:naughtyAnother cherry picked quote from a single Iranian from Israeli sources noted for a long history of self serving deceptions & deliberate mistranslations is hardly indicative of Iran's propensity for developing & using nuclear weapons.
Remember that the Israelis were among those who fed the US deceptive Intel. prior to the last war the Israeli government wanted the US to fight for them. The current Israeli government even more fervent now & more prone to more plentiful & outrageous deceptions. Meanwhile, Iran has still attacked on one in 300 years.
Have you even lightly considered the long range & widespread carnage, environmental disaster, damage to US interests etc an unprovoked attack on Iran would incur?
Do you have the least concern for the lives of the thousands of loyal Americans currently serving in the Region or Iran's Jewish community?
I've cited a more impartial source ( below) as exposing the infamously fraudulent "Wipe Israel off of the Face of the map" as being a deliberate mistranslation intended to deceive those who aren't fluent in Farsi & are unfamiliar with Mid East / Cent. Asian realities.
There is far more proof that pro-War individuals, institutions & States will resort to any deception or False Flag attack than evidence that Iran will launch an unprovoked War.
History is simply repeating itself after only a few years.
Please remember that the same time "proof" of Iraq's WMDs, Yellowcake etc were dominating News headlines, Israeli lobbies were "quietly" pressuring Congress to approve "the use of force" against Iraq on false premises:
“Quietly lobbying Congress to approve the use of force in Iraq was one of AIPAC’s successes over the past year”
AIPAC Executive Director Howard Kohr; N.Y. Sun; Jan. ’03
All we have to show for our gullibility is seemingly endless Mid East carnage and underfunded, overcrowded V.A. hospitals where mangled, burned & traumatized, young Americans languish unmentioned while fresh War mongers peddle old deceptions.
Please Note:
“'Hitler' does New York”
Asia Times Online :: Middle East News - 'Hitler' does New York
EXCERPT “ Humming non-stop in the background noise was the "wipe Israel of the map" myth.
No one had the intellectual decency to point out that what he really said, in Farsi, in a speech on October 2005 to an annual anti-Zionist conference in Iran, was that "the regime occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the page of time".
He was doing no more than quoting the late ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini - hoping that an unfair (toward Palestine) regime would be replaced by another one more equitable; he was not threatening to nuke Israel. Warmongers anyway don't bother to check the facts.”CONTINUED
:naughty
As I already stated. Bs!
Pardon?OOOOOhhh,,, There's a convincing argument!
Pardon?
Did I make an argument or did I dismiss the crap he is spewing as it should be?
Clearly you absurdly think bs needs to be debated whereas I do not. :doh
Are you not clear as to what the information I provided supports?They why respond to the post?
Are you not clear as to what the information I provided supports?
As for calling his diatribe bs? It is. Nothing more needs be stated.
I'm not fluent in Farsi, are you?
Since I'm not fluent in Farsi, but am fluent in two other languages, I understand how easy it is to mistranslate phrases from one language to anther.
But, not being fluent in Farsi, I can only conclude that the phrases in question were or weren't mistranslations based on the evidence presented.
And, "that's BS" is not evidence.
They meant what was said.
Trying to obfuscate with bs doesn't change that.
But what was actually said?
Do you speak more than one language? If you do, then you know how easy it is to interpret a phrase in one as having a different meaning in another.
Again; They meant what was said.
More bs from you. Figures.And if Khomeini did mean what he said, what Khomeini said was: "“This occupation regime over Jerusalem must vanish from the arena of time.”*
NOT:
Israel “must be wiped off the face of the map,”
"Sadjadpour said Khamenei (The man being discussed in this thread) has been consistent, stating repeatedly that the goal is not the military destruction of the Jewish state but “the defeat of Zionist ideology and the dissolution of Israel through a ‘popular referendum.’”
Just because you want to believe a falsehood doesn't make that falsehood true.
It comes down to your preconception against Karim Sadjadpour's expertise & the knowledge of every articulate Farsi - English speaker.
Sadjadpour, who has closely studied the statements of Khamenei, has infinitely more knowledge & credibility in this issue than you.
You are welcome to believe that the earth is flat & welcome to dismiss the reality that it is round as "BS". Just don't expect rational & educated people to believe you.
The point of correcting deliberate mistranslations is to prove that Iran's leaders are not as threatening & dangerous as we have been led to believe and that there are those who would like us to see Iran as a greater threat than it really is.
_________________
Quoted information above from:
“Did Ahmadinejad really say Israel should be ‘wiped off the map’?”
Did Ahmadinejad really say Israel should be ‘wiped off the map’? - The Washington Post
Bs!
Iran militia chief: Destroying Israel is ‘nonnegotiable’
Basij commander Mohammad Reza Naqdi also threatens Saudis, saying their fate will be like that of Saddam Hussein
The commander of the Basij militia of Iran’s Revolutionary Guards said that “erasing Israel off the map” is “nonnegotiable,” according to an Israel Radio report Tuesday.
[...]
In 2014, Naqdi said Iran was stepping up efforts to arm West Bank Palestinians for battle against Israel, adding the move would lead to Israel’s annihilation, Iran’s Fars news agency reported.
“Arming the West Bank has started and weapons will be supplied to the people of this region,” Naqdi said.
“The Zionists should know that the next war won’t be confined to the present borders and the Mujahedeen will push them back,” he added. Naqdi claimed that much of Hamas’s arsenal, training and technical knowhow in the summer conflict with Israel was supplied by Iran.
[...]Iran militia chief: Destroying Israel is 'nonnegotiable' | The Times of Israel
___________________More bs from you. Figures.
What is sad is that you ignore "all official translations" of what his people say it meant.
Regardless, you were quoting me speaking about another thing. :doh
Again;
More bs from you. Figures.
What is sad is that you ignore "all official translations" of what his people say it meant.
Regardless, you were quoting me speaking about another thing. :doh
Again;
:doh"Official" lol.
Your comments are absurd.Nothing matters except for ACCURATE translations in all cases relating to Iranian quotes from Farsi.
If by "official translations", you mean the "Wipe Israel...." , that is a fraudulent mistranslation and is NOT what the speaker said even if you consider it "Official".
I'm not fluent in Farsi, are you?
Since I'm not fluent in Farsi, but am fluent in two other languages, I understand how easy it is to mistranslate phrases from one language to anther.
But, not being fluent in Farsi, I can only conclude that the phrases in question were or weren't mistranslations based on the evidence presented.
And, "that's BS" is not evidence.
:doh
Yes "Official".
From the link B'smith provided.
Ahmadinejad slightly misquoted Khomeini, substituting “safheh-i ruzgar,” or “page of time" for "sahneh-i ruzgar" or “arena of time.” But in any case, the old translation was dug up and used again by the Iranian news agency, Cole says. In fact, that’s how it was presented for years on Ahmadinejad’s English-language Web site, as the Times noted in a somewhat defensive article on the translation debate.
But the story doesn’t end there. Karim Sadjadpour, an Iranian specialist at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, notes that Iranian government entities began to erect billboards and signs with the “wipe off” phrase in English. Joshua Teitelbaum of the Jerusalem Center for Public Affairs compiled an interesting collection of photographs of these banners, such as one on the building that houses reserve military forces of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps. “Israel should be wiped out of the face of the world,” the sign reads in English.
Did Ahmadinejad really say Israel should be ‘wiped off the map’? - The Washington Post
Which links to the following info.
But translators in Tehran who work for the president's office and the foreign ministry disagree with them. All official translations of Mr. Ahmadinejad's statement, including a description of it on his Web site (www*president*ir/eng/), refer to wiping Israel away. Sohrab Mahdavi, one of Iran's most prominent translators, and Siamak Namazi, managing director of a Tehran consulting firm, who is bilingual, both say "wipe off" or "wipe away" is more accurate than "vanish" because the Persian verb is active and transitive.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/11/weekinreview/11bronner.html
So again; Yes, Official.
This bs that they didn't mean what even they say they meant, is absurd.
Your comments are absurd.
The accurate translation is exactly what they said it means.
Do you really not understand that?
You do not get to discount what they say it means. They decide that, not you, and not someone trying to spin what they mean.
They told you what it means and that is the final word on it.
No. We can conclude they are telling us exactly what they did.Can we conclude that they're saying one thing in Farsi, but another in English?
:doh
Yes "Official".
From the link B'smith provided.
Ahmadinejad slightly misquoted Khomeini, substituting “safheh-i ruzgar,” or “page of time" for "sahneh-i ruzgar" or “arena of time.” But in any case, the old translation was dug up and used again by the Iranian news agency, Cole says. In fact, that’s how it was presented for years on Ahmadinejad’s English-language Web site, as the Times noted in a somewhat defensive article on the translation debate.
But the story doesn’t end there. Karim Sadjadpour, an Iranian specialist at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, notes that Iranian government entities began to erect billboards and signs with the “wipe off” phrase in English. Joshua Teitelbaum of the Jerusalem Center for Public Affairs compiled an interesting collection of photographs of these banners, such as one on the building that houses reserve military forces of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps. “Israel should be wiped out of the face of the world,” the sign reads in English.
Did Ahmadinejad really say Israel should be ‘wiped off the map’? - The Washington Post
Which links to the following info.
But translators in Tehran who work for the president's office and the foreign ministry disagree with them. All officialtranslations of Mr. Ahmadinejad's statement, including a description of it on his Web site (www*president*ir/eng/), refer to wiping Israel away.[/COLOR][/U][/COLOR][/B] Sohrab Mahdavi, one of Iran's most prominent translators, and Siamak Namazi, managing director of a Tehran consulting firm, who is bilingual, both say "wipe off" or "wipe away" is more accurate than "vanish" because the Persian verb is active and transitive.
[url]http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/11/weekinreview/11bronner.html[/INDENT][/INDENT]
So again; Yes, Official.
This bs that they didn't mean what even they say they meant, is absurd.
Your comments are absurd.
The accurate translation is exactly what they said it means.
Do you really not understand that?
You do not get to discount what they say it means. They decide that, not you, and not someone trying to spin what they mean.
They told you what it means and that is the final word on it.
:dohMy comments are consistent with thousands like it interested in the truth instead of Western Major Media bias.
The name of this Thread: Khamenei calls ‘Death to America’ as Kerry hails progress on nuke deal.
All you have done is to clutter the question of what Khamenei said with anti Iranian opinions from the same anti Iranian sources that have perpetrated the "Wipe Israel...." myth on non-Farsi speakers for years.
For Example, when you mention pro Israel Joshua Teitelbaum's Report in the W.P. article, you conveniently omitted the salient fact that it was written from a pro-Israel perspective"
EXCERPT “......Teitelbaum’s report, while written from a pro-Israel perspective.......” CONTINUED
Next, you quoted Sohrab Mahdavi as supporting the "Wiped off the map....." but you omitted the later clarification that "map" was meant GEOGRAPHICAL "map" or "list of countries" not Israel itself.
Did you intentionally omit those relevant sections of the articles above?
"Just How Far Did They Go, Those Words Against Israel? "
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/11/weekinreview/11bronner.html?_r=0
EXCERPT "Ahmad Zeidabadi, a professor of political science in Tehran whose specialty is Iran-Israel relations, explained: "It seems that in the early days of the revolution the word 'map' was used because it appeared to be the best meaningful translation for what he said. The words 'sahneh roozgar' are metaphorical and do not refer to anything specific.
Maybe it was interpreted as 'book of countries,' and the closest thing to that was a map. Since then, we have often heard 'Israel bayad az naghshe jographya mahv gardad' — Israel must be wiped off the geographical map. Hard-liners have used it in their speeches."
The final translation issue is Mr. Ahmadinejad's use of "occupying regime of Jerusalem" rather than "Israel."CONTINUED
Khamenei , like Ahmadinejad only slightly misquoted Khomeini in the metaphorical meaning of the word "map" , "list of countries"
The vast majority of objective & professional translations indicate no hostile intent on the part of Iran including interpretations I have heard from Iranians as recently as last week.
Additionally, there is nothing in these Iranian speeches is there anything as bellicose as Netanyahu's martial rhetoric or that coming from Washington DC:
“McCain Joins Bolton, Invites Israel to Bomb Iran”
McCain Joins Bolton, Invites Israel to Bomb Iran*|*Jon Rainwater
No. We can conclude they are telling us exactly what they did.
When it is official endorsed as such there is no other interpretation.
Some protesters have helpfully done the translating for us lest their message be missed or misinterpreted.https://www.google.ca/search?q=deat...IKsf9oQSjwYGIAw&ved=0CDEQ7Ak&biw=1600&bih=742Well, maybe. I think B'smith makes a pretty good case for mis translation.
So, why would he Iranian government want to perpetuate the perception on the part of the West that they want to destroy Israel?
Consider this: The American president, on behalf of the United Nations, just brokered a deal in which Iraq would not enrich uranium to the point of it being weapons grade for, I believe 10 years or so, and assented to having inspectors to see to it that they kept their word. In exchange, they got economic sanctions lifted that was seriously weakening their economy.
Now, had the nations of the UN not seen Iran as a threat to Israel, they never would have bothered to negotiate anything, and Iran would still be stuck with the sanctions.
It makes sense that having perpetuated that mistranslation was a part of their strategy to get sanctions lifted.
Some protesters have helpfully done the translating for us lest their message be missed or misinterpreted.https://www.google.ca/search?q=deat...IKsf9oQSjwYGIAw&ved=0CDEQ7Ak&biw=1600&bih=742
Some protesters have helpfully done the translating for us lest their message be missed or misinterpreted.https://www.google.ca/search?q=deat...IKsf9oQSjwYGIAw&ved=0CDEQ7Ak&biw=1600&bih=742
_______________:doh
Your comments continue to be absurd.
You do not get to discount what they say it means. They decide that, not you, and not someone trying to spin what they mean.
They told you what it means and that is the final word on it. Period.
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