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Military Watering Down Standards So Females Can Meet Them

Even if true you are most likely Army which doesn't qualify you as some kind of expert on Marine training.

What about my experience? I would think that being an actual 0311 Marine Infantryman would make me an "Expert" in Marine training.

Or do you just ignore the experience of anybody that does not agree with you?
 

Well, that entire movement was kind of a FUBAR exercise that will likely not be repeated again any time soon. Moving PATRIOT up with the front line units in a combat environment is not needed at all, and thankfully is no longer part of the doctrine. But it does show that it is not only the Grunts who are in danger in the forward battle areas, combat today is not like WWII where you can generally draw a line on a map and assume that is the actual "front lines".

But yea, a lot of the Army seemed to go "Warrior Crazy" after that. Suddenly everybody was a Warrior, and they started to work hard to pound that into everybody. Although even 15 years later I do not think it has stuck more than in a superficial level. Because outside of grunts I have never seen those in another MOS working to keep their weapon clean without somebody else pushing them to do so. Or during some hip pocket training spend time teaching their younger soldiers how to react to a near ambush or go into a parking lot and actually practice doing a resection with a map, compass, and protractor.
 

What stupid comparison.

Body builder to females.
 
If you can't adjust it for women then you can't adjust it for age, either. Lots of senior NCOs won't like that....

No.
Adjusting things to make it easier for women is not the same as adjusting things to compensate for experience retention.
 
I see no wannabe Rambo's in them pictures just the difference between those that were coddled in coed boot and those that got a boot up their asses when they screwed up. There were NO Berghdahls in VN either.

I just bring up Rambo for all the people who never worked as a team and realize just how effective average people can be when well trained and they each do their part. Too much TV not enough reality. Just like everyone relates to James Bond as the super spy. When in reality some of the best spies are just the opposite. The last person in the world you would suspect.
 
May I ask why when their is evidence directly contradicting what he says would you believe him. The only reason I can see for it is because it's what you want to be true facts be damned.
 
May I ask why when their is evidence directly contradicting what he says would you believe him. The only reason I can see for it is because it's what you want to be true facts be damned.

General Bohm is answerable and accountable to people who rank higher. My opinion doesn't matter. When I was in the military we would follow the chain of command but we would gripe and complain about everything to each other. My feeling is that this thread is more about griping and complaining to each other. Solid actionable evidence should go up the chain of command if it exists.
 
Are you kidding? IF the next President is a Democrat - the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Starr will be a transgendered female who will order troops to turn in their assault weapons and arm themselves with ***** hats.
 
Yeah, this problem has been percolating for decades but it's all Trump's fault.
 
While the standards may be the same, Soldiers in non-combat units don't spend nearly the time on these skills as combat arms Soldiers do.
Bull****. I've spent way to much time with everyone re-re-recleaning our rifles to ever believe that.

Instead, I would say that unit, in particular, had poor leadership, from the Commander on down. Non-combat MOS undisciplined, as you claim.
 
No.
Adjusting things to make it easier for women is not the same as adjusting things to compensate for experience retention.
Adjusting things to exclude half your personnel is exactly like adjusting things to make it easier for the elderly.
 
Bull****. I've spent way to much time with everyone re-re-recleaning our rifles to ever believe that.

Instead, I would say that unit, in particular, had poor leadership, from the Commander on down. Non-combat MOS undisciplined, as you claim.

I never said they were undisciplined. I served in combat arms units and non-combat arms units. Soldiers is combat arms unit spend more time training in combat related tasks and are thereby more proficient in these tasks.
 
I never said they were undisciplined. I served in combat arms units and non-combat arms units. Soldiers is combat arms unit spend more time training in combat related tasks and are thereby more proficient in these tasks.
Sure seems like you are, though. You argue the unit got lost because they didn't have basic proficiency in land nav (I agree), and then you said they didn't have that basic proficiency because they were not a combat MOS. Meaning only combat MOSs have even a basic level of proficiency in land nav.

If combat MOSs are going beyond basic proficiancy, great for them, but that fact doesn't really matter here.

All I'm saying is 90% of the Army is non-combat MOS and perform land lav and weapons maintenance just fine, they don't get lost, and their rifles work. This one unit, in particular, was apparently ate the f up and I'm blaming their leadership.
 
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Adjusting things to exclude half your personnel is exactly like adjusting things to make it easier for the elderly.
You are confused as well as wrong.
Adjustments for experience is far more worthy than making adjustments for those who are not and may even be detrimental.
 
You are confused as well as wrong.
Adjustments for experience is far more worthy than making adjustments for those who are not and may even be detrimental.
That's an opinion, not a fact.
 
Which branch did you serve in?
iLOL
All you have done is confirmed your lack of understanding again.
Like the branch I served in matters as what I said would apply to any branch.
 
iLOL
All you have done is confirmed your lack of understanding again.
Like the branch I served in matters as what I said would apply to any branch.
Well, you don't see me running around telling people who were in a profession that they don't know what they're talking about regarding that profession.

So, lacking experience, do you have any 3rd party data supporting your view?
 
Well, you don't see me running around telling people who were in a profession that they don't know what they're talking about regarding that profession.
Doh! That is not what happened.
Thus again displaying your lack of understanding.


So, lacking experience, do you have any 3rd party data supporting your view?
Really? You want 3rd party data to show that those who are educated/trained, with years experience, are more important/valuable for retention purposes to justify the adjustments spoken about, and are therefore not the same as making adjustments for those who do not have such value? Really? That is what you want?
You can't figure that out on your own? Wow!
 
So you have no experience to draw from, nore 3rd party data. Is this typical of your posting style on the forum?
 
So you have no experience to draw from, nore 3rd party data. Is this typical of your posting style on the forum?
iLOL You are digging your hole even further.
Do you, or do you not understand how a person with training and experience is more valuable when compared to someone without such?
 

Looks like it is. Well, it was nice meeting you
 
Looks like it is. Well, it was nice meeting you
iLOL
Run away all you want.
You know the position you took is unsupportable and the reason you run now.
 
Adjusting things to exclude half your personnel is exactly like adjusting things to make it easier for the elderly.

You think women would make up half of the infantry, or even the military? Can you support this claim?

'cause, there are two branches with ground-combat-infantry: The Army, and the Marine Corps. And women are a heavy minority in both.



So... I'm not seeing the option for "half our infantry personnel being excluded" by keeping the infantry all-male... at all.

At the tactical level, as far as I'm aware, the "Old" guys are the ~35 year olds, and though you have some places where older guys exist, they tend to be the very hardy ~42 year olds. Hardly "Elderly".

Furthermore, if you will take a gander at the PFT/CFT standards for the Marine Corps, you will notice that they go up in strength requirements for those "older" men in their late 20s and early 30s, not down.

So..... I think you are quite a bit off, here, if you want to claim that A) we have lowered standards to allow the elderly to serve in the infantry and B) we have done so without impact in a way similar to the lowering of standards to help more females pass.
 
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