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Exactly! I think the op was rather disingenuous, and a knee-jerk reaction to some of us who don't necessarily buy into the notion that American women are the perfect model around the world.Who here (besides Tigger, of course) would actually support raising their daughters to be "weak and defenseless?" :screwy
How should we be raising our daughters these days?
Should we try to instill independence, strength, common sense, confidence, perseverance, self worth, and a strong desire to achieve great things?
Or should we raise them to be dependent, submissive, shy, and always in need of protection? Wallflowers?
Should we push them towards greatness?
Or should we teach them that their place is always in the background?
Should we have a desire for them to be the leader, the captain, the driver?
Or should we teach them to accept always being the passenger, along for the ride but never making the decisions or steering the boat?
Should we raise our daughters as achievers? CEO's? Entrepreneurs? Bosses?
Or should we raise them to be followers?
Should we tell our daughters they can be ANYTHING they wish to be? Whether it be a mother of 5 kids, or the scientist that cures cancer while stationed on Mars after having piloted the first mission to Mars?
Or should we tell our daughters their place is to be a good, quiet, and submissive "second" to their spouse?
Should we raise your daughters to be strong?
Or are they to be weak and defenseless?
How do you think our daughters should be raised today?
There are plenty of decent American women around, but our entire culture is based on a rather self-centered pov these days, and this gets extended into our personal relationships, with women thinking that being strong means they don't need anyone else.
When you say "entire culture" then why single out women as being the ones with issues?
Also - why should anyone be taught that they "need" someone else?
This "you complete me" bs is crazy. Why not we compliment each other?
To be successful does a woman need a man? Does a man need a woman?
Are you defined by your "significant other"?
Individuality and independence are great for guys, but not so great for girls?
Exactly! I think the op was rather disingenuous, and a knee-jerk reaction to some of us who don't necessarily buy into the notion that American women are the perfect model around the world.
There are plenty of decent American women around, but our entire culture is based on a rather self-centered pov these days, and this gets extended into our personal relationships, with women thinking that being strong means they don't need anyone else.
While I'm not even sure if I'd even know how to raise a girl to be a "princess" (I'm a bit too rough around the edges for that myself, I suspect :lol: ), I wouldn't see any problem with raising one to acknowledge the reality that she is, in fact, a girl, and shouldn't be afraid to act like one.
At my wife's instance, we raised our Daughter to be able to stand on her own should the need arise.
To that end She is well educated, married, and seems like a well adjusted adult.
I considered myself a success as a parent, when I found my adult children were not just good
people, but interesting to be around and have a conversation with.
Moderator's Warning: |
We're only looking at 1 or 2 of them. If they disappoint me, they essentially get erased from the family history, as if they never existed in the first place. No skin off my nose.
No, I said her job is to support her family, and especially her Husband. Love is irrelevant to the concept, and if I did mention that idea, it was in total error.
You may change your attitude when you do become a parent, Tigger, parenthood can change people.
Your fiance is going to marry you knowing that you do not love her? That's sad.
She doesn't believe in Love either, LM. For different reasons we both learned that Love does not really exist before we were 15 years old. We got to see the darkness in the human heart very early in life and understand that the only person anyone looks out for is themselves. She'll be 33 this year and I'll be 40. Neither one of us has found anything to change our view on Love over that period of time.
The idea that parenthood changes people is one of the reasons I've never had a significant interest in it.
Love exists, Tigger, I can assure you of that. I love my son, my daughter and my four grand daughters with depth and sincerity. I do not look out for just myself or exist for just myself. Romantic love I have had little of....I loved and lost (my ex-husband walked out one day when the kids were very young) and have not been fortunate enough to have loved, or to have been loved by a man, again. I would (almost) sell my soul to be loved, to have what I see my married colleagues at work have. Tis not to be and I know that leaves me with a hole in my life. Like me, I think that you and your fiance probably wrap a coat of cynicism about love around you...it helps to ward of hurt and disappointment and it means one can avoid all the pain that goes with that. To let one's guard down requires a leap of faith that is difficult to take, but there is a sadness of the soul, an emptiness that comes from spending one's time, in my case decades, protecting ourselves from the hurt that we think love brings.
I wish you and your fiance happiness if not love in the future.
How should we be raising our daughters these days?
Should we try to instill independence, strength, common sense, confidence, perseverance, self worth, and a strong desire to achieve great things?
Or should we raise them to be dependent, submissive, shy, and always in need of protection? Wallflowers?
Should we push them towards greatness?
Or should we teach them that their place is always in the background?
Should we have a desire for them to be the leader, the captain, the driver?
Or should we teach them to accept always being the passenger, along for the ride but never making the decisions or steering the boat?
Should we raise our daughters as achievers? CEO's? Entrepreneurs? Bosses?
Or should we raise them to be followers?
Should we tell our daughters they can be ANYTHING they wish to be? Whether it be a mother of 5 kids, or the scientist that cures cancer while stationed on Mars after having piloted the first mission to Mars?
Or should we tell our daughters their place is to be a good, quiet, and submissive "second" to their spouse?
Should we raise your daughters to be strong?
Or are they to be weak and defenseless?
How do you think our daughters should be raised today?
That's interesting. Are you calling American a child-abuser?
How many children do you have?
Do you know what it's like to be a child? Right back at you.
And if your daughter says,
"Nope - I want to go to college, major in biology, then go to grad school and study genetic-engineering so that I can become a scientist and work on finding cures for childhood diseases."
What do you do then?
Pack her in the car, drive to a local hospice, walk her into a room with two dying people. She can see the rich single woman, dying all alone and then look at the grandmother surrounded by her children and grandchildren who love her dearly and who will live on as a testament to her presence on this earth and will keep their love for this woman alive until their own dying dies.
Then ask my daughter which fate she prefers - to be alone with her money or her memories of being stuck in a lab working with cultures or with the people who enriched her life?
Some people obviously think girls should be raised differently.
Some people don't think girls should have equal opportunity to chase dreams like boys do.
It's not just Tigger. My own mother-in-law once told my oldest daughter she should not go to college, and that what she should really do is get married and start a family. I almost lost my cool over that and started a massive family dispute. Almost.
Oldest daughter will be graduating college in May with just under a 4.0 gpa in biology.
Still waiting on replies from medical grad schools at this time.
Now tell me why does wanting to be microbiologist lead to a life of loneliness? You can have both. Why do you not want your daughter to live her own life?
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