I don't understand why getting cheap consumer goods that raise our standard of living is a problem. (1 Viewer)

[craig]

Can anyone explain why?

 

[ataraxia]

Because Donald Trump said so, that's why. Now quiet down, stop asking so many questions, and just have faith. Salvation is nigh, The Messiah has come. Just have to believe- or we'll burn you alive at the stake.
/s

 

[Allan]

Can anyone explain why?

 

[SCrider]

Can anyone explain why?

Save money live better. The Walmart slogan for years.

 

[Integrityrespec]

There is a balance that must be struck between consumer pricing and manufacturing so that both benefit. If we buy all the cheap protects produced outside the U.S. that flood the U.S. market, then U.S. businesses at home will suffer and eventually shutter their doors. Overall loss of these business harms the overall economy and weakens the job market.

 

[Slartibartfast]

It isn't a bad thing when we have such a low unemployment rate.

 

[Queen Margo]

There is a balance that must be struck between consumer pricing and manufacturing so that both benefit. If we buy all the cheap protects produced outside the U.S. that flood the U.S. market, then U.S. businesses at home will suffer and eventually shutter their doors. Overall loss of these business harms the overall economy and weakens the job market.

Why is it that the CHINESE see the big picture, but so many Americans don't?

 

[Feynman Lives!]

Can anyone explain why?

Because they're made by FOREIGNERS! A xenophobic fascist state cannot tolerate that.

 

[ataraxia]

There is a balance that must be struck between consumer pricing and manufacturing so that both benefit. If we buy all the cheap protects produced outside the U.S. that flood the U.S. market, then U.S. businesses at home will suffer and eventually shutter their doors. Overall loss of these business harms the overall economy and weakens the job market.

Not at all. The modern world and economy are about the knowledge/service sector. That's what the world's most advanced economies are focusing on to stay competitive. That's why their governments place such a strong emphasis on education and training of their public. Trying to stay a low-skill manufacturing economy will stunt economic growth and GDP and make the US uncompetitive on today's global stage. Just because something worked to keep America great in the 1950s does not mean that's what will keep it great today. We might as well just go back to being an early 18th century pre-industrial agrarian society.

 

[craig]

There is a balance that must be struck between consumer pricing and manufacturing so that both benefit. If we buy all the cheap protects produced outside the U.S. that flood the U.S. market, then U.S. businesses at home will suffer and eventually shutter their doors. Overall loss of these business harms the overall economy and weakens the job market.

Subsidizing uncompetitive businesses by artificially raising prices for consumers is not logical in a market economy.

 

[Ishm]

Trumps basic premises that continually running large trade deficits is harmful is fundamentally correct. If we spend that deficit money inside our own economy we will increase the size of our own economy. The problem is that Trumps thinking stops right there. There appears to be no thought given to the reality of the economic impacts that come with Trumps goal of nationalising the production required to eliminate the trade deficit. Trump talks about jobs, but we have more of an issue with the lack of employable workers than we do with a lack of jobs. Sure we could probably get some benefit from a few extra well paid jobs (not low paid factory line work etc), but a simple analysis tells you that we don't have anything like the available work force needed to 're-nationalise' enough production to eliminate the deficit. And Trump completely ignores the negative impact on consumption, and decrease in life styles that come with the price increases associated with shifting a lot of production to the US.

This is like so many things with Trump. He can have a reasonable goal that would be good to achieve, but absolutely zero idea of how to realistically achieve the goal. He just completely skips the analytical and planning parts because the bore him and he isn't good at those anyway. Hence we never get to the intended goal, and suffer all sorts of undesirable side effects as be bumbles around trying to figure out what went wrong and why it isn't as easy in reality as it is in his wet dreams.

 

[element94]

Can anyone explain why?

You're not just being ruled by Trump, you are also being ruled by the billionaires who continue to benefit from this nation. There is never enough for these scumbags, and they will get it at all costs to everything and everyone else, so that's it in a nutshell.
These billionaires that already have so much want to limit Congress' power over them. Remember a few years ago Elizabeth Warren was talking about breaking up Amazon? Well, not so much now since the subservient cons control all three branches of government, and now Amazon's sales are over a trillion dollars! No one person should have that amount of money and power, because it leads to the shit we are now seeing - oligarchs backing a money and power crazed criminal and traitor.

 

[element94]

Because Donald Trump said so, that's why. Now quiet down, stop asking so many questions, and just have faith. Salvation is nigh, The Messiah has come. Just have to believe- or we'll burn you alive at the stake.
/s

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That is some serious anti-Christ garbage. I refuse to believe any MAGA stooge actually believes any of that except to troll the left.

 

[ataraxia]

That is some serious anti-Christ garbage. I refuse to believe any MAGA stooge actually believes any of that except to troll the left.

Nah, the mindset of blind and unquestioning faith instilled into them from a young age, and thinking that if anything or anyone makes them feel good it must be true- rather than the mindset of critical thinking and curiosity, sets such folks up for all sorts of nonsense and exploitation. That's how they are such ready and easy targets for unscupulous politicians and clergy to exploit.

"Man, once surrendering his reason, has no remaining guard against absurdities the most monstrous, and like a ship without a rudder, is the sport of every wind. With such persons, gullibility, which they call faith, takes the helm from the hand of reason, and the mind becomes a wreck."
-Thomas Jefferson

"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes."
_Thomas Jefferson

​

 

[element94]

Nah, the mindset of blind and unquestioning faith instilled into them from a young age, and thinking that if anything or anyone makes them feel good it must be true- rather than the mindset of critical thinking and curiosity, sets such folks up for all sorts of nonsense and exploitation. That's how they are such ready and easy targets for unscupulous politicians and clergy to exploit.

"Man, once surrendering his reason, has no remaining guard against absurdities the most monstrous, and like a ship without a rudder, is the sport of every wind. With such persons, gullibility, which they call faith, takes the helm from the hand of reason, and the mind becomes a wreck."
-Thomas Jefferson

"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes."
_Thomas Jefferson

​

Here's some other far-seeing quotes from the early days of the republic:

(Nothing)is more essential, than that permanent, inveterate antipathies against particular Nations, and passionate attachments for others, should be excluded; and that, in place of them, just and amicable feelings towards all should be cultivated. The Nation, which indulges towards another an habitual hatred, or an habitual fondness, is in some degree a slave. It is a slave to its animosity or to its affection, either of which is sufficient to lead it astray from its duty and its interest. Antipathy in one nation against another disposes each more readily to offer insult and injury, to lay hold of slight causes of umbrage, and to be haughty and intractable, when accidental or trifling occasions of dispute occur. Hence frequent collisions, obstinate, envenomed, and bloody contests. The Nation, prompted by ill-will and resentment, sometimes impels to war the Government, contrary to the best calculations of policy.

And:

All obstructions to the execution of the Laws, all combinations and associations, under whatever plausible character, with the real design to direct, control, counteract, or awe the regular deliberation and action of the constituted authorities, are destructive of this fundamental principle, and of fatal tendency. They serve to organize faction, to give it an artificial and extraordinary force; to put, in the place of the delegated will of the nation, the will of a party, often a small but artful and enterprising minority of the community; and, according to the alternate triumphs of different parties, to make the public administration the mirror of the ill-concerted and incongruous projects of faction, rather than the organ of consistent and wholesome plans digested by common counsels, and modified by mutual interests.

However combinations or associations of the above description may now and then answer popular ends, they are likely, in the course of time and things, to become potent engines, by which cunning, ambitious, and unprincipled men will be enabled to subvert the power of the people, and to usurp for themselves the reins of government; destroying afterwards the very engines, which have lifted them to unjust dominion.

George Washington's Farewell Address, September 17, 1796

 

[aociswundumho]

Can anyone explain why?

Because economic morons like the political left and like Trump think only in terms of "the worker". Trump's tariffs are about jobs, i.e. "the worker". The reason we can't have cheap, affordable cars is because of labor cartels (unions) i.e. "the worker". You can hear the same morons grumbling about AI because of, you guessed it, "the worker". Catering to "the worker" will give you an economy like France, where everyone is poor, including "the worker".

 

[ataraxia]

Here's some other far-seeing quotes from the early days of the republic:

(Nothing)is more essential, than that permanent, inveterate antipathies against particular Nations, and passionate attachments for others, should be excluded; and that, in place of them, just and amicable feelings towards all should be cultivated. The Nation, which indulges towards another an habitual hatred, or an habitual fondness, is in some degree a slave. It is a slave to its animosity or to its affection, either of which is sufficient to lead it astray from its duty and its interest. Antipathy in one nation against another disposes each more readily to offer insult and injury, to lay hold of slight causes of umbrage, and to be haughty and intractable, when accidental or trifling occasions of dispute occur. Hence frequent collisions, obstinate, envenomed, and bloody contests. The Nation, prompted by ill-will and resentment, sometimes impels to war the Government, contrary to the best calculations of policy.

And:

All obstructions to the execution of the Laws, all combinations and associations, under whatever plausible character, with the real design to direct, control, counteract, or awe the regular deliberation and action of the constituted authorities, are destructive of this fundamental principle, and of fatal tendency. They serve to organize faction, to give it an artificial and extraordinary force; to put, in the place of the delegated will of the nation, the will of a party, often a small but artful and enterprising minority of the community; and, according to the alternate triumphs of different parties, to make the public administration the mirror of the ill-concerted and incongruous projects of faction, rather than the organ of consistent and wholesome plans digested by common counsels, and modified by mutual interests.

However combinations or associations of the above description may now and then answer popular ends, they are likely, in the course of time and things, to become potent engines, by which cunning, ambitious, and unprincipled men will be enabled to subvert the power of the people, and to usurp for themselves the reins of government; destroying afterwards the very engines, which have lifted them to unjust dominion.

George Washington's Farewell Address, September 17, 1796

Wow. What a prescient quote. Amazing how relevant it is to today's headlines!

Thanks for posting it.

 

[Questerr]

There is a balance that must be struck between consumer pricing and manufacturing so that both benefit. If we buy all the cheap protects produced outside the U.S. that flood the U.S. market, then U.S. businesses at home will suffer and eventually shutter their doors. Overall loss of these business harms the overall economy and weakens the job market.

The US is one of the largest manufacturers in the world. The idea that we are anywhere close to buying everything from other countries is absurd.

 

[element94]

Wow. What a prescient quote. Amazing how relevant it is to today's headlines!

Thanks for posting it.

Remember it the next time Trump compares himself to, or otherwise perverts Washington's name, because Washington would run Trump through with his sword without a second thought.

 

[OrphanSlug]

"I don't understand why getting cheap consumer goods that raise our standard of living is a problem." Can anyone explain why?

It is a bit more complicated than the statement.

But before bothering everyone with another lengthy economic answer no one will read, the ultimate issue is the political argument for manufacturing domestically even though there is little economic or even business objective reason for the US to suddenly become a net exporter (GDP speaking) anytime soon.

It is one of those goals that sounds nice to those that do not understand why offshoring happened in the first place.

 

[craig]

Why is it that the CHINESE see the big picture, but so many Americans don't?

Is that the model Trump wants to follow?
China's economy is generally described as a managed economy or a "socialist market economy," meaning it combines elements of both market capitalism and state planning. While it embraces market principles, it also features substantial government intervention and control, particularly in key industries and sectors.

 

[bomberfox]

Can anyone explain why?

Its not a problem unless you open every single avenue for capitalists to export the means of production to slave labor.

 

[ataraxia]

Remember it the next time Trump compares himself to, or otherwise perverts Washington's name, because Washington would run Trump through with his sword without a second thought.

Yep. Most of the founding fathers probably would. He is their worst nightmare come true.

“When a man unprincipled in private life desperate in his fortune, bold in his temper, possessed of considerable talents...— despotic in his ordinary demeanour — known to have scoffed in private at the principles of liberty — when such a man is seen to mount the hobby horse of popularity — to join in the cry of danger to liberty — to take every opportunity of embarrassing the General Government & bringing it under suspicion — to flatter and fall in with all the non sense of the zealots of the day — It may justly be suspected that his object is to throw things into confusion that he may ‘ride the storm and direct the whirlwind.’ … No popular government was ever without its Catilines and its Caesars. These are its true enemies.”
-Alexander Hamilton

“… cunning, ambitious, and unprincipled men will be enabled to subvert the power of the people and to usurp for themselves the reins of government, destroying afterwards the very engines which have lifted them to unjust dominion.”
_George Washington

“A Man compounded of Law and Gospel, is able to cheat a whole Country with his Religion, and then destroy them under Colour of Law … .”
-Benjamin Franklin

 

[Lovebug]

There is a balance that must be struck between consumer pricing and manufacturing so that both benefit. If we buy all the cheap protects produced outside the U.S. that flood the U.S. market, then U.S. businesses at home will suffer and eventually shutter their doors.

If businesses have nothing left to sell or if we can't afford what they are selling, businesses will close.

Overall loss of these business harms the overall economy and weakens the job market.

 

[element94]

Yep. Most of the founding fathers probably would. He is their worst nightmare come true.

“When a man unprincipled in private life desperate in his fortune, bold in his temper, possessed of considerable talents...— despotic in his ordinary demeanour — known to have scoffed in private at the principles of liberty — when such a man is seen to mount the hobby horse of popularity — to join in the cry of danger to liberty — to take every opportunity of embarrassing the General Government & bringing it under suspicion — to flatter and fall in with all the non sense of the zealots of the day — It may justly be suspected that his object is to throw things into confusion that he may ‘ride the storm and direct the whirlwind.’ … No popular government was ever without its Catilines and its Caesars. These are its true enemies.”
-Alexander Hamilton

“… cunning, ambitious, and unprincipled men will be enabled to subvert the power of the people and to usurp for themselves the reins of government, destroying afterwards the very engines which have lifted them to unjust dominion.”
_George Washington

“A Man compounded of Law and Gospel, is able to cheat a whole Country with his Religion, and then destroy them under Colour of Law … .”
-Benjamin Franklin

The warnings have been there from the beginning, yet ignorance has prevailed. That's because it was bought and paid for by the wealthy, and it has paid off... so far.