Just existing does not merit respect. It is something that must be earned.
Go back and read your initial post. You are making unfounded assumptions about the older generation based on the acts of a few. When we older ones do it to you, it ain't fair. But you get to do it? You don't have to respect all your elders, as some do not deserve it.OdgenTugbyGlub said:Then why do I have to respect my elders? Because all I see is ya'll leading the world to hell in a handbasket.
In my view respect is deserved untill you do something to lose it. Respect is the default position (on the day to day level, not like at a skilled job or on a sports team), not a condition you work for. Its about maintaining respect, not earning it.
Tounge where? Oh, thats right, in the cheek. Sorry if you don't like my young whipper snapper sarcasm.Go back and read your initial post. You are making unfounded assumptions about the older generation based on the acts of a few. When we older ones do it to you, it ain't fair. But you get to do it?
There is no default position for either age. Those who do nothing but grow up, consume resources, and then die, do not deserve respect from others. Mere animals can do that. It is those who leave the world a better place than they found it that deserve respect. Which of the 2 that I just mentioned will be your goal in life?
You are confusing respect with courtesy, or civility. We all deserve courtesy, and should act with civility to one another.OdgenTugbyGlub said:Tounge where? Oh, thats right, in the cheek. Sorry if you don't like my young whipper snapper sarcasm.
Well now pad'ner, thats a mighty deep thought, but let me ask you something, wouldnt saying that "Just existing does not merit respect. It is something that must be earned" put the default respect level at zero? Now let me ask you another thing, whose definition of better are you using? Thats a mighty subjective term there. Besides, according to this thought, I would have to be dead before you respect me, and I don't plan on waiting that long for a little respect. Do you? I guess no one really gets any respect in the end then right?
You are confusing respect with courtesy, or civility. We all deserve courtesy, and should act with civility to one another.
If you are too young to know someone who is making the world a better place, then you may not be able to understand what I am saying.
And if you are using sarcasm, explain why you are doing so.
Just being a better parent than my own is something I have done. Not bragging, and not likely to merit a page in a history book, but my kids should respect me for what I have done for them. I suppose I could have kicked them out at age 17 like my parents did. But that would have been selfish, like expecting respect for being exactly as bad, or the same, as my parents.
1. Courtesy and civility should be a given in any polite society, no need for respect as a requirement up front. I am certainly not going to show respect for criminals, child molestors, etc. by default, or just because they started out as humans. It is what you do in life that garners respect.OdgenTugbyGlub said:Courtesy and civility are born out of a respect for others, a respect for their right to be treated with civility and courtesy. (1) You have to have respect on some level for them for you to be civil and courteous to them.
I am young enough not to be set in my views or better and worse, and old enough to know that my current views may or may not be right. (2) Don't lord your age over me, I know what I would consider a better world, but I also know that about 50% of the people within ten miles of me would completely disagree with me. Better is a subjective term not an objective term.
Sarcasm needs no explanation. It exists solely for the user and his friends amusment.
Congrats, but do you expect them to have to recognize what you've done for them to respect you? I bet you expect them to show you respect even when you do things that they dont see as in their best interest, but you know are. (3) In your view, you aren't making their world better, and thus you dont deserve their respect. (hypothetical situation, I'm not calling you a bad parent or making a slight on your kids.)
There was a joke going around, about a young man bragging about all the modern items his generation has compared to what the older man's generation had, insinuating that the older generation was no longer relevant.Old and wise said:Perhaps if the younger generation showed some respect for the older generation, they would be respected too. You harvest what you seed.
1. Courtesy and civility should be a given in any polite society, no need for respect as a requirement up front. I am certainly not going to show respect for criminals, child molestors, etc. by default, or just because they started out as humans. It is what you do in life that garners respect.
2. If you think I am "lording" my age over you, you have a chip on your shoulder. Did you come here to debate the question/issue, or just pick a fight?
The question remains, what will you do to be deserving of respect? Or, if you like, to maintain the current level of respect that you deserve?
ngdawg said:I, too, show respect at the outset until it's shown one doesn't really deserve it.
Every generation of teens thinks it is not getting the respect they think they deserve. But, in working with teens and having gone to school as an older adult surrounded by under-20's, I can honestly say that some (not all) truly aren't worth much respect. Rude, crude, devoid of basic manners, destructive and careless with other's property (come on, do you really have to walk down a hallway banging on every locker, shouting obscene rap lyrics?)
are surefire ways to not be treated as the adult you portend to be.
Short story: In the school where I worked, staff had 'miscellaneous duties' and mine was in the cafeteria. I had many 'daughters' in the school and one, standing in line to get her lunch, corrected my calling her a girl by saying, 'I am a WOMAN, Mrs. R!'(she was 13). I proceeded to ask her:' Oh? Who'd you vote for last election? Where ya working now? How many kids you have? Taking care of your bills ok?' The rest of the kids around us broke up into uncontrollable laughter and she shrunk to about 3 inches tall. Not my intention to totally embarrass her, but rather bring up a point(which she got)-you earn certain respects and titles through living, not by age. Respect as another human being is automatic and can wane or increase as your actions dictate. Respect just because you demand it is not automatic and will probably NOT increase much as a result.
Old and wise said:Perhaps if the younger generation showed some respect for the older generation, they would be respected too. You harvest what you seed.
galenrox said:Well you have to keep in mind that he's 14. When you're 14 you're angry, and although they typically lack wisdom, a lot of them know a lot and understand a lot more than they're given credit for.
When I was 14 I was really angry too, I bet you were too. But they can't learn anything if they're being patronized all of the time. If you talk to them like adults, hold them to the same standards as adults, and expect them to act like adults they will become adults, if they're treated like stupid little kids all of the time, they'll never learn how to not be a stupid little kid.
Think about it like learning a new language. You can pick up on it by being taught it, but you never really learn it well until you spend some time immersed in it, living in the country or whatever.
However stereo-typing is not only inefficient, but immoral.Just existing does not merit respect. It is something that must be earned.
Demanding it won't work. You can earn your respect by rising above the stereotype that many have of your generation.
I expect you will, but it isn't likely to happen overnight.
galenrox said:Yeah, but dude, think about it this way.
Kids are doing things that need to be done responsibly (sex, drugs, alcahol, etc.) younger and younger, while doing actual responsible things (getting married, starting a family, getting a real steady job, etc.) older and older. What this shows is that generation to generation we are we are becoming less and less mature. Now what makes someone mature? Life experience, screwing up, facing the consequences, learning to take accountability, and those things are hindered by people not getting treated as adults at older and older ages. Like, I'm 21, and it would be considered really weird if I was engaged or married, like out of the people I met in high school only 2 are getting married. My grandpa married his first wife when he was 20, and it was considered 100% normal. Now I'm not saying that not getting married young is a bad thing, but it just shows how we as a generation are immature. And a large part of that comes from the seniors treating us like children older and older, instead of treating us like adults.
UtahBill said:It isn't difficult at all for me to understand a 14 year old kid, as my wife teaches them and has stories quite often about them. She usually gets along with them better than most other teachers, but every few years or so she gets one that needs his ass whipped by his daddy, but usually mommy won't let daddy do what needs to be done.
Most of them are not being patronized all the time, and they are being treated like young adults, and they are fine with that. It is the few that want to be brats that make a teacher's work day miserable. Those few need to be booted out of school until they learn to behave themselves at school.
One mom asked her, "did you ever have a child like mine?" My wife said, "no, bit if I did, his dad and I would have taken care of the situation as soon as the first opportunity presented itself".
But like I tried to say earlier, there is an entirely different view of what respect is among the younger generation. Too many of them think that they deserve something that they do not want to earn, and are not willing to give in return even if they do get it.
A quote from someone,
"That which is achieved too easily, is esteemed too lightly"
Respect that is earned has more value than respect that is handed out like welfare.
SKILMATIC said:Well considering I ma not far from my teenage years repect much like trust is earned not given. Especially if you are a liberal it will be much harder for you to attain. Good luck:2wave:
HTColeman said:it is just that a new generation is full of teenagers and young adults...
The point is that older people are expected to be respected whether they earn it or not, merely because of the fact that they are older. I don't want built in respect, I just want to be treated as a normal person (as opposed to the messed up trouble maker stereotype that nearly all teens are given).SKILMATIC said:Well considering I ma not far from my teenage years repect much like trust is earned not given.
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