Young Iraqis Overwhelmingly Consider US Their Enemy Poll Says

[Beaudreaux]

At one point you say/seem to be implying that they feel this way because of some propaganda that is lies (not the truth) but then you say you understand why they feel this way because of a power vacuum.

But you also say that its ISIS thats killing them and not the US. This is true, but its also ignoring the recent history that many of these respondents grew up in, that of being invaded and bombed by the US not once but twice, a US enforced sanctions on the country that killed anywhere from 300,000-500,000 children, and an occupation of their country which killed up to 200,000 civilians and also which ISIS grew out of. Im sure that this all has to deal with why Iraqis distrust America so much...

It's sad that they had to be born into such an area of the world where ward, death, and religious extremism has created such a violent and dangerous environment that no child should be required to live within.

It is also sad that they blame the US for a culture of death and ignorance that has existed since the 7th century.

Yes, we were seen by some kids during the time we were there as the bad guys, yet we were seen as good guys by others. Time doesn't heal all wounds, as the old saying claims it does, however, it does heal most wounds as seen by many countries around the world where we are now close allies and friends that were once mortal enemies of the US in a heated and deadly war.

 

[coldjoint]

Holding a country as a geopolitical enemy does not mean citizens of said country equate to citizens engaging in hostile action

Considering hostile action is what they do.....

 

[TheDemSocialist]

Which Muslims don't hate us is the question?

About time religion gets brought up in this!

But since scary Moooslims get brought up in a asinine manner as a question... Lets check the article, because it seems your question can be found there.
"In Gulf Arab states, on the other hand, perceptions of the United States were far more positive. Roughly 85 percent of those living in the Gulf say that they consider the U.S. to be an ally, with another 66 percent expressing the same view in North Africa."

 

[Tigerace117]

Its a little naive to play off these findings as youths just being stupid.

If there's one similarity between large groups of young people no matter what the generation, it's that they have no real understanding of what life before them was like, don't much care and don't see the forest for the trees.

Plus, I don't known what else to call the "go ISIS" cheerleaders

 

[Tigerace117]

About time religion gets brought up in this!

But since scary Moooslims get brought up in a asinine manner as a question... Lets check the article, because it seems your question can be found there.
"In Gulf Arab states, on the other hand, perceptions of the United States were far more positive. Roughly 85 percent of those living in the Gulf say that they consider the U.S. to be an ally, with another 66 percent expressing the same view in North Africa."

Glen Greenwald.....

https://www.nsfwcorp.com/dispatch/war-nerd-vs-greenwald/

Interesting article. I wouldn't be too quick to take his word as gospel

 

[TheDemSocialist]

Considering hostile action is what they do.....

Yes.. So your point being?

 

[coldjoint]

Which Muslims don't hate us is the question?

Something their religion will never let us know. It states plainly infidels can be lied to for Islams advance.

 

[coldjoint]

Yes.. So your point being?

There is no reason to take that chance. Giving away what we have is not the way to save the world. And importing even potential enemies is stupid.

We should detach from Islamic countries. Stop all aid, especially technical. Charge outrageous prices for food and end charity to those countries. Let them build their own clean water facilities and power stations and other infrastructure.. And feed their people.

If that happened, Islam would collapse on its own.

 

[Tigerace117]

There is no reason to take that chance. Giving away what we have is not the way to save the world. And importing even potential enemies is stupid.

We should detach from Islamic countries. Stop all aid, especially technical. Charge outrageous prices for food and end charity to those countries. Let them build their own clean water facilities and power stations and other infrastructure.. And feed their people.

If that happened, Islam would collapse on its own.

Or, you know, become even more radicalized. Look at what happened to Germany

 

[coldjoint]

Or, you know, become even more radicalized. Look at what happened to Germany

This is not Germany, and if they become more radical in their own countries, that would be their problem.

 

[TheDemSocialist]

If there's one similarity between large groups of young people no matter what the generation, it's that they have no real understanding of what life before them was like, don't much care and don't see the forest for the trees.

Again I think its incredibly naive to dismiss this as just "youths are stupid".
It follows a larger trend that stretches across time and age groups.
Example(s):

-"According to results of the survey by Zogby Research Services Iraqis, overall, feel that their country is “worse off” because of the U.S.-led war there"
POLL: Iraqis Say They're Worse Off After War, View Iran Unfavorably | ThinkProgress

-" 71 percent of Iraqis questioned want the Iraqi government to ask foreign forces to depart within a year."
Most Iraqis Favor Immediate U.S. Pullout, Polls Show

-"

"
https://books.google.com/books?id=u...MAhUDmoMKHW8IDgcQ6AEIMDAE#v=onepage&q&f=false

-"61 percent of Iraqis said the U.S. troop presence was making security worse, compared to only 27 percent who said better. The same survey found that 70 percent of Iraqis believe the U.S. and other “coalition” forces had done “quite a bad job” or “a very bad job” in carrying out their responsibilities in Iraq." As Usual, NYT Ignores Iraqi Opinion ? FAIR

-" In 2006, PIPA estimated that 79 percent of Iraqis say that the US is having a negative influence on the overall situation in Iraq"
https://www.globalpolicy.org/component/content/article/168/37143.html

-"The BBC/ABC/NHK survey, conducted in all 19 provinces during August, finds that 70% of Iraqis believe that security has deteriorated in the areas covered by the US "surge", and 11% say it has had no effect. Only 11% say that security in the country as a whole has improved in the last six months. And 70% say that the conditions for political dialogue have gotten worse in the last six months. Bottom line: Iraqis overall, and especially Sunnis, are more opposed to the American presence than ever, do not think the surge has accomplished either its military or its political goals, and have dwindling confidence in the US forces. Has Petraeus's counter-insurgency strategy and the surge won respect for the American presence? No. Only 15% express confidence in US/UK occupation forces, down from 18% in February, with 58% expressing "no confidence at all" - the highest in any of these surveys dating back to 2003. 80% say that the US has done a bad job in Iraq. 79% oppose the presence of Coalition forces in Iraq. 72% say that the presence of US forces is making security worse."
https://www.globalpolicy.org/component/content/article/168/37193.html

-"

"
https://www.globalpolicy.org/images/pdfs/06iiacss.pdf

-" The survey found that 61 percent of the Iraqi returnees interviewed regretted returning to Iraq from their country of asylum with 60 percent of this number stating that this was mainly due to insecurity. 87 percent also stated that their current income is insufficient to cover their families' needs in Iraq."
http://reliefweb.int/sites/reliefwe...BBC66D2776040C12577F3003DE5B0-Full_report.pdf

-"

"
https://www.globalpolicy.org/images/pdfs/09bbciraqipoll.pdf

Plus, I don't known what else to call the "go ISIS" cheerleaders

"Go ISIS cheerleaders"? Uh what?

"The poll also asked participants to weigh in on a variety of other issues, including the rise of Islamic State, sectarianism, and women’s rights. Participants overwhelmingly rejected ISIS, predicting that it would fail in its goal of remaking the region and would be insupportable even if it didn’t resort to extreme violence"

 

[Tigerace117]

This is not Germany, and if they become more radical in their own countries, that would be their problem.

Until they head overseas to attack us. In droves. Your scenario would take the paranoid fantasies of some and make them a reality

 

[Tigerace117]

Again I think its incredibly naive to dismiss this as just "youths are stupid".
It follows a larger trend that stretches across time and age groups.
Example(s):

-"According to results of the survey by Zogby Research Services Iraqis, overall, feel that their country is “worse off” because of the U.S.-led war there"
POLL: Iraqis Say They're Worse Off After War, View Iran Unfavorably | ThinkProgress

-" 71 percent of Iraqis questioned want the Iraqi government to ask foreign forces to depart within a year."
Most Iraqis Favor Immediate U.S. Pullout, Polls Show

-"

"
https://books.google.com/books?id=u...MAhUDmoMKHW8IDgcQ6AEIMDAE#v=onepage&q&f=false

-"61 percent of Iraqis said the U.S. troop presence was making security worse, compared to only 27 percent who said better. The same survey found that 70 percent of Iraqis believe the U.S. and other “coalition” forces had done “quite a bad job” or “a very bad job” in carrying out their responsibilities in Iraq." As Usual, NYT Ignores Iraqi Opinion ? FAIR

-" In 2006, PIPA estimated that 79 percent of Iraqis say that the US is having a negative influence on the overall situation in Iraq"
https://www.globalpolicy.org/component/content/article/168/37143.html

-"The BBC/ABC/NHK survey, conducted in all 19 provinces during August, finds that 70% of Iraqis believe that security has deteriorated in the areas covered by the US "surge", and 11% say it has had no effect. Only 11% say that security in the country as a whole has improved in the last six months. And 70% say that the conditions for political dialogue have gotten worse in the last six months. Bottom line: Iraqis overall, and especially Sunnis, are more opposed to the American presence than ever, do not think the surge has accomplished either its military or its political goals, and have dwindling confidence in the US forces. Has Petraeus's counter-insurgency strategy and the surge won respect for the American presence? No. Only 15% express confidence in US/UK occupation forces, down from 18% in February, with 58% expressing "no confidence at all" - the highest in any of these surveys dating back to 2003. 80% say that the US has done a bad job in Iraq. 79% oppose the presence of Coalition forces in Iraq. 72% say that the presence of US forces is making security worse."
https://www.globalpolicy.org/component/content/article/168/37193.html

-"

"
https://www.globalpolicy.org/images/pdfs/06iiacss.pdf

-" The survey found that 61 percent of the Iraqi returnees interviewed regretted returning to Iraq from their country of asylum with 60 percent of this number stating that this was mainly due to insecurity. 87 percent also stated that their current income is insufficient to cover their families' needs in Iraq."
http://reliefweb.int/sites/reliefwe...BBC66D2776040C12577F3003DE5B0-Full_report.pdf

-"

"
https://www.globalpolicy.org/images/pdfs/09bbciraqipoll.pdf


"Go ISIS cheerleaders"? Uh what?

"The poll also asked participants to weigh in on a variety of other issues, including the rise of Islamic State, sectarianism, and women’s rights. Participants overwhelmingly rejected ISIS, predicting that it would fail in its goal of remaking the region and would be insupportable even if it didn’t resort to extreme violence"

The people who ignore ISIS and consider the United States their enemy. And suprise, suprise they view Iran unfavorably---the two countries have never gotten along. Ever.

Not to mention the fact that polls are, at best, a semi-reliable tool for figuring out what people really feel vs what they think the interviewer wants to hear or what their friends will think of them if they say a certain thing.

 

[Carjosse]

Since explaining the numerous ways that the statement above is lacking in depth and intelligence would further derail this thread, I will simply remove myself from this part of the conversation with this one last statement: Study history before making such statements.

I do and have, the American revolution was caused by the colonists feeling that that were being unfairly taxed and lacked representation in English parliament. Those were the primary reasons for the revolution, and I believe they were stupid reasons.

 

[coldjoint]

Until they head overseas to attack us. In droves. Your scenario would take the paranoid fantasies of some and make them a reality

.
A land invasion of the US would be impossible, even with our weakened military. And why would they invade us? We would be gone. I guess you are trying to say that Islam intends to destroy us no matter what we do.

 

[coldjoint]

I do and have, the American revolution was caused by the colonists feeling that that were being unfairly taxed and lacked representation in English parliament. Those were the primary reasons for the revolution, and I believe they were stupid reasons.

Not having a voice in the way you are governed is stupid.

 

[Carjosse]

Not having a voice in the way you are governed is stupid.

The colonies did have a limited voice, the same voice you currently give the people of the territories and DC today. They could have also solved the problem diplomatically like Upper Canada later did.

 

[coldjoint]

The colonies did have a limited voice, the same voice you currently give the people of the territories and DC today. They could have also solved the problem diplomatically like Upper Canada later did.

"Limited" is not what the colonists wanted.

 

[Tigerace117]

.
A land invasion of the US would be impossible, even with our weakened military. And why would they invade us? We would be gone. I guess you are trying to say that Islam intends to destroy us no matter what we do.

What I am saying is taking a problem and doing everything in your power to ensure that the problem won't go away and indeed increases in magnitude is dumb.

The United States is no island, and our land borders are far from secure.

 

[SocialD]

No...they occupied, terrorized, confined, and bombed the colonies after we started revolting.

Japan sorta like us too.......and we kinda blew the crap outta them, then occupied them for a number of years.

We get along just fine with Germany and Italy too. the middle eastern opinion is how they are raised. youth are raised to have that opinion. and this of course is from edicts by their leadership.. I mean the religious leadership as we all know that even if they have a secular government the religious leaders call the shots.

 

[RetiredUSN]

We get along just fine with Germany and Italy too. the middle eastern opinion is how they are raised. youth are raised to have that opinion. and this of course is from edicts by their leadership.. I mean the religious leadership as we all know that even if they have a secular government the religious leaders call the shots.

Societies can change on a dime for good or bad. Changing a theology is much different than changing governments.

 

[German guy]

I'm glad the bombing and invading had a different effect on the opinions of my fellow Germans... to the most part. Guess that's because the post-war reconstruction went much better here.

Want to use the occasion to thank the Americans who had grandparents involved in this invading! (No, I'm not joking, I'm being serious.)

 

[RetiredUSN]

The colonies did have a limited voice, the same voice you currently give the people of the territories and DC today. They could have also solved the problem diplomatically like Upper Canada later did.

Are you saying that England would just let the colonies separate by playing nice? The same England who occupied private houses, jailed innocent people, and suppressed free speech? The same England who "effed" up many other parts of the world with slavery and exploitation?

 

[JC Callender]

Read more @: Young Iraqis Overwhelmingly Consider US Their Enemy Poll Says

The eruption of joy that never came... Apparently if your country is bombed, invaded and occupied those being bombed and occupied dont like the country doing the bombing and occupying. [/FONT][/COLOR]

Aww :boohoo:

 

[Carjosse]

Are you saying that England would just let the colonies separate by playing nice? The same England who occupied private houses, jailed innocent people, and suppressed free speech? The same England who "effed" up many other parts of the world with slavery and exploitation?

You know Canada exists right? We decided to solve our problems diplomatically. The young US also did many of those things. England actually got rid of slavery before the US.