they can operate in the open and repel law enforcement with overwhelming force, then military intervention starts to approach legal justification, and the military has a different set of legal rules it operates under than law enforcement does.

But I seriously doubt the US Navy engaged in this strike without enough intelligence to determine exactly who was on board. This isn't something that can be covered up by the United States. That's probably why it was announced immediately, not unlike the Bin Laden raid was. If this was a boat full of fishermen or migrants or any other innocents, then someone knows who they were and what they were doing. It won't take long to get their names. The only way we wouldn't find out who these people were is if they were engaged in clandestine activity and didn't want anyone to know who they were, what they were doing, or where they were going.

If it was a cartel operation as claimed then only the cartel knows who these people were, and they are unlikely to reveal this. If it was anyone else, then their families and friends know who they were and anyone who does even a cursory investigation into this incident could dig this information up with supporting evidence with little effort. That's the next step here: Third party investigation. Either it will find these people's identities, or it will hit a brick wall of armed cartel soldiers.

I agree with some of your points. That said, deadly interdiction on the High Seas should not be Option #1. Any number of friendly South American navies could have assisted the US DEA to interdict this craft.

Once again, the Trump administration blows right by even a cursory stab at due process and observing International Maritime Law.

coyote505 · Sep 8, 2025

BitterPill said:
A normal drug-smuggling-by-small-boat scheme has a crew of one or two, so this must have been a super huge load of nefarious Venezuelan drugs that needed all the extra help.

MAGA.

Perhaps it was a load of Venezuelan terrorists? Saws somewhere that US claims they WERE told to heave to and allow boarding. If so, and they said F* you, it would have justified a bomb. However, since this is the T.Rump admin, I am not weighing their credibility very heavily.

lwf · Sep 8, 2025

Rogue Valley said:
I agree with some of your points. That said, deadly interdiction on the High Seas should not be Option #1. Any number of friendly South American navies could have assisted the US DEA to interdict this craft.

Once again, the Trump administration blows right by even a cursory stab at due process and observing International Maritime Law.

On that we can agree.

NOLA Dude · Sep 8, 2025

Rogue Valley said:
As I said in the OP, I detest Rand Paul (who sucks up to Valdimir Putin) but I agree with his denunciation of this deadly US attack on the high seas.

You insinuated he was somehow under the influence of Russia or working on their behalf. So a supposed Russian sympathizer is now suddenly credible? You can't have it both ways.

Rogue Valley · Sep 9, 2025

NOLA Dude said:
You insinuated he was somehow under the influence of Russia or working on their behalf. So a supposed Russian sympathizer is now suddenly credible? You can't have it both ways.

Sure I can. e.g. We don't always agree with each other on this board. Somethimes we do agree with someone, othertimes we don't. But it's not a choice chisled in stone.

Another example: I rarely agree with any political position by Marjorie Taylor Greene. But I 100% agree with her pro-stance on releasing all of the Epstein documents.

No one is as ideologically rigid as you imagine people to be. Get away from FOX and X for a while.

Rand Paul Slams JD Vance's Defense of Strike on Alleged Venezuelan Cartel

Rogue Valley

Lead or get out of the way