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You can be prolife and pro choice at the same time!

americanwoman

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I am against abortion morally cause it just seems wrong but I am for women having their own choice. This doesn't make sense to alot of people but it can happen. I will not judge a woman who gets one because she will do it if it's illegal or not. It's alot safer for her to do it legally though. So I beleive that just because I am against abortion personally I think a woman has the right to make her own choice. Argue that!
 

aps

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americanwoman said:
I am against abortion morally cause it just seems wrong but I am for women having their own choice. This doesn't make sense to alot of people but it can happen. I will not judge a woman who gets one because she will do it if it's illegal or not. It's alot safer for her to do it legally though. So I beleive that just because I am against abortion personally I think a woman has the right to make her own choice. Argue that!
americanwoman, I totally agree! I have never had one, nor would I ever want to have one, but I support a woman's right to choose what's right for herself. Do people really say that your position doesn't make sense? I say it does, and that's all that matters. ;)
 

americanwoman

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aps said:
americanwoman, I totally agree! I have never had one, nor would I ever want to have one, but I support a woman's right to choose what's right for herself. Do people really say that your position doesn't make sense? I say it does, and that's all that matters. ;)

yes aps I agree thats all that matters if we say it makes sense.
 

BodiSatva

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To the both of you,

...GROW UP! YOU ARE WRONG!
(Just getting your attention - a Jallman trick) I am joking.

Actually, to you both...I totally agree. I was making this same case in another thread and I was hounded and ridiculed by at least a few. I would never have an abortion given that choice either...and since I am a man, I will never face that choice...wheeew. But a woman should be able to decide what to do with her body...she cannot be forced to be a cargo carrier.
 

ngdawg

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This is the point that we have been trying to make all along, but it doesn't get through to those with self-serving fundie agendas.
I do think it is MORE pro-life to allow someone to live their own lives as they choose and in the best way they can. We all make decisions that are not glorious, we make choices that we have to live with every day. Not all are happy ones, but we do the best we can.
I find it extremely ironic and somewhat sad that the most insane, adamant attacker of pro-choicers is one who has had an abortion. Instead of having self-compassion for her decision, she attacks those who support the right to choose-something that she herself did.
Little story: When my GIFT procedure was found to be successful, my progesterone count, the number that shows if one is expecting, was so high that I was told there are definitely more than one in me. I said in response, ' I am NOT having 5!' and was told that would be discussed when it was time.
I'm grateful that I never had to make such a decision-I was carrying two.
I know women who have aborted, including one of my sisters-twice-and it is an agonizing decision, but they get through it. I would never ever be so presumptuous as to tell someone else what they should and should not do with their own lives. There's the saying, 'there but for the grace of God, go I' and while I am not religious at all, it has merit. Instead of attacking those that find themselves in dire straits, we should empathize, help and hope they can get through their own crises with little or no scars. This is not what I have seen through the words of those here that dare to call themselves 'pro-life'.
 

talloulou

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The way I see it is there are many things I would never do myself and yet it doesn't bother me that other people do those things.

However feticide is not one of those things. It bothers me. If the numbers weren't so high and it wasn't done so commonly or so often perhaps it wouldn't bother me.
 

alphamale

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americanwoman said:
I am against abortion morally cause it just seems wrong but I am for women having their own choice. This doesn't make sense to alot of people but it can happen. I will not judge a woman who gets one because she will do it if it's illegal or not. It's alot safer for her to do it legally though. So I beleive that just because I am against abortion personally I think a woman has the right to make her own choice. Argue that!
"I am against murder morally cause it just seems wrong but I am for would-be killers having their own choice. This doesn't make sense to alot of people but it can happen. I will not judge a person who kills because he will do it if it's illegal or not. It's alot safer for him to do it legally though. So I beleive that just because I am against murder personally I think a person has the right to make his own choice."

Your ideas are idiotic - any intellectually respectable moral system must be universal, i.e., it applies to everyone. And the basis of all law is to prevent acts that the majority thinks is wrong. To say that you think something is immoral, but it's OK if others do it is self-contradictory, and shows that probably mostly what you've absorbed by the abortion debate is feminazi slogans.
 

vergiss

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Look, alphamale! A woman! How about you try and get laid? :lol: Whilst we're using analogies that are irrelevent to abortion, I think adultery is immoral, but I don't give a rat's arse if a couple want to be swingers.

On the flipside, I'm pro-choice, but not once the foetus reaches second trimester (except in cases of severe genetic handicap or risk to the mother). So I'm certainly pro-life for the majority of the pregnancy.
 

aps

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alphamale said:
Your ideas are idiotic - any intellectually respectable moral system must be universal, i.e., it applies to everyone. And the basis of all law is to prevent acts that the majority thinks is wrong. To say that you think something is immoral, but it's OK if others do it is self-contradictory, and shows that probably mostly what you've absorbed by the abortion debate is feminazi slogans.
I don't give much value to men's opinions on abortion. Sorry, but you will NEVER have an idea of what it's like to be a woman with an unwanted pregnancy. So your opinion of what americanwoman and I think means absolutely nothing to me. Call me whatever you want.
 

ptsdkid

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americanwoman said:
I am against abortion morally cause it just seems wrong but I am for women having their own choice. This doesn't make sense to alot of people but it can happen. I will not judge a woman who gets one because she will do it if it's illegal or not. It's alot safer for her to do it legally though. So I beleive that just because I am against abortion personally I think a woman has the right to make her own choice. Argue that!

***Sounds to me like you grew up as an outstanding conservative woman, but was hoodwinked into accepting the liberal version of murder as being a fundamental right to choose death over life. You should be kicking yourself for attending that one feminist pro-abortion rally back when you were so young and ill-informed. There is still hope. A movement called born again Christians is making a much needed and timely comeback. My prayers are with you, sister.
 

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Ladies, I'm with you. I am pro choice, but I myself (if the choice were mine)would choose life everytime.

Those people who don't understand your logic probably just aren't capabable of non-linear thinking. They were the kids in math class who couldn't understand why 4 - 2 x 2 didn't equal 4. They just get caught in the straight line.
 

BodiSatva

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I think you meant Ladies and Bodi... ;)




alphamale -
"Your ideas are idiotic - any intellectually respectable moral system must be universal"
A nonintellectual opinion is the idea that any intellectually respectable moral system must be universal.

And talloulou...I don't think that any person said that abortion did not bother them, it is just that they support the woman's right to choose. I know that personally, abortion at any point bothers me...but their are many variables to take into account and I do not think that we have the right dictate policy regarding a woman or their cargo...
 

americanwoman

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ptsdkid said:
***Sounds to me like you grew up as an outstanding conservative woman, but was hoodwinked into accepting the liberal version of murder as being a fundamental right to choose death over life. You should be kicking yourself for attending that one feminist pro-abortion rally back when you were so young and ill-informed. There is still hope. A movement called born again Christians is making a much needed and timely comeback. My prayers are with you, sister.

Sorry to kill your analysis but my parents are actually democrats with my mom being very liberal, who fully supports pro choice. That's how I was brought up. I have never been to a feminist pro -abortion rally and I would never go to one in my life or to a pro life rally.
As was stated before me by a lovely woman I can not take a man's opinion on what a woman can do with her body.
 

Kelzie

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I second you ladies' (and Bodi's ;) ) opinion. It's not for me, but others should be able to have one.
 

BodiSatva

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Kelzie - "I second you ladies' (and Bodi's ) opinion." haha...YEAH!

American Woman -

You may choose to not listen to a man...but that does not mean that men can't have a valid opinion. Some men are more intuitive and understand the issue than others. Don't dismiss all men just because we are men.

I listen to non-parents opinions and take them into account when they sound as if they are relevant...But I do understand you...as a parent that almost had a child die, it is hard to find any parent that can truly appreciate and understand our issues, thus it is difficult to listen to their opinions...
 

americanwoman

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BodiSatva said:
Kelzie - "I second you ladies' (and Bodi's ) opinion." haha...YEAH!

American Woman -

You may choose to not listen to a man...but that does not mean that men can't have a valid opinion. Some men are more intuitive and understand the issue than others. Don't dismiss all men just because we are men.

I listen to non-parents opinions and take them into account when they sound as if they are relevant...But I do understand you...as a parent that almost had a child die, it is hard to find any parent that can truly appreciate and understand our issues, thus it is difficult to listen to their opinions...

ok I retract my statement and say I do respect an intelligent man's opinion.

However, I would not follow any advice ptsdkid gave me.
 

BodiSatva

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"I do respect an intelligent man's opinion" - This is all I hoped to hear.

"I would not follow any advice ptsdkid gave me." - A wise strategy.
 

ngdawg

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millsy said:
Ladies, I'm with you. I am pro choice, but I myself (if the choice were mine)would choose life everytime.

Those people who don't understand your logic probably just aren't capabable of non-linear thinking. They were the kids in math class who couldn't understand why 4 - 2 x 2 didn't equal 4. They just get caught in the straight line.
I almost thought that was wrong:3oops: Failed math.....then remembered those equations from being an aide....guess they were smart putting me mostly in the english classes to assist :)
 

Ivan The Terrible

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Americanwoman,

I can not take a man's opinion on what a woman can do with her body.
So do you think that the unborn child isn't a life?
 

Ivan The Terrible

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Americanwoman,

I'm still kinda indecided about that whole fetus/baby thing.
I thought so. It's the only way I think you can make the statement of being both for Pro-life and Pro-choice.
 

ngdawg

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Ivan The Terrible said:
Americanwoman,



I thought so. It's the only way I think you can make the statement of being both for Pro-life and Pro-choice.
She didn't say that.
What she and we have ALL said (you might want to reread the whole thread), was, that while we don't necessarily think we would choose abortion, we do not deny the right of others to do so. "Pro-life" is not an accurate moniker as it does NOT consider the life of the woman as it pertains to circumstance and would much prefer to take away any freedom of choice. "Pro-choice" proponents don't agree necessarily on having abortions, but support the right of women to choose.
 

Ivan The Terrible

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ngdawg,

What she and we have ALL said (you might want to reread the whole thread), was, that while we don't necessarily think we would choose abortion, we do not deny the right of others to do so.
Thanks...:roll:

Americanwoman,


Why wouldn't you "deny the right of others to do so" ?
 
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