Montecresto
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Giangreco's account is now accepted as definitive.
No Japanese nuclear attack on two cities in the US could have tipped the war in Japan's favor.
I suppose a right could exist although it was being suppressed. So who do you think determines what rights a nation legitimately has?
Sorry, but no it's not. Not by everyone. Americans who have accepted responsibility for the immoral act, have rejected his argument. Warmongers, hawks, apologists and those that will hate a neighbor, cheat a friend, and justify it in the end, sure, they're clinging to it like a life jacket.
However many civilian targets needed to be struck to accomplish their goal would have been justified, is the point. As a matter of fact, who ever uses one next, will be justifying it. Btw, I don't recall you commenting, or I missed it if you did, does Iran have a right to nuclear weapons?
Take the last first: yes.
No matter how many farfetched hypotheticals you concoct, you can't get away from the fact that in 1945, in the circumstances actually prevailing, use of the bombs saved lives.
Jack........did you see the in thread warning?? I'm well versed in your views on the use of nuclear weapons on Japan!
I saw no warning.
I'm thinking unfortunately that might makes right. For example, no nation could stop the US from acquiring them or compel the US to rid themselves of them.
Well might definitely determines what rights a nation can exercise as a practical matter. That said, honestly, I am not so sure who determines the LEGITIMATE rights in a practical sense. That is part of the problem. Therefore, as you have indicated, it ends up being a matter of might makes right.
Yes, that's it. And because men aren't angels, this will always be the case. And.............someone will always be the dominant and as a result will oppress others. The US happens to be the dominant one at present, and we all know the histories of predecessors. I don't know if all world powers March forward with their citizens brainwashed that they are the righteous ones, justifying all manner of atrocity and exploitation, or whether that's unique to America. But it's a bleak situation.
Indeed. Furthermore all of the major world powers brainwash their citizens in this way.
Probably so. And the predatory "us verses them" mentality is institutionalized from cradle to grave in everything from sports to religion. And, it works, really well.
It's pretty much the sentiments of most of the industrialized world; with the exceptions of Russia, China and North Korea_Who has made that divine decree*?
By "deeds"; I was referring to Iran's contributions to global terrorism, murder, and human rights violations_If by deeds,
You should read your history books before posting a ridiculous argument such as this one Monty!then the only power to have used nukes on civilian targets has forfeited its "rights"!
It's pretty much the sentiments of most of the industrialized world; with the exceptions of Russia, China and North Korea_
ie; Only those who view the United States as their adversary appear to believe that a nuclear capable Iran is not a threat_
(*god usually has a policy of nonintervention and to the best of my knowledge hasn't decreed anything pertaining to nukes)
By "deeds"; I was referring to Iran's contributions to global terrorism, murder, and human rights violations_
You should read your history books before posting a ridiculous argument such as this one Monty!
The Hiroshima/Nagasaki death toll was minuscule compared to the estimated U.S. casualties those 2 small nukes averted_
And after Japan's surrender and later its sovereignty restored by the U.S. it became an economic success in the world market_
The nuclear equipped nations of Western Civilization have more than demonstrated a lack of desire for world domination_
The only 20th/21st Century nations to have demonstrated such a desire have been Islamic and Socialist/Communist nations_
Yes, with few exceptions the right will seek to trivialize and justify targeting innocent civilians while condemning others and ever pushing for the next war.
Not so Monty; I didn't "trivialize" anything but I did "justify" saving American and Allied lives_Yes, with few exceptions the right will seek to trivialize and justify targeting innocent civilians while condemning others and ever pushing for the next war.
Post 296
It's only a pity publications like the Daily Worker and Soviet Life are no longer with us. They could have used your ability to cook up anti-American propaganda. With few exceptions the left will seek to spread falsehoods such as the one that people whose political views they differ with usually seek to justify war crimes like targeting civilians. You've made very clear you loathe the United States and do not wish it well--but then, that gives you something in common with your Red president.
Not so Monty; I didn't "trivialize" anything but I did "justify" saving American and Allied lives_
I simply stated the cold hard facts of reality pertaining to the struggle between good vs evil, involving millions of lives_
Or maybe you believe Adolf Hitler and Emperor Hirohito were the good guys and the bad ole Americans were the evil?!
Iran does not have the right to own nukes because powerful countries said so. How many kids get to dictate what adults can do? I can make many decisions legally that kids of no right to make. Iran through its own behavior took their own right away to possess nukes.
And what gives the rest of the world the right to make such decisions? Simply because we can.
I thought he was black. You have no respect for liberty if you seek to suppress dissent, just because it exposes ugly things. Things can be better, and that's very American.
You should know that no poster here has authority to suppress anything any other poster says, even if he were to want to. And as a true liberal, suppressing dissent--or civil debate of any kind--is the last thing I would want. I hope you will continue to make your low opinion of your country clear to everyone reading these forums. And I will continue to say what I think of that low opinion when you express it, as, for example, when you slander people whose political views you disagree with as advocates of war crimes like the intentional targeting of civilians.
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