Zef [W:222:432]

[Removable Mind]

re: Zef [W:222]

To be perfectly honest, I don't think I've ever heard the term ZEF outside of this site. If someone is taking offense to the word, it's definitely a good time to reevaluate your standards. As a currently used medical acronym, it's neutral to politics; it really shouldn't offend people.

It appears to offend only a few people. The acronym is used elsewhere (other forums) and can be found on a few reference sites.

Apparently ZEF is seen by some as being a disrespectful acronym or term...and used to oversimplify or dehumanize the stages of the developing unborn.

Those who object believe that if those of us who use the acronym were to fully type out the various stages (zygote, embryo, fetus) that eventually we will become more aware of these stages of development as actually being a human life, thus become more sensitive to their meanings.

But what these folks fail to understand is: We are completely aware that a conception that has occurred inside female human's body...isn't a shetland pony or a mongoose, but the very early stage of a human life. We do get it. It's not something we use to devalue the meaning or reality of what a zygote, embryo, or fetus is. It's not intended to be an oversimplification of what constitutes a human life.

And most likely there will be comments following my post that will disagree with this post. But the acronym will be continued to be used simply as a abridged way of conversing about the various topics that revolve around abortion.

 

[JayDubya]

re: Zef [W:222]

Nope homicide is the killing of a person and since unborn humans are non persons, killing them is not homicide.

No, homicide is the killing of a human, a Homo sapiens. See that latin root there? I know you can.

I mean look, I realize you hate the kids and want them to die and all, and to do this you have to deny them personhood, but you don't live in a world where your subjective political opinions favoring inequality and needless killing redefine scientific reality so that living organisms of a particular species are not alive or not members of their respective species.

 

[AGENT J]

re: Zef [W:222]

It appears to offend only a few people. The acronym is used elsewhere (other forums) and can be found on a few reference sites.

Apparently ZEF is seen by some as being a disrespectful acronym or term...and used to oversimplify or dehumanize the stages of the developing unborn.

Those who object believe that if those of us who use the acronym were to fully type out the various stages (zygote, embryo, fetus) that eventually we will become more aware of these stages of development as actually being a human life, thus become more sensitive to their meanings.

But what these folks fail to understand is: We are completely aware that a conception that has occurred inside female human's body...isn't a shetland pony or a mongoose, but the very early stage of a human life. We do get it. It's not something we use to devalue the meaning or reality of what a zygote, embryo, or fetus is. It's not intended to be an oversimplification of what constitutes a human life.

And most likely there will be comments following my post that will disagree with this post. But the acronym will be continued to be used simply as a abridged way of conversing about the various topics that revolve around abortion.

the best part about the mentally inept and retarded lie thats its not a medical acronym and its a bigoted slur used to dehumanize is thats illogical and doesnt make sense.

ZEF
Zygote, Embryo, Fetus

last i checked all those terms are HUMAN(Adj) stages we are talking about, a human zygote, a human embryo, a human fetus.

You have to be one severely dishonest and uneducated person on this topic to ever convince yourself thats its used solely to dehumanize, i mean thats beyond dishonest. That type of failed logic is done right imbecilic and delusional. Nobody honest falls for it its pure entertainment.

 

[JayDubya]

re: Zef [W:222]

I don't really understand the "aggressive." Seems redundant. But it is the premeditated extinguishing of a human life, and many believe that this is de jure homicide.

"Hitman" is a powerful indictment and inflammatory. And "abortionist" is such an ugly word. Those who perform this service for PP are contract employees, so maybe we should all use this term. And consider whether, correctly, these contract employees are contract killers.

Aggression is the initiation of force. The distinction is important because if one kills in self-defense, that is not criminalized and considered a justifiable homicide. Abortion is in the peculiar legal limbo where despite being an aggressive killing and thus not justifiable, it is legal. This is untenable.

Assassin, hit man, and contract killer all describe someone who kills humans for money. There are only small connotative differences; assassins are not always paid and frequently target public or political figures, hit men are usually associated with organized crime. Contract killer is the most general, and thus the most apropos when talking about a doctor who kills for money.

 

[AGENT J]

re: Zef [W:222]

No, homicide is the killing of a human, a Homo sapiens. See that latin root there? I know you can.

I mean look, I realize you hate the kids and want them to die and all, and to do this you have to deny them personhood, but you don't live in a world where your subjective political opinions favoring inequality and needless killing redefine scientific reality so that living organisms of a particular species are not alive or not members of their respective species.

another posted lie destroyed by facts time and times again, please keep this entertainment up

 

[AGENT J]

re: Zef [W:222]

Aggression is the initiation of force. The distinction is important because if one kills in self-defense, that is not criminalized and considered a justifiable homicide. Abortion is in the peculiar legal limbo where despite being an aggressive killing and thus not justifiable, it is legal. This is untenable.

Assassin, hit man, and contract killer all describe someone who kills humans for money. There are only small connotative differences; assassins are not always paid and frequently target public or political figures, hit men are usually associated with organized crime. Contract killer is the most general, and thus the most apropos when talking about a doctor who kills for money.

yep and everything you wrote above is exactly why abortion doctors are factually not hit men. WOrds having meaning, you should learn them some time
the English language, definitions of words and facts destroy your posted lies once again.

Thanks for posting and continuing your failed post streak, Oh yeah and as always if you disagree please post any facts that support the failed proven wrong lies you posted. Any . . . hell even one, one fact that supports your posted lies

 

[JayDubya]

re: Zef [W:222]

You may wish to note I don't speak to those who go out of their way to not speak English or any other human language, choosing instead to flood my screen with incomprehensible strings of characters, deliberate spelling and grammar errors, extreme and deliberate logic errors, simple contradiction, and just flat out derptastic namecalling. I couldn't speak to them because I wouldn't bother looking to see what they had to say. Obviously some people just like making me click Notifications and then hit back. They must get a kick out of that second of inconvenience.

 

[AGENT J]

re: Zef [W:222]

You may wish to note I don't speak to those who go out of their way to not speak English or any other human language, choosing instead to flood my screen with incomprehensible strings of characters, deliberate spelling and grammar errors, extreme and deliberate logic errors, simple contradiction, and just flat out derptastic namecalling. I couldn't speak to them because I wouldn't bother looking to see what they had to say. Obviously some people just like making me click Notifications and then hit back. They must get a kick out of that second of inconvenience.

you may note, the lies you post are still getting destroyed by facts and the educated and honest are laughing at those lies and having fun exposing them

lets go over the facts again that can be proved unlike the lies you posted

facts still remain its a medical acronym and links provided proof of that fact

Facts
is it an acronym? yep
is it a acronym for three medical words? yep
is it a medical acronym? yep
is it used only by pro-choice people? nope

these are all facts you can do nothing about and its hilarious how angry its makes some people
Zygote Embryo Fetus - What does ZEF stand for? Acronyms and abbreviations by the Free Online Dictionary.
What does ZEF stand for?

i love when people argue against facts and they think anybody is fooled

let us know when you have one fact to support the lies you posted, just one . . . .thats all we need . . . one . . . you got one yet . . .

when you are ready to be civil stay on topic and try to defend your lies please feel free we'd love to see it, show integrity and use fact to defend your false claims


and the best part is, you claim not to read but then you give your opinion of what the posts are? how do you know if you dont read them? WOW you just proved you posted another lie. Next times why don tyou just qoute me and then say you dont actually read it. HUGE fail.
yep your post loses to facts again

 

[GEIxBattleRifle]

re: Zef [W:222]

1. No, homicide is the killing of a human, a Homo sapiens. See that latin root there? I know you can.

2. I mean look, I realize you hate the kids and want them to die and all, and to do this you have to deny them personhood, but you don't live in a world where your subjective political opinions favoring inequality and needless killing redefine scientific reality so that living organisms of a particular species are not alive or not members of their respective species.

1. No, homicide is the killing of a human, a Homo sapiens. See that latin root there? I know you can.

2. I mean look, I realize you hate the kids and want them to die and all, and to do this you have to deny them personhood, but you don't live in a world where your subjective political opinions favoring inequality and needless killing redefine scientific reality so that living organisms of a particular species are not alive or not members of their respective species.

1. No homicide is the killing of a person and I think we would agree if a bunch of non human intelligent extraterrestrial life forms were to show up on your front lawn and I came by and pulled out my shotgun and kill them most would say I committed homicide which is the killing of a person not a human. Though a human can be a person depending on someone's definition.

homicide - definition of homicide by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

2. I don't deny the species the unborn belong to at all. We disagree on when something should have rights like the right to life which my take on it is completely different then yours and as for inequality there is no need for something as dumb as a mosquito to be allowed to eat away at the insides of a rational entity for free. We don't grant this right to hook/tape worms and unborn humans as well currently.

Don't worry though I agree that the unborn need rights like the right to die and the right to remain silent

 

[JayDubya]

re: Zef [W:222]

Gee, it's like we never talked about crowdsourced dictionaries OR Latin roots and what those mean. Oh yes, wait, we did.

According to good ol' Webster, however, "a killing of one human being by another."

1. No homicide is the killing of a person

So when a slave was killed in 1850, that wasn't a homicide according to you. Got it.

Except for the fact that you're entirely wrong, that it objectively was homicide, even if that act wasn't prosecuted as murder.

and I think we would agree if a bunch of non human intelligent extraterrestrial life forms were to show up on your front lawn and I came by and pulled out my shotgun and kill them most would say I committed homicide which is the killing of a person not a human. Though a human can be a person depending on someone's definition.

Absolutely not. If we had Vulcans or something running around, as sapient beings they would have the right to life, liberty, and property and they should not be aggressed against, and we should have laws to that effect to protect their rights.

If someone were to murder a sapient alien, however, you would NOT call that crime homicide. You could not logically. No human was killed.


Also, on-topic:



Ah, those beats were so zef, you know, like those South African populations known for driving Ford Zephyrs. It's such a commonly used thing, that "zef," given the eight whole pages of Google listings, none of which remotely mentions the word "zygote." :roll:

 

[AGENT J]

re: Zef [W:222]

Gee, it's like we never talked about crowdsourced dictionaries OR Latin roots and what those mean. Oh yes, wait, we did.

According to good ol' Webster, however, "a killing of one human being by another."



So when a slave was killed in 1850, that wasn't a homicide according to you. Got it.

Except for the fact that you're entirely wrong, that it objectively was homicide, even if that act wasn't prosecuted as murder.


Absolutely not. If we had Vulcans or something running around, as sapient beings they would have the right to life, liberty, and property and they should not be aggressed against, and we should have laws to that effect to protect their rights.

If someone were to murder a sapient alien, however, you would NOT call that crime homicide. You could not logically. No human was killed.

another posted lie
abortion isn't killing
abortion isn't homicide

until you can change these facts every time you continue to post the above lies and misinformation people will just mock them and expose them
Facts defeat your posts again

 

[GEIxBattleRifle]

re: Zef [W:222]

1.So when a slave was killed in 1850, that wasn't a homicide according to you. Got it.


2. If we had Vulcans or something running around, as sapient beings they would have the right to life, liberty, and property and they should not be aggressed against, and we should have laws to that effect to protect their rights.

3. If someone were to murder a sapient alien, however, you would NOT call that crime homicide. You could not logically. No human was killed.

1. And your average slave back then had mental capabilities far more greater then your average ordinary animal while killing the unborn human who's mental capabilities are like that of a mosquito will be overlooked while the slaves obviously weren't. And since the slaves back then fit my definition of person I would've deemed it homicide but has nothing to do with the species they belong to

2. Sapience is the ability of an organism or entity to act with appropriate judgement and a unborn human lacks the mental capabilities for that until some time after birth not while sitting in the womb doing activities like that of a tapeworm. We give no entity rather it be human or not the right to eat away at the insides of our bodies for free

3. Actually yeah it would be homicide I gave you the link to it look at the first two defintions

 

[JayDubya]

re: Zef [W:222]

1. And your average slave back then had mental capabilities far more greater then your average ordinary animal while killing the unborn human who's mental capabilities are like that of a mosquito will be overlooked while the slaves obviously weren't

The only reason killing a slave wouldn't be "overlooked" would be if you killed someone else's slave.

Destroying someone else's property is frowned upon.

2. Sapience is the ability of an organism or entity to act with appropriate judgement and a unborn human lacks the mental capabilities for that until some timeafter birth not while sitting in the womb doing activities like that of a tapeworm. We give no entity rather it be human or not the right to eat away at the insides of our bodies for free

Right. You're the guy that thinks infanticide should also be legal.

3. Actually yeah it would be homicide I gave you the link to it look at the first two defintions

Actually, no, sapient non-human aliens wouldn't be humans. I would think you could understand that non-humans aren't humans. And if they're not humans, their death isn't a homicide. Sorry, words mean things.

 

[Removable Mind]

re: Zef [W:222]

the best part about the mentally inept and retarded lie thats its not a medical acronym and its a bigoted slur used to dehumanize is thats illogical and doesnt make sense.

ZEF
Zygote, Embryo, Fetus

last i checked all those terms are HUMAN(Adj) stages we are talking about, a human zygote, a human embryo, a human fetus.

You have to be one severely dishonest and uneducated person on this topic to ever convince yourself thats its used solely to dehumanize, i mean thats beyond dishonest. That type of failed logic is done right imbecilic and delusional. Nobody honest falls for it its pure entertainment.

Thanks, OJ...I agree with your comments. We, who use ZEF... do not use the acronym "ZEF" out of malintent or to reduce the value of the unborn.

OJ...I do want to add the following:

FOR JUST ME, OJ...the thing that the ZEF acronym argument comes closest to resemble...in my mind...is the term "boots on the ground"...in relationship to sending our troop to fight in some foreign war...in terms of the possible emotional responses.

The term "boots on the ground" sets my hair on fire...literally pisses me off, it offends me personally because when our troop are placed in harms way...it's not "boots" that die in combat, but rather a human being.

I am assuming that when people use ZEF...those who are against its use...have the same reaction that I have to "boots on the ground". I get the emotional response, but not the reason for it. By the same token, some people don't get the reason for my emotional response over "boots on the ground".

HOWEVER...there is a vast difference between zygotes, embryos, and fetuses (or ZEF) and BORN PERSONS who find themselves in a combat situation.

What we factually know about ZEFs (zygotes, embryos, and fetuses) is:

The period in which over 85% of abortions occur, the embryo/fetus is not developed enough to be self-aware, aware of its environment, dream about the future, feel pain, or possess any form of development that would allow us to consider these stages to be "a person".

Another major difference is that a single born person can impact the lives of many other born persons in good or bad ways. We, society, can experience the impact of other peoples behaviors, their contributions, and even their acts of violence toward other born persons. The unborn simply can't do that. And it is impossible to predict what impact an unborn "might or might not have" on the born.

Are these stages human life? OF COURSE.

Do these stages "have the potential" to become a born person? MAYBE, but no way to know for sure. A woman's body will often reject zygotes and embryos. There's no way to predict which zygote or embryo will be sustained or rejected. In essence, there is nothing viable about these stages.

During the course of legal deliberations in which various states have attempted to legislate personhood for all stages of the unborn is that it is 100% impossible to allow personhood to be applied to zygotes, embryos and fetuses without invoking a lot of very serious, negative, unintended social consequences. And just as importantly, the unborn can't exist with 100% equal rights as the woman who has co-conceived it without putting her life and her rights as a BORN person at serious risk.

The bottom line: Those who use the acronym ZEF...completely understand the human life elements associated with it. ZEF isn't used to demean, devalue, or reduce the significance of what a zygote, embryo, or fetus is. The acronym is used as an abridged method of conducting exchanges of debate or dialog...nothing more or less.

 

[Brooks]

re: Zef [W:222]

Agreed it is an acronym used to described 3 of the main development stages of an unborn.

But on another thread I believe AJ said it was a medical term.

 

[Brooks]

re: Zef [W:222]

...not one fact that negates ZEF from being used as a medical acronym because that fact remain thats what it is. Its an acronym made up of medical terms. Facts
is it an acronym? yep
is it a acronym for three medial words? yep
is it a medical acronym? yep

Medical Terms:
Arthritis, gingivitis, endomitriosis, neuroblastoma, tachycardia, jaundice.

So now "Agent J" is a medical acronym because I've taken it upon myself to mash medical words together.
What a bunch of cerebellum, rickets, angioplasty, pneumonia.

 

[Brooks]

re: Zef [W:222]

To be perfectly honest, I don't think I've ever heard the term ZEF outside of this site. If someone is taking offense to the word, it's definitely a good time to reevaluate your standards. As a currently used medical acronym, it's neutral to politics; it really shouldn't offend people.

It's not that it's offensive, it's just weak.

It's probably not really a medical acronym and it probably is agenda driven, not neutral.
If you read the OP it has no place in legal matters, abortion law or in the opinion of people whose abortion opinion is based on viability.

 

[Brooks]

re: Zef [W:222]

except on the links already provided that call it a medical acronym, i could do this forever i love when you argue against facts

Could you paste that information or give a link to a medical source that calls it a "medical acronym".

 

[AGENT J]

re: Zef [W:222]

Medical Terms:
Arthritis, gingivitis, endomitriosis, neuroblastoma, tachycardia, jaundice.

So now "Agent J" is a medical acronym because I've taken it upon myself to mash medical words together.
What a bunch of cerebellum, rickets, angioplasty, pneumonia.

there you go dishonestly quoting only part of what i said

and yet the facts still remain its a medical acronym and links provided proof that fact, but please continue the desperation its funny and cracking me up

Facts
is it an acronym? yep
is it a acronym for three medial words? yep
is it a medical acronym? yep
is it used only by pro-choice people? nope

these are all facts you can do nothing about and its hilarious how angry its makes some people


Zygote Embryo Fetus - What does ZEF stand for? Acronyms and abbreviations by the Free Online Dictionary.
What does ZEF stand for?

 

[AGENT J]

re: Zef [W:222]

Could you paste that information or give a link to a medical source that calls it a "medical acronym".

already done about 10 times

 

[Brooks]

re: Zef [W:222]

Could you paste that information or give a link to a medical source that calls it a "medical acronym".

I get kind of suspicious when your source asks any reader to "submit new definition."

 

[Brooks]

re: Zef [W:222]

ZEF may not be in the medical dictionaries that were mentioned because ZEF is not a word. As mentioned over and over, it is an acronym.
/QUOTE]
Acronyms ARE in medical dictionaries.

 

[JayDubya]

re: Zef [W:222]

I get kind of suspicious when your source asks any reader to "submit new definition."

Crowdsourcing - ain't it grand?

 

[year2late]

re: Zef [W:222]

I said this on another thread. I initially assumed that ZEF was a prolife word. A word meaning to connect the zygote and associate it with a fetus.

It never really struck me as a malicious word. Just one to show the gestational process .


I think on an internet bulletin board, acronyms are pretty common. I will consider myself blessed that we have not gone to emoticons on this one.

I am not sure in the context of abortion discussions why some perceive this one as so bad. Like I said...initially I thought this was a prolife acronym - to make sure we commect the zygote to the fetus. But I guess I was wrong.:lol:

 

[Brooks]

re: Zef [W:222]

On Medicine.net ZEF yields the following result:

We're Sorry.
We may still have what you are looking for - try the following tips:
Ensure words are spelled correctly.
Try rephrasing keywords or using synonyms.
Try less specific keywords.
Visit one of the A-Z lists, like Diseases & Conditions.

It's just not a medical term.