Are Trump's tariffs supposed to "make America rich again" or put stocks on sale for bottom feeding billionaires.

[Hamish Howl]

The stock market is down because at this point in time no one knows what the rules are. And no one will until we find out which countries negotiate, and what they negotiate. Once that happens, the stock market will stabilize.

I'm not necessarily a big fan of the tariffs, but doing nothing ensures that the US continues its decline, our manufacturing remains down, and we continue to transfer large amounts of wealth to other countries.

What was our unemployment rate again?

 

[The Mark]

Apply tariffs.

Rich ****s buy everything at fire sale prices.

Remove tariffs.

Rich ****s own damn near everything.

Rich ****s rent out the stuff they bought, extracting more.

 

[Phys251]

The stock market is down because at this point in time no one knows what the rules are. And no one will until we find out which countries negotiate, and what they negotiate. Once that happens, the stock market will stabilize.

I'm not necessarily a big fan of the tariffs, but doing nothing ensures that the US continues its decline, our manufacturing remains down, and we continue to transfer large amounts of wealth to other countries.

If Obama or Biden had done this, you would be singing a VERY different tune.

 

[forn]

If Obama or Biden had done this, you would be singing a VERY different tune.

My statement was very bipartisan.

 

[devildavid]

They already own everything. The vast majority of their wealth is in finance and the stock market. There's no reason we should suppose they would take massive losses to (in theory) scrape the bottom of the barrel from the middle, particularly when they do much better in an investment-friendly economy where they can poach assets the middle class actually does have, like real estate.

No. I think it's much more likely Trump either has terrible advisors OR he thinks this is some 4D chess move to shuffle debt around. Ignorance is the far more likely catalyst.

If they already own everything why are they still buying everything and selling it at a profit? That is how they continue to increase their wealth. They aren’t just sitting back and living on interest their wealth generates. They are actively pursuing more wealth, which means buying assets low and selling high. Now there will be a buyers market for stocks, and the rich will be the only ones able to buy in that market as the lower classes cost of living will lead them to sell off their few assets and have no extra money for their minuscule investments. There are a lot of assets that exist that have nothing at all to do with the middle class’s or the lower class’s meager assets or their ability to take advantage of market crashes.

Stock Market Meltdown? The Morbidly Rich Call It "Happy Hour"!

While working families struggle, Trump and his billionaire cronies are cashing in big time…

hartmannreport.com

 

[The Mark]

If they already own everything why are they still buying everything and selling it at a profit? That is how they continue to increase their wealth. They aren’t just sitting back and living on interest their wealth generates. They are actively pursuing more wealth, which means buying assets low and selling high. Now there will be a buyers market for stocks, and the rich will be the only ones able to buy in that market as the lower classes cost of living will lead them to sell off their few assets and have no extra money for their minuscule investments. There are a lot of assets that exist that have nothing at all to do with the middle class’s or the lower class’s meager assets or their ability to take advantage of market crashes.

Stock Market Meltdown? The Morbidly Rich Call It "Happy Hour"!

While working families struggle, Trump and his billionaire cronies are cashing in big time…

hartmannreport.com

More and more they will have to trade assets back and forth between them, because no one else will have much if any.

 

[Gimmesometruth]

we find out which countries negotiate, and what they negotiate. Once that happens, the stock market will stabilize.

The stated goal of this worldwide economic chaos is to re-shore US manufacturing without any objective level. You cannot switch off the tariffs until this unknown level is reached, you cannot remove the stick until the unstated level is reached. Your lot thinks this is short term, you are making this up, as is the admin. It will take LONGER to re-shore than it took to off-shore, there is no way to cause the costs of manufacturing to be below what other countries have in any short term. If you are looking to get back to 2000's levels, 20 years ago, it is not going to happen in a few months, it will take decades, and in the meantime you will have very high rates of inflation for years.

It is insane to say that that will be better than '23-24.

if global tensions should erupt, it would be good for our national security to have manufacturing capability

That is a much lower bar than re-shoring all of previously lost US manufacturing, and since we have a larger population than at that peak, we would of course need to surpass that past peak.
The other presumption is that we are going to have a conventional war as large as WWII, which is so last century. There are not threats to our land territory, China is not going to attempt to capture the US, Russia is even less of threat. If China needs "living space", its neighbor Russia has lots of empty space right next door. Further, the idea of global domination is a dead end in a nuclear world, which is where we are at.

make the disruptions more temporary.

Again, you keep fooling yourself into saying this over and over while forgetting how long it took to get here, how long the tariffs need to remain to get back to some undefined "golden age". Again, the argument that going down this road is better than where we were in the last 2 years of the Biden admin is absolutely nuts.

 

[AZRWinger]

They extract the wealth by exploitation of cheap labor.

It is the greed of the 1% that motivated them to become the 1% and it doesn’t ever magically disappear at any level of wealth. You still contradict yourself.

There are not trillions of investments pouring into the US. There is no evidence to support this false claim.

Thank you for the use of paragraphs.

If millions choose to buy a smart phone why is that greed? If the inventor and investors taking a risk to provide the product make a profit why is that greed?

No evidence of investments pouring into the US?

List of companies pledging to invest billions in US since Donald Trump win

Trump has brought in some big investments in his two months in office, most recently Johnson & Johnson.

www.newsweek.com

 

[devildavid]

Thank you for the use of paragraphs.

If millions choose to buy a smart phone why is that greed? If the inventor and investors taking a risk to provide the product make a profit why is that greed?

No evidence of investments pouring into the US?

List of companies pledging to invest billions in US since Donald Trump win

Trump has brought in some big investments in his two months in office, most recently Johnson & Johnson.

www.newsweek.com

Billions are not trillions. Your link doesn’t say trillions. You and Trump both use hyperbole.

Billions were invested during the Biden administration and due to legislation passed by the Biden administration. Your link states these facts. There is no investment increasing unique to anything that Trump has done, as he hasn’t done anything so far except to discourage businesses with his tariff mess.

 

[ConWolf]

The tariff induced market crash gives billionaires & insiders a way to steal stocks from panicked sellers.

Will the tariffs hold or are they a transient market manipulation that will go away as soon as the fat cats & insiders have pigged out on the carcasses of the small investors.

Don't sell.

 

[AZRWinger]

Billions are not trillions. Your link doesn’t say trillions. You and Trump both use hyperbole.

Billions were invested during the Biden administration and due to legislation passed by the Biden administration. Your link states these facts. There is no investment increasing unique to anything that Trump has done, as he hasn’t done anything so far except to discourage businesses with his tariff mess.

From the linked article

"After a meeting with Trump, the United Arab Emirates committed to a 10-year, $1.4 trillion agreement with the U.S. that will sustain existing investments in AI infrastructure, semiconductors, energy, and American manufacturing, according to Reuters."

Emphasis added.

The UAE is not the only investor listed. Try reading the article before commenting.


Your claim was there was no evidence of investment capital pouring into the US. When presented with evidence debunking your claim you falsely claim it wasn't trillions then offer a strawman that no unique investments were made under Trump.

Are trillions in foreign investment pouring into the US under Trump?

 

[Bucky]

Burn it down.

The economy is fundamentally broken.

It needs to be purified in a way that requires purification.

Remove the blood. Purify the economy. We need this!!

 

[Felis Leo]

OK, let's say you're one of the people shitting yourself over Musk and you CHOOSE to give your Tesla to a charity for a $500 charitable tax deduction. Did the charity steal your car? No, they didn't because that action was your choice. It isn't theft if you, of your own free will, choose to do something stupid.

Sure, if you view the motivations beyond any given transaction as utterly irrelevant beyond the voluntariness, then the motivation is, by definition, irrelevant. A desperately poor old couple selling their family heirlooms so they can afford to eat for another day? Irrelevant. They sold these items for what people were willing to offer. A desperately poor woman in a third world country prostituting herself? Irrelevant, unless she was held down and raped.

Besides, if you're convinced that the market is going to crash and we're all going to be eating dirt because nobody has any money then aren't YOU the one that's screwing the buyers over because you were the smart one and got out before everything totally crashed? I mean, if you KNOW that the stock market is going back down to 500 and you sold when it was at 38,000 then aren't you the one that screwed whoever bought your soon to be worthless stock?

Beyond having a bad feeling based on publicly available information? No. But if I somehow had concrete knowledge that the stock market was going to crash and stay in ruin for the foreseeable future Japanese stock market in circa 1990-style? Unless I disclosed my knowledge to whoever was buying my stock and the buyer dismissed my worries as the ramblings of a paranoid madman, yes. Unless I played my part as a Cassandra, I screwed over whoever bought my stock.

 

[upsideguy]

The tariff induced market crash gives billionaires & insiders a way to steal stocks from panicked sellers.

Will the tariffs hold or are they a transient market manipulation that will go away as soon as the fat cats & insiders have pigged out on the carcasses of the small investors.

None of the above..... this is just a Trump penis extension. We all have to suffer because the man has very low self-esteem.

He should just do what most red-blooded Americans do in this circumstance, get himself a gun *. Oh wait, that isn't an option as he is a felon.

* - I know that is a myth, I am just having fun with the stereotype...

 

[Delaier]

Here's a simple example of why bringing in factories using Tariff means increasing prices and inflation: Nike Air Force sneakers cost $42.99 in China, where they're manufactured for a manufacturing cost of $28.26 (prices from six months ago). They sell for $42.99 in China and $119 in stores in the US, minus marketing ($8), $13 in distribution costs, wholesale, commercial errors, and $7 in shipping and insurance. With the tariff, they lose their margin in the US, and the price increases to $159, so let's assume they move to manufacturing in Nashville.

In La Rioja, Spain, Puma runners are manufactured for €38, with a salary of €1,220. Imagine in the US, where salaries are 2.5 times that amount. With luck, Nike Air Force sneakers will cost $48 to manufacture. You save $6 on insurance and shipping, and let's assume they'll manufacture better and there will be fewer rejects, so you save $4 of the $13 in wholesale costs. To maintain the same margin, the Air Force Ones would have to sell for $145, which represents a 21% inflation rate.

 

[Econ4every1]

The stock market is down because at this point in time no one knows what the rules are. And no one will until we find out which countries negotiate, and what they negotiate. Once that happens, the stock market will stabilize.

I'm not necessarily a big fan of the tariffs, but doing nothing ensures that the US continues its decline, our manufacturing remains down, and we continue to transfer large amounts of wealth to other countries.

Is this wealth?



Or is this wealth?