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GOP 'Pledge' makes closing argument to voters

liblady said:
oh my god. if small business owners are too ****ing lazy to read a bill that they THINK affects them negatively, maybe their businesses will fail because they are both stupid and lazy.
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such condescension is crass

YouTube - John Conyers on Reading the Healthcare Bill

conyers---what good is reading the bill if its 1000 pages and you don't have 2 lawyers to find out what it means?

conyers, by the way, in 2006 admitted to illegally using staff members for campaign and personal business

he promised never to do it again

last year his wife, detroit city councilwoman, pleaded guilty to felonious taking of bribes

Conyers's wife pleads guilty - Alex Isenstadt and John Bresnahan - POLITICO.com

where's crew?
 
this republican pledge is a CAMPAIGN PIECE

the suggestion that it might be subject to CBO SCORING is absurd

as ECONIMICS it is a strong and certain indication of the DIRECTION the NEW house leadership will be heading

as such, it's a radical and restorative redirection

if you think that TODAY's electorate is NOT going to distinguish dramatically, direly, between the refreshing flavor of TEA philosophy and the socialistic SANCTIMONY of the washington-knows-best cabal, then you are as poor a JUDGE OF CHARACTER as the assemblage of aliens currently occupying the white house

ON THE STUMP how are progressives to rebut this pledge?

we CRAMMED obamacare? we passed the STIMULUS which we can no longer call by that name, today considered obscene?

we bankrolled beaucoup bailouts and bonuses to bloated bigwigs and their bogus bagmen---to the tune of billions?

we favor FURTHER underfunding of f & f?

elect us so we can DEEM cap and trade, massive tax hikes on ENERGY---both production and consumption---in the midst of our deep, dark DEPRESSION?

we'll ameliorate the mosque, move ksm to manhattan, prosecute the cia, BAN drilling in the gulf and SUE the PEOPLE of arizona?

i think you're GOT

checkmate

seeya at the polls!
 
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Where in the pledge does it say "We will not ship our jobs to China"? This doesn't look like a Pledge to America. It looks more like a Pledge to Pfizer, Goldman Sachs, and Chevron-Texaco.
 

I'm just going to throw out some graphs to find out what you (or anyone else) think about them.

Keep in mind the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act was passed in February of 2009.


Jobs Lost/Gained Per Month:


U.S. Unemployment Rate:






Two comments from me before I hope you respond in kind...

1. The unemployment rate was increasing dramatically as Obama came into office. I find it hard to believe it's possible to go from losing 700,000 jobs a month to losing none or even gaining jobs per month in a one, two or three month period without spending a lot of money. I have just as much reason as anyone else to be pissed off at the government, wall street, the banks and everyone else responsible for this mess -- I'm unemployed myself -- but it's hard for me to believe that what has been described as the worst recession since the Great Depression could be completely turned around in a one or two year period.

2. It appears to me that the stimulus program halted the severely increasing unemployment rate. There was a huge jump in unemployment in just one year, then the AR&R act was passed and soon after... the unemployment rate leveled out and the number of jobs lost per month dropped.

Thoughts?

Obviously more needs to be done to help speed up the recovery of the economy and of course the spending needs to be brought under control, but though the unemployment didn't remain at 8%-ish as we were told it would and though the recovery is still slow... from what appears to me to be an economy turning around right around the time that the stimulus package was passed and an improvement in the economy since, at this point I have to assume the stimulus helped.

I am of course always open for discussion on this. And please, let's keep this civil.


P.S. I'm not sure what you meant by "your", but Obama's your president too. Just like Bush was my president even though I didn't vote for him and hated his guts. Just saying...
:2wave:
 
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You eventually run out of jobs to lose. The unemployment rate it close to 10%.
It was less than that when we were losing more jobs per month.

When we start gaining jobs in the private sector each month, then I'd say things are looking up.
We need to lose jobs in the public sector to cut the deficit.
 
danarhea said:
Where in the pledge does it say "We will not ship our jobs to China"? This doesn't look like a Pledge to America. It looks more like a Pledge to Pfizer, Goldman Sachs, and Chevron-Texaco.
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Where in the pledge does it identify Pfizer, Goldman Sachs and Chevron-Texaco?
 

The bump and then falloff of jobs identifies the public sector jobs created by using tax money to create those jobs - ie. stimulus. You can't throw 800 billion dollars into the economy and not see it happen. But the falloff in your bar graph identifies it all... temporary jobs used for political gains and speeches... then the decline again. Talk to me when Obama has taken the 4 million jobs lost back to zero. Then we can have a meaningful discussion about job creation. Until then, he's still digging in the same hole he's been in since the start.
 

The 2010 elections are going to focus on the results of this Congress and Barack Obama. Haven't seen any Obama supporter even talking about the Obama results and that speaks volumes. Please name for me one economic prediction made by Obama or his Administration that has been accurate?

It has been stated that Obama inherited quite a mess from Bush yet no one actually reviews the numbers and simply states talking points. Since Obama took office 4 million more Americans are unemployed and every month this year unemployment has risen vs. last year thus the claim that jobs have been created for 8 months in a row means nothing since more jobs were lost than created and that is the bottom line.
 

Or, it was a tempory solution, as stumulus are, and that long term solutions take more time. We can discuss this honestly, or not. The choice is ours, but no president controls the economy. At best, he and congress can help lessen the pain, but the economy is separate and not under the control of government.
 

Yet Obama blames Bush, Obama supporters blame Bush and continue to blame Bush for the "inherited" Problems two years after Bush left office. The results of the Stimulus and the first two years of the Obama Administration will be the issues judged on Nov. 2, 2010. The most radical leftwing President in U.S. History has made things worse in his first two years of office and yet the Obama supporters continue to blame Bush. Congress and the President make economic policy that affects the country and it is the Obama economic policies that have led to the results we have today.

Still waiting for you to name for me one Obama economic policy that has made things better? The GOP Pledge is a step in the right direction.
 

Mostly that is a proper way to note your side's hypocracy. If Obama and the democrats have blame, then so do Bush and the republicans. And as far as the debt goes, you can't argue fighting two needless wars without any effrot to pay for them isn't part of that problem. Only a idiot would argue Bush didn't contribute heavily to the debt.
 

Absolutely and I have made that statement many times but you are too busy being partisan. Bush made a lot of mistakes as President but Bush is out of office and Obama has made things worse yet he continues to blame Bush. Bush spending HELPED create the debt but Obama has put Bush spending on steroids yet is ignored.

The President of the U.S. is Barack Obama and anyone that views his results as positive is out of touch with reality. The recession began in December 2007 almost a year after Democrats took control of Congress and implemented the 2008 budget and economic policies. Democrats have been in control of the legislative process since January 2007. Even with that Congress Bush never had a trillion dollar deficit.
 

I'm afraid not. You've excused bush in the apst. I have consistently said no president controls the economy. You argue tax cuts grow the economy with no evidence to support it. Not to mention Bush cut taxes and the economy went south anyway.

No, your hypocrracy is what we see here.

:lamo
 
Closing Argument = they've had 2 years to fix what we did in 8. Isn't it time we go back to doing things our way?
 

I understand, Boo, in the liberal world results don't really matter and are trumped by rhetoric. I posted GDP numbers as well as income tax revenue numbers. Your silence is deafening but your defense of the liberal agenda tells it all. Dependence is what you seem to want and liberals continue to deliver those kind of results.
 

As I and others keep pointing out, you misread your numbers and they don't say what you think they say.

This has nothing to do with liberals and conservatives. It's more about me and you. :neener
 
hazlnut said:
Closing Argument = they've had 2 years to fix what we did in 8. Isn't it time we go back to doing things our way?
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LOL, the numbers apparently don't matter to you nor do the facts, the recession began in December 2007 a year after Democrats won control of Congress. Prior to December the numbers look pretty darn good. Keep running from the Democrat record which shows the economy worse this year than in 2009. That to a Democrat is progress?
 
I really like Jon Stewart's perspective most of the time:

[video]http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/thu-september-23-2010/postcards-from-the-pledge[/video]
 

Maybe I'm being to simplistic or just wrong headed. Howevere, Bush was responsible for TARP right?
TARP was paid back wasn't it? Shouldn't that take the blame off Bush, since what he spent was re-paid, or am I looking at it all wrong?
 
Boo Radley said:
As I and others keep pointing out, you misread your numbers and they don't say what you think they say.

This has nothing to do with liberals and conservatives. It's more about me and you. :neener
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Liberal translation, "growing numbers don't really matter as perception means more"

GDP by Year in trillions

2000 9,951.50
2001 10,286.20
2002 10,642.30
2003 11,142.10
2004 11,867.80
2005 12,638.40
2006 13,398.90
2007 14,077.60
2008 14,441.40
2009 14,256.30
 

You can't cut taxes and increase spending at the same time. The Republicans blew it, they know it, and they have promised to change.
 
Barbbtx said:
You can't cut taxes and increase spending at the same time. The Republicans blew it, they know it, and they have promised to change.
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A promise they've made before. Why would you trust them now?

And sure, you can cut taxes and increase spending. Bush and republicans did just that. And you cut spending and raise taxes. No one has done that yet. And republicans won't likely. But regardless of which not likely group we elect, they won't do **** as long as we hold to party stupidity over consistent demand for action.
 

Because what we have in power now hasn't worked. The results of the last two years speak for themselves. still waiting for you to name the economic policies and predictions made by Obama that have been successful or accurate?
 

Economic principles are apparently over your head. The policies that lead to the recession were in place way before 2007.

'looked pretty darn good' ??? Are you ****ing serious. The entire country was living on credit!!! We were fighting two unfunded wars!

Funds were leveraged 30 to 1!!!???!!!:roll::roll:

Things looked pretty good on the titanic, even after they hit the iceberg, most people thought it was just a delay...
 
Conservative said:
Because what we have in power now hasn't worked. The results of the last two years speak for themselves. still waiting for you to name the economic policies and predictions made by Obama that have been successful or accurate?
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two years in? How long were you willing to give republcians, who clearly lied to you (remember that contract thingie?).
 
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