• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Becoming financially independent/stable?

B

BikesAreLife

Banned
Joined
Sep 26, 2021
Messages
243
Reaction score
109
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Conservative
What's your take on people success?

I think people are starting to realize that it isn't race but rather class and how well off you are that the bigger factors in whether someone becomes financially independent/stable. If you grew up poor, regardless of your race chances are you didn't grow up around someone who taught you to live within your means and invest. Too many poor people want desperately to hide that they're poor behind designer brands and luxury items that they perpetuate their own struggle. It's a vicious cycle.
 
1. Educate yourself. It's free K-12, and subsidized after that.
2. Hold off on having babies until you can support them.
3. Stay away from crime.

Any and all classes of people have these same opportunities.
 
BikesAreLife said:
I think people are starting to realize that it isn't race but rather class and how well off you are that the bigger factors
Click to expand...

Well duh.

BikesAreLife said:
Too many poor people want desperately to hide that they're poor behind designer brands and luxury items
Click to expand...

If a person has designer brands and luxury items...then they must not be very "poor".
 

So, do you think it's just coincidence that so many people of color "grew up poor" in this country?
 
Drowning Man said:
So, do you think it's just coincidence that so many people of color "grew up poor" in this country?
Click to expand...

No, its not coincidence.

This demographic has nearly 3 out of every 4 of its offspring with no father, and into poverty.

Theres no "coincidence" to it, those kids don't have a chance. At least not a very good chance.
 
Probably the best thing we could do is bring back home-ec courses like balancing a bank account and knowing the dangers of things like credit cards.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
That seems to assume that “the poor” make wise financial decisions.
Click to expand...

Well my reasoning is: if a poor person has the money to buy designer brands, for instance, then they aren't "poor".
And if they are using credit to do this, they wont have good credit for very long. So that wont continue for long.

I was a real fool with money when I was a younger kid, I do get your point but a "poor" person cant sustain a rich lifestyle for very long thats for sure.
 
tacomancer said:
Probably the best thing we could do is bring back home-ec courses like balancing a bank account and knowing the dangers of things like credit cards.
Click to expand...
The best thing we could do is stop passing kids along in grades when we know they don't grok the year before. There are entirely too many kids being passed up, when they need to relearn (or learn it the first time) basic things like 3rd grade math.
With that step comes the understanding that we will likely be taking kids from parents who don't give a shit about their child's education. Nanny state indeed.
I do agree with you, I just think it starts much much earlier than High School.
 
I have not seen any stats on how much of a problem this really is.
 
tacomancer said:
I have not seen any stats on how much of a problem this really is.
Click to expand...
With 5 kids going through, 2 having graduated, the youngest two in middle school (in a highly touted district), I shiver to think about even this district, much less poorer ones. I don't have stats either, but I do have some common sense, and see interviews, and read stories.
 
My kids are all doing well in school and I make sure that happens.

In terms of the other possibility, humans are emotional creatures and issues like this can easily hit the rumor mill and become overblown. That's why stats are important. There is no sense in trying to solve a problem until you know what the problem is and the scope of that problem.
 
Cope said:
1. Educate yourself. It's free K-12, and subsidized after that.
Click to expand...

What's the quality of the school if you grow up in a poor neighborhood vs a wealthy one?

Cope said:
2. Hold off on having babies until you can support them.
Click to expand...

And it's which side of the political isle that wants to promote abstinence only education, ban abortion and restrict access to birth control?

Cope said:
3. Stay away from crime.
Click to expand...

Where do police patrol? White fraternities or poor black neighborhoods?

Cope said:
Any and all classes of people have these same opportunities.
Click to expand...

Bullshit.
 
Yeah. That's it. I may make less than a Living Wage, but I got all this money lying around. I might as well as invest it. Good thing I read this OP. Now I know what to do.

Here's the black and white of it:

"According to a report by the Center for American Progress, the median wealth of White households was $189,100 in 2019 compared with $24,100 for Black households. The gap widened in 2020 as the pandemic hit minority communities harder than White ones, according to the report."


Must be because of their lack of role models. It's in the culture, not the race. It just happens to be that the preponderance are black people. Coincidence. It's not about race. Naw. That black people make less when having equal education, skill and experience as their white counterparts doesn't prove anything. I already explained why. Vote Republican.
 
Cope said:
Exactly, as do I.
What do we do about the other parent's? It directly ends up harming the child ...
Click to expand...
Lets figure out how big the problem is, but I would consider it a form of neglect.
 

Impoverished children in many many cases become impoverished adults, who then have more impoverished children that they cant afford to have.

Its a cycle.
 
What does any of this have to do with politics, stop being a hack.
Qualities of school vary, money gets sent from rich to poor as it stands now. Money is not the issue, parental involvement IS. Fix that.
Police patrol where the rate of crime is higher.
Abortion first. It should not be used as a means of birth control. I don't promote abstinence and am an advocate for birth control. When you decide you want to address the actual issues, let me know. Or you can continue ranting as if it were doing any good.

Bullshit indeed.
 
tacomancer said:
Lets figure out how big the problem is, but I would consider it a form of neglect.
Click to expand...
How big a problem incompetent parenting is?
It is probably NOT kept as a stat but I am sure it is likely well documented by other ways. You are unlikely to find it, say ,on a governmental website.

Parental Involvement in Schools - Child Trends

The percentage of students whose parents reported involvement in their schools rose significantly between 1999 and 2007 across several measures, including attendance at a general meeting, a meeting with a teacher, or a school event, and volunteering or serving on a committee. However, these...
www.childtrends.org

I found a few.
 
i agree and buying expensive designer clothes is the exact thig they should NOT be doing with their money. we desperately need classes that teach this.
 
Cope said:
How big a problem incompetent parenting is?
It is probably NOT kept as a stat but I am sure it is likely well documented by other ways. You are unlikely to find it, say ,on a governmental website.
Click to expand...
I would say step one would be defining that term in a way most of the population agrees with. Once its defined, then you can measure it.
 
my father was an enlisted man in the Navy....my mother a waitress

i was number three of five kids

i was first to graduate high school, graduate college, and now 40+ years later have a very nice nest egg for myself and my wife

our kids college was paid for....but we didnt give them anything else....they worked while they went to school

i will be the first ever in my family to be able to leave something for my family if the plan holds

now....am i smarter than everyone else? luckier? more driven? a combination of everything?

i dunno....i think i am blessed to have greater than average intelligence, and was truly blessed to have incredible mentors as i grew up

but i also know how lucky i am to be born in this country, to wonderful parents that made sure i had enough to eat, and paid attention in school, and kept my ass out of trouble
 
tacomancer said:
I would say step one would be defining that term in a way most of the population agrees with. Once its defined, then you can measure it.
Click to expand...
It ought to be measured by those with the most parental involvement since we do know that those with more involvement, the children perform better than those without. Why we even take the non-involved parents input ?
This is about the children.

Every parent likely wants their child to receive a good education. Some really care enough to prioritize it, others do not and merely speak about wanting it.
 
Cope said:
It ought to be measured by those with the most parental involvement since we do know that those with more involvement, the children perform better than those without. Why we even take the non-involved parents input ?
This is about the children.
Click to expand...
It would be a good idea for those with expertise to make measurement proposals, sure, but once there is legislation, its up to the voters in general. I would throw in people like social workers, child psychologists, etc as well though.
Cope said:
Every parent likely wants their child to receive a good education. Some really care enough to prioritize it, others do not and merely speak about wanting it.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately we have parents who don't deserve the title (at least from my point of view).
 
Point to where I said income inequality isn't an issue? Where did I say that racism doesn't play a part is the wealth gap? Black people that grow up well off (yes, they exist!) have substantially better outcomes than those who grow up poor and it's the same for most racial and ethnic groups and that's not exclusive to those who get trust funds. There is an education and support network there that poor kids regardless of race generally don't get.

I was responding to some argument ive heard in which he was talking about a friend of his who made good money but still found a way to struggle financially because he didn't have any sense of discipline or financial literacy. In that guy's case making enough money wasn't the problem; it was knowing how to use it responsibly/effectively which is what I was getting at. Maybe read an entire conversation before you come in guns blazing
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Menu
Log in
Register
Cookies are required to use this site. You must accept them to continue using the site. Learn more…