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There's nothing remotely accurate in ignorant statements like "masks provide zero protection for anybody".So clueless I can accurately recite information, well all you can do is attack me.
Or maybe just value living life. There is nothing dumb about deciding to enjoy your summer and suffering a slightly higher risk.
of course you lefties believe society should be centrally controlled, live in a pod, ride light rail, eat bugs, do what the cathedral tells you
Numbers of cases are not relevant. Most cases are not serious, and these numbers might just reflect increased testing.
Only hospitalizations and death rates should be considered.
I am actually financially very well off. I never lost any work because of the pandemic, in fact I actually work more hours than I did before it. The pandemic has been great for me because I have been making a lot of money and had fewer opportunities to spend it.I bet many of you are in debt up to your eyeballs. You seem to gravitate to instant gratification without thinking through the consequences. I hope these folks enjoyed their summer because they will not enjoy their winter.
Blah blah blah, that is nearest self righteous moralizing on your part. If you can provide 100% certain documentary evidence that you have not spread any infectious disease to anybody ever then I will take you seriously on this. In fact you might’ve spread COVID-19 and not even known it. There is no legal or moral obligation for anyone to protect you from getting sick.
Yeah, you mean when close to 40% of Kiwis are now dependent on government welfare? How long do you think they can keep that up?Damn, that NZ story is amazing! To be Coronavirus-free. Imagine the personal freedom? And, the free economy! I'm envious!
Forever, once people get welfare in a democracy they will never vote for anyone who promises to cut itYeah, you mean when close to 40% of Kiwis are now dependent on government welfare? How long do you think they can keep that up?
That number then would seem to be similar to the number of Americans on the doll during non-corona times!Yeah, you mean when close to 40% of Kiwis are now dependent on government welfare? How long do you think they can keep that up?
Still doesnt address my point: how long do you think the world can keep this up?That number then would seem to be similar to the number of Americans on the doll during non-corona times!
As long as it takes to remain safe, I suppose. If we're already supporting 40% of our fellow Americans during ordinary times, I suspect Australia can for another 6-12 months. But, why? If they've really beaten down the virus, they can open-up a bit better.Still doesnt address my point: how long do you think the world can keep this up?
New Zealand's economy is a tiny fraction compared to ours. They wont be able to barricade themselves for long- and when they do have to open up, you can bet the virus will be back, and it'll be like lambs to the slaughter.As long as it takes to remain safe, I suppose. If we're already supporting 40% of our fellow Americans during ordinary times, I suspect Australia can for another 6-12 months. But, why? If they've really beaten down the virus, they can open-up a bit better.
Size of the economy doesn't matter. In terms of GDP per capita, we're not greatly different. Once they're vaccinated, like with any other disease, they'll be fine. And as committed & organized as they are, they'll likely be way before us. Maybe the end of next year.New Zealand's economy is a tiny fraction compared to ours. They wont be able to barricade themselves for long- and when they do have to open up, you can bet the virus will be back, and it'll be like lambs to the slaughter.
This isnt Hollywood. First of all there isnt any vaccine, and second of all they dont wipe out pandemics.Size of the economy doesn't matter. In terms of GDP per capita, we're not greatly different. Once they're vaccinated, like with any other disease, they'll be fine. And as committed & organized as they are, they'll likely be way before us. Maybe the end of next year.
I have to agree. The number of infected people is irrelevant save for these two metrics.Numbers of cases are not relevant. Most cases are not serious, and these numbers might just reflect increased testing.
Only hospitalizations and death rates should be considered.
I have to agree. The number of infected people is irrelevant save for these two metrics.
The ironic thing about many of these re-lockdowns (aside from the obvious fact that the first round of lockdowns accomplished nothing except to delay the inevitable) is that "the science" has been against lockdowns since before the pandemic started.
Masking and social distancing, yes, but epidemiologists have consistently maintained that lockdowns are not the solution. It's the politicians who want lockdowns--or rather, are forced into them by a reactionary public who will unreasonably blame them for every death if they don't.
And to make matters worse, now food prices are starting to skyrocket and food banks are running dry the world over. So let's cut production a little more, shall we?
This is madness. If the European politicians are terrified of COVID, they're going to love food riots, inflation riots, and dealing with millions of destitute, unemployed people with nothing left to lose. Watch them enforce their curfews, shutdowns, and martial law then.
Yes, the West has become smug, spoiled and complacent to the point where any perceived intrusion into our comfortable and entitled lives-like the minor inconvenience of wearing a mask-evokes hysterical whining about 'rights' violations and how 'unconstitutional' social distancing measures are. Then, of course, there's the illusion of 'freedom' where people don't understand that they're only as 'free' as their government sees fit. "Freedom's just another word for 'nothing left to lose' ".I bet many of you are in debt up to your eyeballs. You seem to gravitate to instant gratification without thinking through the consequences. I hope these folks enjoyed their summer because they will not enjoy their winter.
Paris Under Curfew: Europe Reacts As Countries See Highest-Ever Coronavirus Numbers https://www.npr.org/sections/corona...-countries-see-highest-ever-coronavirus-numbe
Coronavirus restrictions are taking effect in the Netherlands, the U.K., the Czech Republic and other parts of Europe on Wednesday as nations try to reverse an alarming wave in new cases. The continent is now seeing more new coronavirus cases – an average of 100,000 daily — than at any other time during the pandemic
Bars, restaurants and schools are being shut down or sharply limited, and officials are working to bolster hospital capacity, to accommodate an expected influx of new COVID-19 patients.
Numbers that showed signs of taking off in late August and September are now skyrocketing. Europe reported more than 700,000 new coronavirus cases last week – a surge representing a 36% weekly increase, as NPR's Reese Oxner recently reported.
Europe's infection rate "has been increasing for 77 days," the European Centre for Disease Prevention and Control said in its most recent weekly report for the European Economic Area and the United Kingdom.
In France, President Emmanuel Macron used a nationally televised interview Wednesday night to announce the start of nightly curfews in Paris and eight other densely populated areas in an effort to control the coronavirus in what are deemed "health emergency zones."
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Shut down? Keep businesses open? Mandate masks?
These are all questions that everyone in the world is finding out for themselves. There's no guide book for Covid-19, and despite what we know about this virus, there's a lot more that we don't know.
How does a country like New Zealand with a population of 4.8 million, get through the first wave of Covid-19 with just 25 deaths and 1,876 total infections, while the city Los Angeles, with roughly the same number of people, 4 million has had 16,769 deaths and 868,000 known infections?
Here's how New Zealand accomplished this;
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2025203
The government implemented a stringent countrywide lockdown (designated Alert Level 4) on March 26. During this period of exponentially increasing local cases, many people wondered whether these intensive controls would work. After 5 weeks, and with the number of new cases declining rapidly, New Zealand moved to Alert Level 3 for an additional 2 weeks, resulting in a total of 7 weeks of what was essentially a national stay-at-home order.
In early May, the last known Covid-19 case was identified in the community and the person was placed in isolation, which marked the end of identified community spread. On June 8, the government announced a move to Alert Level 1, thereby effectively declaring the pandemic over in New Zealand, 103 days after the first identified case.
Yes, but that's 50 on the metric scale...It's well-known most of European 'politicians' have IQ not nigher as 40 or 50
I frankly don't care who wants what, or why. Nor do I think it wise to say "Not locking down was Pres. Trump's policy" or "Not locking down was the Democrats' policy". Statements like these turn an issue like lockdown into partisan us-vs-them issues that only cause both sides to become more deeply entrenched.Trump didn't want to shut down the economy at the beginning. The Democrats have to think and do exactly the opposite of what ever Trump says or does, so Democrats are all for lockdowns, and blame Trump for all the deaths. And they also manage to blame Trump for the economic problems caused by the lockdowns that he didn't want, at first.
Do you mean "as high as 28 trillion by the end of the year"?Our national debt could be as high as 18 trillion dollars in 2 years.
Yes, you are correct and my figures were wrong. It's becoming harder to look into the future, nothing happening right now appears to be making a difference, we're going in the wrong direction. I don't even know what Joe Biden could do about it all. It appears the entire world is in for some big troubles ahead.Do you mean "as high as 28 trillion by the end of the year"?
You're at $27 trillion and change right now, not including agency debt and unfunded liabilities.
I frankly don't care who wants what, or why. Nor do I think it wise to say "Not locking down was Pres. Trump's policy" or "Not locking down was the Democrats' policy". Statements like these turn an issue like lockdown into partisan us-vs-them issues that only cause both sides to become more deeply entrenched.
What matters is the following: 1. Continue the masking and social distancing for at least another six months, since these measures have proven reasonably effective in "flattening the curve" without causing too much social and economic damage. 2. Avoid further lockdowns, which don't work (i.e. they only delay the inevitable), are not supported by epidemiologists, and cause incalculable social and economic damage.
As long as these things happen, who cares whose ideas they are?
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