• Please read the Announcement concerning missing posts from 10/8/25-10/15/25.
  • This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

did Ellen Greenberg kill herself ?

hecatmoggie

DP Veteran
Joined
Nov 1, 2022
Messages
29,265
Reaction score
8,457
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
ruled again suicide




On January 26, 2011, a blizzard hit Philadelphia, prompting Greenberg to leave work and return to her apartment.[5] At approximately 6:40 p.m., Greenberg was pronounced dead as a result of 20 stab wounds, including 10 to her back and neck.[6][7] There were also 11 bruises in various stages of resolution[8] on her right arm, abdomen, and right leg.[9]



According to the investigation report, Greenberg's body was discovered by her fiancé, Samuel Goldberg, who returned from a gym to find their apartment door secured with a swing latch, and knocked it down after unsuccessfully trying to reach her.[10] Goldberg subsequently called 911 stating that Greenberg "stabbed herself" and "fell on a knife".[11]

The crime scene was initially treated as a suicide by the police investigators,[5] but after the autopsy the Philadelphia Medical Examiner's Office ruled the case as a homicide.[12] The next day, the Philadelphia Police Department differed with that conclusion, saying, "the death of Ellen Greenberg has not been ruled a homicide [...] Homicide investigators are considering the manner of death as suspicious at this time."[12] The medical examiner's office then changed its conclusion, saying in February that the death was a suicide.[4]

The apartment was cleaned and sanitized on January 27, after permission to do so was given from the police. James Schwartzman, Samuel Goldberg's uncle and the Chairman of the Pennsylvania Judicial Conduct Board in Pennsylvania,[13] also entered the apartment that day to retrieve work and personal laptops, phones, and credit cards belonging to both Goldberg and Greenberg. Police returned to the scene on January 28 after gaining a search warrant, and also requested and retrieved the items taken by Schwartzman.[14][15]

In early 2018, the office of Pennsylvania Attorney General Josh Shapiro took over the case.[16] In 2019, a spokesperson for Shapiro stated that computer searches made on Ellen's computer pointed toward Greenberg's death being a suicide and that the investigation had been closed.[17][18] Legal representation for the Greenberg family disputed such evidence on the laptop, stating that it is undisputed that Samuel Goldberg's uncle James Schwartzman took possession of Ellen's iPhone and two computers, breaking the chain of custody.[19] The Philadelphia Police had also sent Ellen Greenberg's computers to the Philadelphia Regional Computer Forensics Laboratory (RCFL) for a forensic examination, with a police document later summarized the findings: "Keyword Searches were done on every computer searching for Suicide Information and the examination did not reveal anything remarkable."[20]

During the multi-year period in which the Pennsylvania Attorney General's Office had control over the case, the Greenberg family's legal team provided them with a significant volume (over 10 gigabytes) of new evidence, including detailed forensic files and medical findings; 3D stab wound analyses of each of the 20 strikes Ellen suffered; and lengthy depositions of three Philadelphia medical examiner officials, one of whom said Ellen was likely already dead when one of those stab wounds occurred.[21][22]

In July 2022, the internet community uncovered relationships between Josh Shapiro and the families of Samuel Goldberg and James Schwartzman, prompting the Attorney General's Office to send the case to the Chester County, Pennsylvania District Attorney's Office to avoid the "appearance of a conflict [of interest]."[23] The Chester County District Attorney announced the investigation was inactive, citing an independent forensic expert with an undergraduate degree in entomology (the study of insects) and without any medical training, which was widely criticized by Greenberg's legal team and the true crime community.[24]
 
One significant point of contention were the stab wounds that allegedly penetrated Greenberg's brain. Wayne K. Ross, an investigator hired by the family, wrote that the wounds to the brain and spinal cord would have caused severe pain, cranial nerve dysfunction, and traumatic brain injuries.The original medical report stated that an esteemed consulting neuropathologist, Lucy Balian Rorke-Adams, had determined there was no such wound. But when asked about the case seven years later by The Philadelphia Inquirer, Rorke-Adams responded, in writing, "I have no recollection of such a case", and "I would conclude that I did not see the specimen in question although there is a remote possibility that it was shown to me."
 
I don't feel like officials feel afraid nowadays to proudly stand up and say "Yep, I've been bought! Whaddya gonna do about it???"
 
Back
Top Bottom