Pro Life or Pro Lying?

[calamity]

Interesting article here with a short film showing what lengths the pro-life crowd will go to in their efforts to thwart someone's legal rights. Lying, misdirection, outright deception, borderline kidnapping...the fanatics draw no lines when it comes to getting their way.

Must be nice to be so sure of your ideological position that even the law means nothing to you.
'Misconception' Reveals The Dark, Misleading World Of Crisis Pregnancy Centers

Some crisis centers provide factually incorrect advice about the process of abortion and its aftermath, others use religious rhetoric to shame women for their choices. Many such centers receive government funding through federal grants or state programs. Vice estimates that in 2014, CPCs could now outnumber abortion clinics 5 to 1.

The film, produced by Allison Yarrow and Claire Ward, investigates the deceptive practices these "clinics" use. Misrepresenting themselves as abortion providers using manipulative tactics like engineering their pages to show up in online searches for "pregnancy symptoms" or situating themselves next to abortion clinics, CPCs reel women in under false pretenses.

 

[MaggieD]

Interesting article here with a short film showing what lengths the pro-life crowd will go to in their efforts to thwart someone's legal rights. Lying, misdirection, outright deception, borderline kidnapping...the fanatics draw no lines when it comes to getting their way. Must be nice to know you are so right about your ideological position that even the law means nothing to you.
'Misconception' Reveals The Dark, Misleading World Of Crisis Pregnancy Centers

I didn't watch your video. Though I don't agree with their position, I understand the fervor of their beliefs. If I really truly believed that destroying a 3-month-old fetus was murder? I would likely be as fervent. I can't get there, frankly, and for that I'm grateful.

I often wonder if those who are really that fanatical in their beliefs understand the small percentage of abortions that they are really fighting against.

 

[Born Free]

Interesting article here with a short film showing what lengths the pro-life crowd will go to in their efforts to thwart someone's legal rights. Lying, misdirection, outright deception, borderline kidnapping...the fanatics draw no lines when it comes to getting their way. Must be nice to know you are so right about your ideological position that even the law means nothing to you.
'Misconception' Reveals The Dark, Misleading World Of Crisis Pregnancy Centers

In bold that is nothing compared to what the pro-choice do. They just kill what they don't like.

 

[calamity]

I didn't watch your video. Though I don't agree with their position, I understand the fervor of their beliefs. If I really truly believed that destroying a 3-month-old fetus was murder? I would likely be as fervent. I can't get there, frankly, and for that I'm grateful.

I often wonder if those who are really that fanatical in their beliefs understand the small percentage of abortions that they are really fighting against.

Definitely not my video. But, I agree with most of what you are saying. If I thought abortion was "murder", I'd be opposed to it also. However, they are not rare. The total abortions do add up--50 million since 1973 from what I read.

As for being right or wrong and believing what is real: I trust that in this day and age we know enough about fetal development to see clearly that a fetus less than 6 weeks old is definitely not like an infant. And, the evidence also shows that a fetus from 6-12 weeks old is not really a miniature version of a baby human, but rather a mammal in its earliest stages of development. I think the distinction there is very important.

Now, after 12 weeks, it is becoming more and more obvious that the fetus is human. And, i'm glad that abortions at that stage are very very rare.

 

[calamity]

In bold that is nothing compared to what the pro-choice do. They just kill what they don't like.

Good grief. Do you really believe it's that simple?

 

[MaggieD]

Definitely not my video. But, I agree with most of what you are saying. If I thought abortion was "murder", I'd be opposed to it also. However, they are not rare. The total abortions do add up--50 million since 1973 from what I read.

As for being right or wrong and believing what is real: I trust that in this day and age we know enough about fetal development to see clearly that a fetus less than 6 weeks old is definitely not like an infant. And, the evidence also shows that a fetus from 6-12 weeks old is not really a miniature version of a baby human, but rather a mammal in its earliest stages of development. I think the distinction there is very important.

Now, after 12 weeks, it is becoming more and more obvious that the fetus is human. And, i'm glad that abortions at that stage are very very rare.

I completely agree with you. I didn't mean to imply that it was really "your" video. Bad choice of words.

 

[calamity]

I completely agree with you. I didn't mean to imply that it was really "your" video. Bad choice of words.

It's great to find middle ground on such a hot-button topic. IMO, it's not black and white. In a perfect world no one who didn't want to get pregnant would, and those that did would never encounter complications.

But, the world is not perfect. Sometimes BC fails, sometimes people fail, sometimes a baby develops poorly and poses undue risks to the mother, sometimes the baby is so malformed that it cannot possibly live a normal healthy life. For those outcomes, people need options, IMO.

 

[RAMOSS]

In bold that is nothing compared to what the pro-choice do. They just kill what they don't like.

That can't be true. You are still alive, aren't you?

 

[nota bene]

I didn't watch your video. Though I don't agree with their position, I understand the fervor of their beliefs. If I really truly believed that destroying a 3-month-old fetus was murder? I would likely be as fervent. I can't get there, frankly, and for that I'm grateful.

I often wonder if those who are really that fanatical in their beliefs understand the small percentage of abortions that they are really fighting against.

In another thread, it's been observed that the number of women who die aren't a "percentage." If you regard each individual human life as sacred, the "small" percentage of abortions also doesn't matter much.

 

[calamity]

In another thread, it's been observed that the number of women who die aren't a "percentage." If you regard each individual human life as sacred, the "small" percentage of abortions also doesn't matter much.

It's not like those opposing abortion are rushing over to Africa to save those dying from Ebola or lying down in front of tanks in Syria. So, I question their commitment to "each human life as sacred."

IMO they are pawns of those with a political agenda. Nothing more nothing less.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

In bold that is nothing compared to what the pro-choice do. They just kill what who they don't like.

Fixed it for you.

That's a human being that they kill, “who”, not a “what”.

They kill innocent human beings, and then get indignant about what others will try to do to save these lives.

 

[nota bene]

It's not like those opposing abortion are rushing over to Africa to save those dying from Ebola or lying down in front of tanks in Syria. So, I question their commitment to "each human life as sacred."

IMO they are pawns of those with a political agenda. Nothing more nothing less.

So in order to value human life, one must race to Africa or lie down in front of tanks in Syria? Do you ever tire of making silly remarks such as these? :3oops:

 

[year2late]

I didn't watch your video. Though I don't agree with their position, I understand the fervor of their beliefs. If I really truly believed that destroying a 3-month-old fetus was murder? I would likely be as fervent. I can't get there, frankly, and for that I'm grateful.

I often wonder if those who are really that fanatical in their beliefs understand the small percentage of abortions that they are really fighting against.

Maggie, I get that if they truly believe that aborting the fetus was murder - they might do anything to prevent it.

But lying backfires. Finger wagging backfires even more quickly.

Get it together. The BEST thing to prevent abortions is not finger wagging in disgust and anger....but long term safe reliable birth control and the knowledge if they do get pregnant, they can support the baby.

 

[Muhammed]

Now, after 12 weeks, it is becoming more and more obvious that the fetus is human. And, i'm glad that abortions at that stage are very very rare.

Actually it is obvious at conception for those with at least a cursory knowledge of biology.

 

[Fedor50]

Now, after 12 weeks, it is becoming more and more obvious that the fetus is human. And, i'm glad that abortions at that stage are very very rare.

What was the fetus before it became a human?

 

[Fedor50]

It's great to find middle ground on such a hot-button topic. IMO, it's not black and white. In a perfect world no one who didn't want to get pregnant would, and those that did would never encounter complications.

But, the world is not perfect. Sometimes BC fails, sometimes people fail, sometimes a baby develops poorly and poses undue risks to the mother, sometimes the baby is so malformed that it cannot possibly live a normal healthy life. For those outcomes, people need options, IMO.

Killing an innocent human being because you made a mistake should NEVER be an option.

 

[calamity]

Actually it is obvious at conception for those with at least a cursory knowledge of biology.

Whatever you say, Mohammed.

 

[calamity]

Killing an innocent human being because you made a mistake should NEVER be an option.

Perhaps not, but killing a Zef most certainly is.

By the by, where were you when Bush and company were killing in ocent Iraqis by the tens of thousands? Are you protesting Israel's bombing of residential areas and schools where innocent mothers and children die?

Didn't think so.

Why don't you tell them killing innocent human beings is never an option? :roll:

 

[calamity]

What was the fetus before it became a human?

A Zef.

 

[calamity]

Maggie, I get that if they truly believe that aborting the fetus was murder - they might do anything to prevent it.

But lying backfires. Finger wagging backfires even more quickly.

Get it together. The BEST thing to prevent abortions is not finger wagging in disgust and anger....but long term safe reliable birth control and the knowledge if they do get pregnant, they can support the baby.

Most anti-abortionists like Jay, for example, oppose longterm assistance for single mothers. No proposals for free daycare, food stamps, housing or minimum wage increases ever passes muster for that crowd.

It's "save the fetus, and then raise your child in squalor, for all we care" with that bunch.

 

[nota bene]

As opposed to wholesale extermination of the unborn because they might grow up in squalor and neglect or abuse? :roll:

 

[year2late]

Most anti-abortionists like Jay, for example, oppose longterm assistance for single mothers. No proposals for free daycare, food stamps, housing or minimum wage increases ever passes muster for that crowd.

It's "save the fetus, and then raise your child in squalor, for all we care" with that bunch.

I just would think at the very least, they would realize that finger wagging is at best poorly effective. What is effective is long term safe and realiable birth control . I would think if they REALLY believed abortion was murder, and the finger wagging was so damned ineffectual, they would rally for development of long term safe and reliable birth control for men, and improve what they already have for women. And rally for accessibility as well.

After all, the sure fire way to prevent abortion is to prevent pregnancy. But that would be logical.

But it seems to stroke their egos to call abortion "murdering""babies".

 

[calamity]

As opposed to wholesale extermination of the unborn because they might grow up in squalor and neglect or abuse? :roll:

"Wholesale extermination of the unborn." Hyperbole much? :roll:

 

[calamity]

So in order to value human life, one must race to Africa or lie down in front of tanks in Syria? Do you ever tire of making silly remarks such as these? :3oops:

If you really valued each and every human life, doing no less would be acceptable.

 

[year2late]

If you really valued each and every human life, doing no less would be acceptable.

Heck, I would settle if the pro-life folks would rally for affordable decent health care. Could you imagine if they were on board with assuring health care for all Americans (pro-life vs pro-fetus)what the Affordable Care Act could have looked like????