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You need to understand the concept of Corporatism, in order to see why we are there, and there we will stay. You don't build four US bases on Iraqi soil with the intention of leaving. If your really interested, go to the website below, and navigate over to the icon Corporatism:Originally posted by ArchEnemy:
So we're in Iraq right? Many of our brothers are dying every day from a relentless enemy, who will never tire nor die out. Fighting this enemy and becoming victorious is impossible. So the smart thing to do would be to pull our brothers out of danger and into safety, yet we haven't "completed the mission"
I must be out of it or something, but what exactly is our mission? We've successfully invaded Iraqi soils, we destroyed Saddam's regime, we've created an Iraqi Security force, we've also exposed these people to an act of democracy and a showing of freedom.
Is our current mission to aid the Iraqi people? If so then why is it that alto of our military personal would agree that they're only looking after their own skin now.
I really am clueless. Enlighten Me!
Billo_Really said:You need to understand the concept of Corporatism, in order to see why we are there, and there we will stay. You don't build four US bases on Iraqi soil with the intention of leaving. If your really interested, go to the website below, and navigate over to the icon Corporatism:
www.craigbhulet.com
FiremanRyan said:please show me one foreign war the US was involved in where they didnt establish military bases.
we are still in Iraq to ensure our progress. just look at any news source and you will quickly realize that the new Iraqi government is not able to stand on its own just yet. not to mention that there are still pockets of resistance and groups willing to kill to find a spot in this new government. once they're able to operate independantly, we can pull out, but doing that too soon would be a complete waste. we lost a lot of lives, but we're bringing some stability to a very unstable area. already other countries are following suite (this isnt something you hear about much in the US media huh?), but if we pulled out now, all lost lives and years of progress would be worthless. not to mention an utter act of irresponsibility. id rather have us be known as the country that started a controversial war but brought a working democracy to a troubled nation, not the country who started a controversial war and left another in complete shambles.
There's no other way to see if this government can hold it's own then to put it on it's own feet and let it deal with these situations by itself. Is a Conservative actually caring what the UN thinks? Doesn't that go against your code of conducts? The reason why they would blame us is because countries like France offered us help in this coalition and we turned around a threw it in their face. They told us if we gave the inspectors more time, then they'd join our coalition, I know if France would join our efforts then the UN would definitely validate our invasion and we wouldn't be at these odds we are today.Satanloveslibs said:And if we leave now I believe the Iraqi government will fall, the UN will blame us, and it would have been a complete waste of time.
Haha that's funny, we cannot destroy terrorism! The War on Terrorism cannot be won it can only be fought, and fighting means death... so the War on Terrorism will only end up in bloodshed. Wishing the world was under democracy bascially means you support America's global domination efforts? I mean, we're the only country fighting to force democracy on other countries, are we not?SatanlovesLibs said:I hope we destroy terrorism. That would be freakin awsome, but not all dreams come true. I wish the whole world was under democracy.
"Our" politicans? "Your" politicans, I don't accept the politicians who run this country, I've yet to see one worthy enough to shine my sneakers before my next basketball game.topgun said:I assure you, the President is not happy about Americans dying either, as much as some people would like to tell you. Our politicians, liberal and conservative alike, want the soldiers home as soon as possible. but right now, it is not possible.
When is it sufficient enough to be released on its own? I'll answer that for you, as soon as we get the baby bottle out of it's mouth and let it grow and strengthen on its own. I mean we went through the same thing.topgun said:The simple truth is that the Iraqi government is not yet self-sufficient and cannot support itself if we left.
Arch Enemy said:Living with-out any self-dignity is a hard thing to do, but at least you're living. Would you be willing to tell the wives, parents, childrens, husbands and friends of many soldiers that their loved ones died because you'd rather not admit your mistake, that you'd rather not admit that your ignorance got in the way of the lives of American people. Please don't tell me "they enlisted to fight for their country, so this was their duty" that's total bs, they enlisted because they wanted to PROTECT their country, not fight somebodies else's war.
Iraq was NOT a threat to the United States, they didn't poses the weapon capability to attack the United States, Bush knew this. Ok, you might be able to make the arguement "Saddam needed to be removed from power his opression of his people needed to end" but you forget the fact the Iraqi people aren't the worst off. If the United States is playing Global Police, then they're obviously doing a terrible job, Al Queida is much stronger now that they have more sympathizers than before.
Arch Enemy said:There's no other way to see if this government can hold it's own then to put it on it's own feet and let it deal with these situations by itself. Is a Conservative actually caring what the UN thinks? Doesn't that go against your code of conducts? The reason why they would blame us is because countries like France offered us help in this coalition and we turned around a threw it in their face. They told us if we gave the inspectors more time, then they'd join our coalition, I know if France would join our efforts then the UN would definitely validate our invasion and we wouldn't be at these odds we are today.
"Complete waste of time", I believe that's what this whole campaign is. We invade a country, who we knew didn't pose much of a threat to us, we easily dominate what was left of their military force, we're met with an insurgency which will only stop once we leave. The Iraqi people are worse off, instead of being afraid of a man who has ultimate power of their lives, they're afraid of men who have bombs strapped to their chest and are willing to blow them sky-high. I don't blame any Iraqis who are pissed at the United States, last time we came to help them we left them with the same tyrannical dictator, after-math of war, and newly posted Sanctions! I'd be angry too.
Haha that's funny, we cannot destroy terrorism! The War on Terrorism cannot be won it can only be fought, and fighting means death... so the War on Terrorism will only end up in bloodshed. Wishing the world was under democracy bascially means you support America's global domination efforts? I mean, we're the only country fighting to force democracy on other countries, are we not?
FiremanRyan said:no one's saying you're wrong. but what mistake did i make? i dont feel that i have anyone to apologize to. and would i tell a parent that their son or daughter died for what i said? yes. i hate telling "my friend" stories but i have one that applies pretty well...
i went to high school with a kid named Nate. he graduated with a 3.9, great guy, and completely unbiased when it came to politics, he was dead in the middle. after high school he enlisted in the airforce and became a para-rescueman. his family was very anti-war and after being sent to Iraq, they constantly wanted to know about what he felt being over there. he thought we should have been there because our intellegence and that of other countries all pointed to WMD's. but he said that even if that wasnt the case, the US was doing the best thing possible for the Iraqi people. he said they have so much love for the US military and the fact that theyre there to enforce a change in government that he doesnt regret going one bit. she asked him if he would die for that and he said absolutely. well back in 04, Nate died when their helicopter went down. at his funeral, his mom openly said that they oppose the war, but admitted that "their son died for something he wanted, something he thought should be done".
...so did i support the Iraq war? yes. did i vote for W? yes. but i also agree that there are some shady things surrounding this war and Bush himself. i dont exactly side with what we did and especially how we did it. but let me tell you one thing. as someone who has many close friends and family members currently serving in the military, and from someone who was breifly in the military himself, i can say that the majority of our troops serving in Iraq know that they are there for a purpose. whether they think the WMD thing was a lie/error or not, to them it has become a humanitarian issue. every lib says "oh thats bullshit". well, its not to them, and honestly their opinion on the matter means a hell of a lot more than any of yours.
SatanicCultistLovesLiberals said:but even you have to admit that the government is not stable enough to do everything on its own.
Arch Enemy said:On a more personal note, what is your military background? I've been thinking about the military myself, not because I may want to join, but becuase I'm interested in one of the hardest jobs, ever.
FiremanRyan said:its not much but i learned a lot. i was 8 months enlisted with the Air Force as a Flight Engineer and was supposed to ship out the next month. long story short, i was injured in a car accident and medically discharged. thats why im fighting fire today and not flying on a C-17.
off topic, but in my opinion, if you have the brains and the drive, the military can be one of the best jobs to have. this depends a lot on what you're doing though. what job were you looking at?
Arch Enemy said:Would you rather still be enlisted in the Air-Force? Do you still get the benefits?
Joe ohhnoo said:Your death and theirs is not in vain. Please go to this web site below, and at the left hand side click on Beheading word and see the real Islam in action.
http://www.nomullas.com/
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