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Are there any draftees left?

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fortune

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I hope you did not all die over there like three kids on my block.
 
It’s been 48 years since the Draft ended. I guarantee there are no more drafted soldiers in the US military and that been the case for at least a decade.
 
fortune said:
I hope you did not all die over there like three kids on my block.
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My father turned 18 right after the draft ended, he barely dodged the draft era. Most draftees are dead or getting close now, my grandfather died, granted he did not get drafted for korea but that was a my great grandfather forcing him to join the army or move out and lose everything for mouthing off. I have one customer who was a vietnam draftee, he is always talking about how little he has left to live and might as well make the most of it.

I have one former coworker who was not a draftee either, he served in vietnam in the air force, but he was peurto rican and knew they drafted black people brown people and southern white trailer trash before all else, and he decided since he knew his number would likely be called up he was atleast going to have a choice in it and enlisted for the air force. He mostly did guard duty on a safe post, in which he claimed he was more scared of tigers than anything as they saw more of them than the enemy where he was stationed. Sad too because tigers are now virtually exctinct in vietnam, but they were still around during the war, I wonder if the war helped them to extinction with the agent orange and bombing runs.

But to be truthful you will find very few draftees left, as the absolute youngest at the end are at retirement age, and most are in their 70's-80's at this point just for vietnam, not including korea and ww2.
 
My dad was drafted to serve in the Korean War for two years. While he would never have volunteered for military service and he never wanted to leave home he said that looking back he enjoyed it immensely. He got to travel to places he never would've otherwise (California Hawaii Japan and of course Korea) he got to meet people from all across the United States and the world and make many lifelong friends, He said it almost made killing hundreds of Chinese worth it.
 
I beat the draft by joining at 18 since the draft did not affect you until your 19th birthday.
Reading this OP makes me feel old and advancing on my expiration day.
 
Crosscheck said:
I beat the draft by joining at 18 since the draft did not affect you until your 19th birthday.
Reading this OP makes me feel old and advancing on my expiration day.
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I was a freshman Georgia Tech in 1961. I think I had a draft card but I do not recall. I think they sent me a questionnaire once a year. They never called me becasue was either too old or in college but within three years I was married so I think it all made me something undesirable so I never served. But you know I never saw one negro (what we said then) in any class I took and later on I read one of Collin Powell's books about Vietnam and the unfairness of the draft which made me run out and buy the CCR album and listen to lyrics more closely...

 
fortune said:
I hope you did not all die over there like three kids on my block.
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Drafted '69 Army - battling service connected (RVN) health issues to date. Good to meet you, sir.
 
ouch said:
Drafted '69 Army - battling service connected (RVN) health issues to date. Good to meet you, sir.
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I am never to be referred to as "sir". Belive it or not I served the United States of America from a drafting board, not the draft board.
We rooted for you while at Dodger Stadium watching Sandy Koufax.... I am ashamed sometimes. It is hard to be proud and ashamed at the same time...trust me.
 
When I was in from 1966-70 and it was still the conscript Army the lifer NCOs had generally high praise of the draftees. This was in the Infantry although I never got assigned to VN nor did I volunteer for it.

The Army Infantry career NCOs volunteered their generally positive views of the draftee from the time I arrived to Ft. Myer next to the Pentagon as a newly ROTC commissioned 2LT. Conscripts btw had the prefix US at the front of their serial number while volunteers had RA at the front of the serial number, meaning Regular Army. US meant United States of course.

The very pro conscript career nco praised the draftee as generally older than the RA, more mature, better able to take care of himself and to take on responsibility, relatively conscientious and more accepting of his situation and circumstance than the RA who'd volunteered. Their beef against the RA was that the volunteer had joined up to save the world, to be an American soldier abroad such as in Germany, expected to train in the field or to engage an enemy and to be a lean mean fighting machine.

So it was the RA volunteer who became bummed out cleaning the latrine, doing kp, having to buy a government bond each payday, mopping and buffering floors, pacing guard duty at the motor pool at night, getting hollered at and having to wash windows for a messy wall locker and so on and so on and so on.

Not every career nco was vocal about praising conscripts but there were always career nco who'd praise the draftee to you without the subject already being on the table so to speak. So out of curiosity I asked some of the career nco who never said anything about any perceived differences between the US soldier and the RA one, and most of 'em had the same view as the ones who spoke up without having been asked. It was generally positive.

Still and all the same, many career nco did naturally like the RA cause he was the troop who would be there up to two years longer than the US troop who was drafted for two years only (and on arrival had already spent up to 6 months in Basic and AIT); the RA had a better sense of unit pride and commitment, a stronger sense of patriotism; often had some kind of meaningful family history in the military such as Ranger, Airborne and the like; he also drew on the career nco as a model -- and the RA was way much more likely to reup.

Yes some conscripts did reup but they were few and the exception for sure.
 
Might be an interesting little anecdote if it wasn't made up bs.
Doesn't matter how much you try and pretend you are not fooling anyone who has read most of your posts in the military forum and has actual experience in the military.
 
braindrain said:
Might be an interesting little anecdote if it wasn't made up bs.
Doesn't matter how much you try and pretend you are not fooling anyone who has read most of your posts in the military forum and has actual experience in the military.
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De Nile isn't only a river in Egypt.

Plus you row from the right side only.

Which means you go around in circles.

Forever.


Indeed and as I've noted for a long time, the Right lost sole and exclusive ownership of the Military Forum years ago. And that I'm loving it. Cause Whitewing Lifer NCO are a dime a dozen. Always have been.

Q. What is the AVF in Afghanistan?
A. Republicans in Trucks.



"The Loo-tenant is on her way sarge."


Pentagon official policy btw is to root out extremism in the ranks.
 
Lots of tangmobable and whinning. How typical of tangmo when his pretend service gets called out.

So what about the 10000 non combat deaths in vietnam. Oh wait you have some pictures of vehicles stuck in the mud. That for sure proves the current military is much worse then the draft military.

How pathetic.
 
You gotta get thingys straight about the conscript Army force I served honorably in, 1966-70 and what I did in my post #10 above.

First, there is what I did not do in my post #10 or in any other post about the conscript Army, ie, say it was better than the ARF / AVF you claim to be a member of (yet are indifferent/silent about).

You've noted the Army that included a great number of conscripts lost the war in VN yet the conscript Army won the Civil War, it won WW I and it won the Big One WW II. The conscript Army did very well in Korea in 1950 then got stalled by Christmas when Washington stood it down so it would not engage China after the Chicoms entered the war to save NK.

What I did do in my post #10 was discuss my personal and professional interaction -- as an officer in an infantry regiment in the Military District of Washington DC -- with career NCO who expressed their assessment of the conscript infantry soldier in comparison and contrast to the volunteer infantry soldier. This is what I did in my referenced post -- nothing more and nothing less.

My conclusion at the time and that I continue to carry forward to the present is that the great majority of career Infantry NCO were quite positive toward the conscript infantry soldier -- his relative maturity in particular -- and that the career infantry NCO welcomed the conscript troop, relatively brief as his presence was in the unit.

And that despite all the bitching by the volunteer soldiers about night guard duty, kp, having to wash windows and other punishments etc, the career infantry nco felt a stronger bond with the volunteer troop because he was more patriotic than the conscript, more likely to have some significant family military history such as a father, uncle or brother who was a Ranger or Airborne etc, and that the volunteer troop was the guy who was way much more likely to reup than the conscript was -- although a few draftees did reup.

It was the VN war that changed the nature of many conscripts in country to the point that good order and discipline dissolved and affected the effectiveness and mission capability of the Army in country. The chain of command became barely coherent and at the company and platoon level it became dysfunctional in many instances throughout the force in country.

So the draft that had served the nation's population so well in the four instances I've cited became destructive in VN and had to be terminated. Hence we got the all recruited force that we know as the all volunteer force that has yet to win anything worth any kind of mention. Somalia was a mini VN, Grenada was much tougher on the AVF than expected and nobody has any idea of the success of Panama or has any reason to care. Indeed, while AVF did well in Desert Storm and superbly in the March 2003 invasion of Iraq into Baghdad, those were ephemeral achievements and temporary accomplishments that have long since faded with the passing of but a short time.

If you are in fact in the ARF / AVF then you'd be just another nobody who accomplishes little or nothing -- and then does his retirement to include mouthing off Republican Right Wing Garbage online. Just another of the run of the mill Republicans in Trucks. So my photos are about more than accidents -- they're about fumbling and bumbling disasters many of which are preventable.
 
swing_voter said:
Nobody in the military misses the draft, sergeants, officers, nobody.
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The draft is a very good thing, but I believe how we have it now is the best, the draft is there but not used, but left in place incase it is needed. If a volunteer military meets all the needs and then some there is no need to conscript anyone, but should something like ww3 happen the system is in place.

The draft system worked very well in ww2 when patriotism kept even those who wanted nothing to do with the military motivated to defend their nation, in vietnam which had nothing to do with american defense it shown pretty well how terrible draftees could be, many had no desire to fight and only did the bare minimum to scrape by their required time, as they saw the war as a political war not a patriotic war. If it comes down to any war I would prefer those who volunteer over those forced in, as those who volunteer are more motivated and dedicated to military structure, while a draftee only is motivated and dedicated when a patriotic cause is presented in front of them, which has not happened in many of the wars we have fought.
 
beerftw said:
My father turned 18 right after the draft ended
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I was number 171.

They called up to number 170 that year.

If I had to serve I would have. I did not run to the National Guard with the Help of my dad, claim I had bone spurs or get deferments for 4 years under the guise that I would join the ROTC only to renege later. Of course, had I done any of these things I could have become President.
 
My father retired from the navy, but he managed to squeak by the draft because it ended before the draft could get him. He later enlisted in the navy and served on the uss inchon.

Actually on the draft dodging, I find it funny trump is constantly mentioned, but no one mentions bill clinton dodging the draft, actually I am pretty sure most of the connected and most of our politicians of draft age then dodged it, it is easier to mention politicians who served in vietnam that it is to list those who did not, many of whom used college as an excuse or used their parents connections to either get a medical excuse or end up in the national guard so they would not deploy.
 

LOL, read my post again. I mention Bill, Trump and Bush.
 
swing_voter said:
Nobody in the military misses the draft, sergeants, officers, nobody.
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AVF needs the longer term personnel stability and continuity conscription cannot provide.

Conscription historically is two years and it would be neigh impossible to extend that in a contemporary draft -- by even one more year. The draft eligible civilian population doesn't want it anyway and would actively oppose it, as we know.

In contrast AVF can get up to 10 years out of its most dunderhead volunteer who after even 10 years can't get past the E-5 retention marker and gets shown to the gate. The 10 years is a bonus bargain to an Army that always needs replacements of casualties -- to include the Marine Corps -- a Navy that needs expertise out there on the vast sea and the AF that needs flight crews and seems always to be looking at pilot shortages (Naval aviation too).

Officers are few who don't already know when they're going to be passed over a second time for promotion and they're few in number to begin with. Indeed officers of AVF are much more focused on their troops and mission than officers were of the conscript force. This is because of the unitary nature of the volunteer force in contrast to the multi dimensional conscript force that drew its personnel from across the general population demographics and geographic regions, albeit of males only. Plus officers and NCO of the conscript force offered but a small career investment of their own to the draftee whose fixed term was two measly years (18 months after the conscript arrived upon completion of all training).

A huge headache of the AVF that rarely existed in the conscript force is sexual harassment given women are needed toward realizing the numbers the all volunteer force needs. Even top armed forces brass who cringe privately at transgender force members or who might find it distasteful accept it because all services need the personnel, ie, even a hundred more members of your AVF service for the next 10-20 years is a big boost and you'll take it with cheer. Well worth the investment.
 
fortune said:
I hope you did not all die over there like three kids on my block.
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There's a few here in Canada and by now they probably intend to die here.
 
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