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While I understand the general sentiment you are espousing I really don't think the OWS protesers actually WANT more "Bad Police Conduct". I will admit that most OWSers probably understand how instances of this benefits their cause, but thats a far cry from wanting to get beat on the head, or tazed etc...There's been some video of OBVIOUSLY bad police conduct out of NYC; I think it was hoped there'd be more in other cities. Nothing along the lines of cracking heads, but tazing, clearly unwarranted arrests, etc. Though of late, that seems to have leveled off.
I'm not sure I agree with you here. To say politicians are using the OWSers is, in my opinion, putting the cart before the horse.... Think about it... The aim of any protest is to start a public dialog. If politicians actually start addressing these issues publicly the it would appear to me that the goal of starting dialog is met. Hell, the fact that we are debating it (to one extent or another) on these forums is proof in my opinion that it is in fact having an impact at some level. I will however agree that most of the public dialogues will most likely be kow-towing to the OWS merely up until election day at which point many of these politicians that may have enjoyed a boost from OWS will simply ignore them..... of course they also could actually get elected and start trying to address these issues just as easily.I know nothing about Boston's political climate, but both Cleveland and Cincinnati have Democratic mayors (the one on Cleveland is owned and operated by the Democratic party machine here in Cuyahoga County like a ventriloquist's puppet, I exaggerate not), and there seems to be some bizarre-o belief among these people that these OWSers and their bad bahevior will help get Obama re-elected. (I can't followthat reasoning AT ALL.)
So, many people are "using" the nitwits at these protests for their own political gain...and the young people apparently haven't got the wits to see that they're being used.
Lets be honest here, here is an overly generalized version of this particular thread:
I don't know what they stand for... But I disagree with them
They are unorganized.... yet this or that group is behind it all
Yeah sure they have a Constitutionally protected right to peacably assemble to petition the government for a redress of greivences...... but only if local park camping ordinances are obeyed and it doesn't offend me
I mean as a conservative you can't honestly be in favor of government subverting, and by threat of violence mind you, individual protections provided by the first amendment to the United States Constitution, are you? <--- hoping for an answer to this
While I understand the general sentiment you are espousing I really don't think the OWS protesers actually WANT more "Bad Police Conduct". I will admit that most OWSers probably understand how instances of this benefits their cause, but thats a far cry from wanting to get beat on the head, or tazed etc...
I'm not sure I agree with you here. To say politicians are using the OWSers is, in my opinion, putting the cart before the horse.... Think about it... The aim of any protest is to start a public dialog. If politicians actually start addressing these issues publicly the it would appear to me that the goal of starting dialog is met. Hell, the fact that we are debating it (to one extent or another) on these forums is proof in my opinion that it is in fact having an impact at some level. I will however agree that most of the public dialogues will most likely be kow-towing to the OWS merely up until election day at which point many of these politicians that may have enjoyed a boost from OWS will simply ignore them..... of course they also could actually get elected and start trying to address these issues just as easily.
I just seem to be of the opinion that some (not all, mind you) of those in opposition to the OWSer's protests are really just upset that it is (at least temporarily) drowning out the drum beats from the various TP groups, yet others may genuinely disagree with the message and yet others are simply saying it's not my group... I don't like them.
I fall close to the far end of the Conservative political spectrum. I'm an Authoritarian. My utopian societal concept includes large doses of the ideals set forth in Robert Heinlein's "Starship Troopers" universe and Harlon Ellison's "Repent Harlequin Said the Tick-Tock Man". I believe that the Founding Fathers were incredibly naive in many of the things they did.
Can you define "Authoritarian" for me as a political philosophy, Tigger? I never saw the term before I joined DP.
Mea Culpa.... I should have used the word inconvenience as opposed to offend. And I fully recognize your continued position of supporting constitutional rights and applaud you for it, I never intended to claim otherwise, as such I stand corrected.Uh, no. I approve of the ACLU...I'd support their right to assemble and protest no matter what their cause was. Of course, you don't know me IRL, so you'll have to accept that (or not) as article of faith.
Nonetheless, it's true. IMO, the proper constraint on their rights has nothing to do with the content of their speech. I never complained about any Tea Party event, and the last time I complained about a group's conduct in protesting, it was about the Wisconsin union workers filling the state capitol building far beyond its capacity....because it was a fire hazard.
Vice Mayor Roxanne Qualls told The Enquirer, “I believe in the constitutionally protected right of speech, right of assembly, and right to petition government to redress grievances. I do not believe that 'occupying' public space by camping out and violating regulation designed to manage use and ensure reasonable access is protected. I do not think the protesters should be allowed to stay overnight.”
The judge that issued the or was not usurping congress but rather usurping Cincinati's lawmakers in judging whether or not a violation of Constitutionally protected right was occurring. Said court quickly came to the desicion they were not and promptly lifted the order. I am not sure I understand what the problem here is.I can't begin to tell you how much I loathe our current judicial system. The judge in this case is a perfect example of the judicial system usurps congress. Legally speaking, he/she may not enforce or write policy. It's their job to interpret the constitution and make a ruling. They must not lean right or left when they come up with their decision.
The judge wasn't legislating from the bench he (maybe she I don't know) was hearing a case claiming that citizen's Constitutional rights were being infringed upon. After consideration said judge deem the citizen's arguments wanting and thus lifted the TROWith that being said, I applaud the Cincinnati police for writing these tickets. It's gonna be interesting to see what the cops do with this federal judges "order." My hope is that you'll ignore this unconstitutional order and call out the judge for attempting to legislate from the bench.
Your opinion is Duly noted. I also support the abolishment of the FED but that's a discussion for another thread. I am curious though.... which governing concepts do you perceive as failing miserably? Personally I tend to believe they are rallying against cetain governmental policies not for. People generally don't take to the streets and shout "Keep things the same.... Keep things the same"The OWS is a movement that can't be ignored. I pretty much despise all of their arguments. The only people that I sympathize with are the END THE FED folks. The other people who claim the We are the 99% consist of the utterly ignorant and cling onto governing concepts. All of which have failed miserably.
Authoritarianism is the political ideal that the Government needs to be in charge of almost everything. The idea that the general populace is not capable of making the right decision, and therefore needs to have large amounts of their society and culture dictated to them for their own good. In my specific view it's also a system based on a caste system, not unlike the one that existed in Medieval Europe. You have a class of Citizens who are allowed more freedom (though not as much as Americans currently enjoy) and non-citizens who enjoy even fewer freedoms.
Sounds like some kind of Communism crap to me..
Well I would argue that communism is more about the working class being more in control with regard the result of their production than being equal... but W/ESort of. Communism is an Authoritarian system as well. The difference is that Communism is about trying to make everyone EQUAL. The form of Authoritarianism I prefer is all about making sure those who do the right things advance in society and those who don't end up groveling in the streets to try and keep from starving to death.
Well being a Kentuckian that lives a mile from the "forbidden zone" I can tell you Cincinnati is a giant **** pile. I don't know exactly what there is to protest about Cincinnati other than it being one giant pile of suck. If a nuclear bomb went off that somehow only destroyed everything in the Cincinnati area America would be a better place. The only good things that come out of Cincinnati is Krogers and P&G the rest of Cincinnati can suck it.
Authoritarianism is the political ideal that the Government needs to be in charge of almost everything. The idea that the general populace is not capable of making the right decision, and therefore needs to have large amounts of their society and culture dictated to them for their own good. In my specific view it's also a system based on a caste system, not unlike the one that existed in Medieval Europe. You have a class of Citizens who are allowed more freedom (though not as much as Americans currently enjoy) and non-citizens who enjoy even fewer freedoms.
An excerpt of a post from Swit:
Are you saying that there aren't posts here that acknowledge OWSer's do in fact enjoy first amendment protections ("Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.") yet somehow local nuisance ordinances trump those protections?
Ugh, ugh, ugh. And this is what American believes as well? Well, takes all types.....
Their desire is to avoid paying their bills. They are dishonest and disreputable.Their desire to get rid of the debt makes them disgusting scum? Mmm...interesting.
Their desire is to avoid paying their bills. They are dishonest and disreputable.
HTH do you know what each of the OWSers wants when no one else can tell?
It should not occur for either. Have bankruptcy laws disappeared?And how is relief from debt "dishonest and disreputable" among Americans but not among the Big Banks, etc.?
This has nothing to do with redress. This is designed to take down capitalism.Sweeping generalizations may be fun, but they are rarely even remotely reality-based. I think the OWSers may well have some legitimate complaints. Lord knows, I sure as **** do. But their method of "petitioning the government for redress" is preposterous and ineffective.
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