Why/how is she qualified?
I continue to ask but I can't get an answer. What are her qualifications?
So who are the other half or more than half?
I read your links btw. And I found this in the same article:
So lets do some basic arithmetic here on this: If 27% needed the remediation in math - then 73% did not need it. And if 30% needed it in English - then 70% did not need it.
Ideas win in politics. Criticism has to forward alternatives. The current alternatives are not satisfactory to many Americans on education. Time for some new ideas. Want to win the next election? Ideas not people.
Of course she's for school choice and you are against it. No wonder to you she's unqualified.
So we have a public education system that graduates 1/3 of it's students who are incapable of doing the basic English and Math required in the next year of their education.
And you're trying to defend that result. An element of the problem with public education result revealed.
:thumbs:
In a recent quiz for her class of incoming Cal State Fullerton freshmen – who had all failed an algebra placement exam – Cherlyn Converse asked the students to solve a polynomial equation by factoring its properties.
The 35 students had 20 minutes to finish. Some turned in an answer within minutes, others nervously fiddled on papers until they arrived at a solution. For a few, time just ran out.
The Math Placement Test, about 90 minutes long, measures intermediate algebra and geometry skills through 50 multiple-choice questions. The test is graded on a scale of 0 to 80 with a passing score of 50. The tests have remained largely unchanged since 2008.
that was one hell of a debate concession
kudos to you for that
So we have a public education system that graduates 1/3 of it's students who are incapable of doing the basic English and Math required in the next year of their education.
And you're trying to defend that result. An element of the problem with public education result revealed.
:thumbs:
If you read the article you provided for me, it gives an example of the math the student could not do.
and then there is this
I would argue that the ability to do that is irrelevant to the vast majority of majors or minors one may pursue in college and that test is ridiculous on its face as being useless as any sort of real world measurement.
In the 2016 PISA international school comparison tables, published a few days ago, the US came out poorly - almost as bad as Sweden. Be worried Yanks.
Personally I think that as at least half of Americans believe in Creationist clap-trap US schools must be doing a very bad job.
Right. So says you. What you've stated is exactly what is wrong with public education today. Lower the bar. Move people on. Decide what students need or don't need, because, hey, you won't need it anyway.
How many people actually secure a job in the field of their major? Ever looked at those numbers? So why go to college at all?
Yes -so says me a person who spend their entire adult life in the education system and who knows that only a small minority of jobs require anything more than basic arithmetic. Yes- so says reality as well.
What does religious belief have to do with education outcome?
A lot. Anyone who leaves school ignorant of evolution - or thinking that a psychopath living in a primitive desert society 1200 years ago is the fount of all wisdom - is not educated in any sense of the word. He or she is indoctrinated, no more than that.
In the 2016 PISA international school comparison tables, published a few days ago, the US came out poorly - almost as bad as Sweden. Be worried Yanks.
Personally I think that as at least half of Americans believe in Creationist clap-trap US schools must be doing a very bad job.
A lot. Anyone who leaves school ignorant of evolution - or thinking that a psychopath living in a primitive desert society 1200 years ago is the fount of all wisdom - is not educated in any sense of the word. He or she is indoctrinated, no more than that.
I see, so the liberal/socialist progressive demand for free college is just BS. Thanks for confirming that.
Again, the shocking revelation of the current mindset of those who "spend their entire adult life in the education system" should be a warning to all.
Sadly, Devos is a champion for old failed ideas. And that makes her unqualified.
School choice is a new idea, you are championing the failing old ideas.
School choice has been around a long time going back over a hundred years. My parents exercises school choice in sending me to Catholic schools for 12 years in the Fifties and Sister. Alternatives to public schools are not new. However you have a tiny point of the new mantra of SCHOOL CHOICE in the guise that Devos - the subject of this thread - has pushed it and she has failed at it miserably making her unqualified to head the Department of Education.
It is interesting that the charter school people changed their mantra from promising better schools with better outcomes and better graduates to simply elevating choice as the Holy Grail of charter schools when the found out they could NOT deliver on their previous boasts.
But choice education has been around a very long time. And the so called CHOICE Devos has pushed has been a failure.
Blah, fail, blah, fail. She's advocating for a school that takes the students at high risk and attempts to educate them as well or better than public schools. But that's failure to you. Magnets and charter schools aren't perfect, but they offer competition. Competition tends to allow successes to grow and makes all sides work harder to stay ahead and get students. But that's failure to you.
YOU want public schools above all else. Of course it looks like failure to you, anything that challenges a liberal power base always does. Im advocating wait and see what happens. The current Dept of Education hasn't exactly been the epitome of cause no harm.
Numbers tell story
The CREDO studies, in 2013 and 2015, used scores on state tests to compare a select number of charter and public school students, in one-to-one analyses.
CREDO used the differences between the growth that charter and traditional public school students demonstrated on the tests, and then translated those differences into “days of learning.”
Larger test score growth equates, in the studies, to more days of learning.
In both studies, CREDO found that charter students in Michigan show gains in some areas. Statewide, charter students demonstrated about 40 more days of learning in a school year on both math and reading tests. In Detroit, charter students showed about 40 more days of learning in a school year in math, but in reading, they showed closer to 70 more days.
The differences may sound big. But even CREDO's researchers admit that conversion is "imprecise," and that in real terms, the gains are small.
More important, for the growth difference to matter, it would have to be shown to connect to greater outcome differences over longer periods of time. Growth is an important measure. But it doesn’t mean much if it can't translate to achievement in the end.
In a city like Detroit, for instance, where, on average, students perform well below statewide norms, kids in charter schools should more quickly close their gaps than kids in traditional public schools.
Hypothetically.
The problem is they really haven’t. Not for 20 years, dating to the beginning of Michigan’s charter experiment.
CREDO also found that, for instance, 63% of charters statewide perform no better than traditional public schools in math. And in Detroit, nearly half all charters do no better than traditional public schools in reading.
Overall, about 84% of charter students perform below state averages in math; the number is 80% for reading. That tracks closely with the outcomes for traditional public schools.
The gains for charter students are also clustered, in many instances, in high-performing outliers. But because Michigan does not require charter operators to have proven track records before they open schools or do much to hold them accountable after their schools open, the number of underperforming charter schools far outweighs the high achievers.
In addition, the CREDO results need to be considered in the context of other data about charter schools.
The Free Press investigation of charter schools, for instance, revealed that even taking poverty into account, charter schools essentially perform the same as traditional public schools, and in some cases, a little worse.
Facts are a really messy thing sometimes when they tend to clog up your reasoning. Minutes ago we got the Sunday Detroit Free Press delivered and in it was the following article on Devos and her advocacy for charter for profit schools
Stephen Henderson: Betsy DeVos' trouble with data
It is well worth reading and contains much data on the poor performance of the schools Devos advocated for. And it even takes some of the people who have been quoted to support there efforts - CREDO for one - and further interviews with their spokespersons reveal that their data does not seem to paint the rosy picture of charter schools that some Devos defenders seem to paint.
And Devos has been right there for decades pushing charters and this record of failure must exclude her from being confirmed.
She will be confirmed with ease.
If that is true- God help us because our governmental system has failed to do so.
But how do you feel about the facts that show Devos has pushed failed solutions for decades now in Michigan and that makes her unfit to lead the Education Department?
I quote Mark Twain about lies, damned lies and statistics. I think this debate has been so politicized that I don't trust anyone's "facts." What I trust is the proposition that competition creates choices, and choices improve performance.
Bachelors in Political Science and Business Administration.
Had donated/been active in several charter schools and is an advocate of several education policies.
I would say Trump is looking for a school choice advocate. He found one.
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