12er Shia short tutorial

[stevecanuck]

Twelver Shia Islam, also known as Imamiyyah or Ithna Ashariyya (Arabic for 12er), is the largest branch of Shia Islam. Their split from those who became known as Sunni Muslims stems from a disagreement over how Mohamed's successors should be chosen, and is exacerbated by their take on post-Qur'an events. Here is a concise summary of its core beliefs:

Core Doctrines (Usul al-Din – Principles of Faith):

• Tawhid – Absolute monotheism: God is one and incomparable.
• Adalah – Divine justice: God is just and never acts unjustly.
• Nubuwwah – Prophethood: Muhammad is the final prophet.
• Imamah – Leadership: God appoints Imams as spiritual and temporal leaders (not in the Qur'an, unlike the other four).
• Ma’ad – Resurrection: All humans will be resurrected and judged.

Belief in the Twelve Imams:

• Twelvers believe that after the Prophet Muhammad, leadership of the Muslim community was divinely designated to a line of twelve infallible Imams, starting with Ali ibn Abi Talib and ending with Muhammad al-Mahdi, who is currently in occultation and will return as the Mahdi to bring justice.

[...snip...]

 

[ASHES]

That's an awful lot of text. Must have taken a long time to write it. What are your sources for it? Surely you didn't just recall all that from memory.

 

[stevecanuck]

That's an awful lot of text. Must have taken a long time to write it. What are your sources for it? Surely you didn't just recall all that from memory.

Apologies for not stating that in the OP. You're right. I asked chapGPT for that list, and it complies with everything I already knew. It's a great time-saver as long as you proof read it.

 

[ASHES]

Apologies for not stating that in the OP. You're right. I asked chapGPT for that list, and it complies with everything I already knew. It's a great time-saver as long as you proof read it.

And cite it, as required by the relatively new 9a rule. Thank you for acknowledging the mistake and fixing it.

 

[weaver2]

Twelver Shia Islam, also known as Imamiyyah or Ithna Ashariyya (Arabic for 12er), is the largest branch of Shia Islam. Their split from those who became known as Sunni Muslims stems from a disagreement over how Mohamed's successors should be chosen, and is exacerbated by their take on post-Qur'an events.

Every religion eventually splits. Christianity has split many times into Protestantism, Greek Orthodox, Russian Orthodox and the Egyptian Copts. There are two distinct branches of Buddhism.

Core Doctrines (Usul al-Din – Principles of Faith):

This is almost identical to Old Testament description of religion with bits from the New Testament thrown in for good measure

Belief in the Twelve Imams:

or 12 Disciples?

Role of the Imams:

is the same as the role of Jewish and Christian priests

Distinct Practices and Beliefs:

Not much different from the Old and New Testaments

Jurisprudence (Fiqh):

Actually a more universal and usable take on law than Leviticus

Occultation of the 12th Imam:

How is this different from the Christian resurrection of Jesus?

Signs Preceding the Mahdi’s Return:
The Mahdi’s Global Uprising:
The Great Battle:
The Role of the Ahl al-Bayt (family of the Prophet):
Resurrection and Final Judgment:

Revelation anyone?


I am hoping your purpose for posting this is so we can all see how similar Islam is to Christianity and Judaism, realize that our oil politics are the basis of our wars with Muslim countries not their religion.

 

[stevecanuck]

Every religion eventually splits. Christianity has split many times into Protestantism, Greek Orthodox, Russian Orthodox and the Egyptian Copts. There are two distinct branches of Buddhism.

This is almost identical to Old Testament description of religion with bits from the New Testament thrown in for good measure

or 12 Disciples?

is the same as the role of Jewish and Christian priests

Not much different from the Old and New Testaments

Actually a more universal and usable take on law than Leviticus

How is this different from the Christian resurrection of Jesus?

Revelation anyone?

Off topic times eight.

I am hoping your purpose for posting this is so we can all see how similar Islam is to Christianity and Judaism,

I posted this for anyone who might wonder what Shia 12ers believe.

realize that our oil politics are the basis of our wars with Muslim countries not their religion.

Start a thread.

 

[weaver2]

I posted this for anyone who might wonder what Shia 12ers believe.

Why would someone need instruction about what Shia 12ers believe as opposed to someone who wonders or cares what Copts are? or Animists or Confucianists are?Would you be instructing them also.

 

[medi]

Post in thread '12er Shia short tutorial'

Jun 22, 2025

I posted this for anyone who might wonder what Shia 12ers believe.

Why would someone need instruction about what Shia 12ers believe as opposed to someone who wonders or cares what Copts are? or Animists or Confucianists are?Would you be instructing them also.

• weaver2

• 

Understanding the basics of any given religion or maybe sub-religion (think that is actually called a 'sect' yes) - - - it can't do harm to be made aware of what a large group of folks might have strong faith in, such as a religion.

As an aside, I sure wish somebody could post something just like that which could explain the beliefs of the present-day Democratic Party of the United States.

That in the OP is very concise and easy to grasp. Quite good, even if done by some software. Well, I'm not sure about that "chapGPT" - - - somebody had to input something for that to show up, no?

Oh well, it is pretty neat.

Might not be so bad if all other religion type groups, or whatever the proper designation is, had a thread started just like this one. That's what this sub-forum is for, yes?

 

[weaver2]

As an aside, I sure wish somebody could post something just like that which could explain the beliefs of the present-day Democratic Party of the United States.

'24Democratic Party Platform
Table of Contents
Chapter One: Growing Our Economy from the Bottom Up & Middle Out 8
Economic Progress 8 Investing In America 9 Good Jobs 10 Small Businesses 12 Agriculture 13 Fighting Poverty 14 Ending Special Interest Giveaways 15
Chapter Two: Rewarding Work, Not Wealth 16
Cutting Taxes For Working Families 17
Making The Wealthy & Big Corporations Pay Their Fair Share 17
Chapter Three: Lowering Costs 19
Health Care & Prescription Drugs 19 Child Care, Home Care, & Paid Leave 22 Gas & Groceries 24 Corporate Greed 24 Housing 25 Education 28 Social Security, Pensions, & Medicare 30
Chapter Four: Tackling the Climate Crisis, Lowering Energy Costs, & Securing Energy Independence 32
Producing Cleaner, More Affordable Energy 33 Lowering Energy Costs 33 Creating Clean Energy Jobs 34 Reducing Pollution & Making Polluters Pay 35 Environmental Justice 36 Building Climate Resilient Communities 38 Conservation 38 Global Climate Leadership 39
Chapter Five: Protecting Communities & Tackling the Scourge of Gun Violence 41
Gun Safety 41 Policing & Public Safety 42 Criminal Justice 43 Violence Against Women 45
Chapter Six: Strengthening Democracy, Protecting Freedoms, & Advancing Equity 47
Judges Voting Right 48 49
Stopping The Influence Of Special Interests 50 Reproductive Freedom 50 Women’s Rights 52 Racial Equity 54 Lgbtqi+ 58 Disability 60 Tribal Nations 61 Combating Hate & Protecting Freedom Of Religion 62 Freedom Of The Press 64 Arts & Humanities 64 D.C., Puerto Rico, Territories 65
Chapter Seven: Securing our Border & Fixing the Broken Immigration System 67
Securing The Border 68
Expanding Legal Immigration & Deterring Illegal Immigration 70
Chapter Eight: Advancing the President’s Unity Agenda 73
Beating The Opioid Epidemic 73 Investing In Mental Health 74
Protecting Kids Online, Strengthening Americans’ Data Privacy, & Promoting Competition 74
Ending Cancer As We Know It 76
Meeting Our Nation’s Sacred Obligation To Veterans And Military Families 77
Chapter Nine: Strengthening American Leadership Worldwide 79
Europe 79 Indo-Pacific 81 China 82 The Middle East & North Africa 84 Western Hemisphere 87 Africa 88 Strengthening The U.S. And Global Economy 89 Leading With Diplomacy And American Values 90
Strongest Military In The World 92

Here you go. It's called the party platform. Republicans have one too.

 

[Revelation]

'24Democratic Party Platform
Table of Contents
Chapter One: Growing Our Economy from the Bottom Up & Middle Out 8
Economic Progress 8 Investing In America 9 Good Jobs 10 Small Businesses 12 Agriculture 13 Fighting Poverty 14 Ending Special Interest Giveaways 15
Chapter Two: Rewarding Work, Not Wealth 16
Cutting Taxes For Working Families 17
Making The Wealthy & Big Corporations Pay Their Fair Share 17
Chapter Three: Lowering Costs 19
Health Care & Prescription Drugs 19 Child Care, Home Care, & Paid Leave 22 Gas & Groceries 24 Corporate Greed 24 Housing 25 Education 28 Social Security, Pensions, & Medicare 30
Chapter Four: Tackling the Climate Crisis, Lowering Energy Costs, & Securing Energy Independence 32
Producing Cleaner, More Affordable Energy 33 Lowering Energy Costs 33 Creating Clean Energy Jobs 34 Reducing Pollution & Making Polluters Pay 35 Environmental Justice 36 Building Climate Resilient Communities 38 Conservation 38 Global Climate Leadership 39
Chapter Five: Protecting Communities & Tackling the Scourge of Gun Violence 41
Gun Safety 41 Policing & Public Safety 42 Criminal Justice 43 Violence Against Women 45
Chapter Six: Strengthening Democracy, Protecting Freedoms, & Advancing Equity 47
Judges Voting Right 48 49
Stopping The Influence Of Special Interests 50 Reproductive Freedom 50 Women’s Rights 52 Racial Equity 54 Lgbtqi+ 58 Disability 60 Tribal Nations 61 Combating Hate & Protecting Freedom Of Religion 62 Freedom Of The Press 64 Arts & Humanities 64 D.C., Puerto Rico, Territories 65
Chapter Seven: Securing our Border & Fixing the Broken Immigration System 67
Securing The Border 68
Expanding Legal Immigration & Deterring Illegal Immigration 70
Chapter Eight: Advancing the President’s Unity Agenda 73
Beating The Opioid Epidemic 73 Investing In Mental Health 74
Protecting Kids Online, Strengthening Americans’ Data Privacy, & Promoting Competition 74
Ending Cancer As We Know It 76
Meeting Our Nation’s Sacred Obligation To Veterans And Military Families 77
Chapter Nine: Strengthening American Leadership Worldwide 79
Europe 79 Indo-Pacific 81 China 82 The Middle East & North Africa 84 Western Hemisphere 87 Africa 88 Strengthening The U.S. And Global Economy 89 Leading With Diplomacy And American Values 90
Strongest Military In The World 92

Here you go. It's called the party platform. Republicans have one too.

thanks. some of us may be Ignorant of the platform of various Religions or Political parties. what is even more interesting than the Blue criminals is the platform for Dark Maga Technocracy that i have been pushing with Orange 2.0; eventually i believe this neo Fascism will sweep the Globe and join with the anti-Christ religion by force.

2 weeks.

.

 

[stevecanuck]

Why would someone need instruction about what Shia 12ers believe as opposed to someone who wonders or cares what Copts are? or Animists or Confucianists are?Would you be instructing them also.

See ya.

 

[BogJeSrbin]

Muhammad was Serbian. Why did you not mention this?

 

[joluoto]

If you actually want to learn about Twelver Shi'ism, here is Let's talk Religion:

 

[stevecanuck]

If you actually want to learn about Twelver Shi'ism, here is Let's talk Religion:

As an aside, there are four aspects of Islamic belief that prove (IMO) that the Qur'an, and by extension the religion of Islam, was 100% the product of Mohamed's mind rather than being divinely revealed:

1. The apparent necessity of hadiths to supplement the Qur'an. Does it make any sense that 'Allah' would use 22 years to create 6,236 verses and STILL need further examples to get his point across? This need also contradicts verse 5:3, which says he has "completed his favor upon you and chosen Islam as your religion".
2. Neither 'Allah' nor Mohamed figured out that a purely orally taught Qur'an would eventually get corrupted and need to be written down to preserve the original message.
3. Neither 'Allah' nor Mohamed figured out that a plan of succession was needed in order to prevent an inevitable power struggle and a potential split.
4. Saving the best for last - the need for imans to 'interpret' the Qur'an. The whole frigging point of revealing the Qur'an to the masses via Mohamed was for 'Allah' to DIRECTLY and CLEARLY tell them EXACTLY what to think and do. Several verses are reminders of this, and reiterate that the Qur'an was made "easy to understand". If a supposedly infallible being who is capable of wishing the universe into existence couldn't figure out how to adequately communicate a few simple points to the critters that he created for the sole purpose of worshipping him, then he's not much of a 'god'.

This all also suggests to me that Mohamed didn't really give a fig what happened after he died. After all, he got the power and the women out of it, so he was satisfied.

 

[stevecanuck]

If you actually want to learn about Twelver Shi'ism, here is Let's talk Religion:

He went into great depth, but he didn't contradict anything in the OP. (BTW, I can tell by the way he pronounces some words that he's not a native Arabic speaker, although he does quite well.)