Yes, Putin is a serious a-hole, but let's take a closer look

[Shrink726]

As outraged as I am about Putin's conduct in the Ukraine matter, I do wonder whether his view that the Ukraine is really a part of Russia is not terribly dissimilar to many hallowed US policies we've tacitly accepted over the past couple of hundred years.
I'm referring to things like the Monroe Doctrine, Manifest Destiny and the philosophical predicate that almost led to nuclear war in the Cuban missile crisis.
Look, I'd like to see Putin meet the same fate as Sadaam Hussain but I'm just trying to be objective here.

 

[lemmiwinx]

Putin misses his old Soviet Union days when he worked as a secret agent KGB man. Cloak and dagger and you know he had a license to kill. He's seen his better days now he hasn't been seen shirtless on horse in years.

 

[Shrink726]

Putin misses his old Soviet Union days when he worked as a secret agent KGB man. Cloak and dagger and you know he had a license to kill. He's seen his better days now he hasn't been seen shirtless on horse in years.

Yes, but are we holding him to a different standard than we've applied to ourselves in such matters?

 

[lemmiwinx]

Yes, but are we holding him to a different standard than we've applied to ourselves in such matters?

Well Putin's a megalomanic dictator worse than any I can think of. You're going to say Trump but Trump never mobilized 150,000 troops on any other country's border with bad intentions.

 

[Craig234]

I just made a post in the other thread similarly suggesting there are issues that deserve to be looked at and we need to ask some hard questions about our own actions as these situation tend to be ruled by power and selfish motives more than justice, but that Putin's warmongering stabs peace in the heart making opposing his aggression challenge the justice of the issues for a response, making such discussions very problematic.

It's like when a customer brings a complaint about the food to the manager; pulling a gun and shooting items and aiming it at the manager precludes the 'fair' discussion of the issue.

 

[jnug]

As outraged as I am about Putin's conduct in the Ukraine matter, I do wonder whether his view that the Ukraine is really a part of Russia is not terribly dissimilar to many hallowed US policies we've tacitly accepted over the past couple of hundred years.
I'm referring to things like the Monroe Doctrine, Manifest Destiny and the philosophical predicate that almost led to nuclear war in the Cuban missile crisis.
Look, I'd like to see Putin meet the same fate as Sadaam Hussain but I'm just trying to be objective here.

The Monroe Doctrine was developed to stop European Imperialism in this hemisphere. It ain't the 18th or 19th centuries any longer. I don't think what Putin is trying in Ukraine and in other parts of the former Soviet Union is the equivalent of what the Monroe Doctrine was designed to do.

Before you go further into this idea, Putin is blaming the Communists for his dilemma. According to Vlad, they never should have created the Soviet Union and its States in the first place. Too bad Vlad. Water over the dam now. You should have complained a long long long time ago. Vlad's previous argument was that the Soviet Union should not have collapsed. Well Vlady, nobody really wants to collapse. If they had a choice they likely would not have. Actually the Soviet Union got what mileage it could out of its framework. It was advantageous to an extent in its time.

So here is Vlad's actual problem. If Ukraine wanted to be subjugated by or incorporated into Russia or a veritable vassal state to Russia they would say so now wouldn't they? They don't want to. Vlad is trying to force them to. There was Russia, then there was the Soviet Union with its States and then the Soviet Union collapsed and States were left to make decisions on their own. Russia was so accepting of the situation that it signed the Budapest Memorandum thus signing up to assuring the borders of Ukraine and Ukraine sovereignty. Compare being a signatory to the Budapest Memorandum to what they are doing and have been doing since 2014 and even before that. Shit happens Vlad. A little late to be complaining now. You are simply a corrupt thief Vlad...a monster. From a geopolitical perspective, a 21st Century Hitler. Wear it Vlad....you deserve it.

 

[jaypatriot]

As outraged as I am about Putin's conduct in the Ukraine matter, I do wonder whether his view that the Ukraine is really a part of Russia is not terribly dissimilar to many hallowed US policies we've tacitly accepted over the past couple of hundred years.
I'm referring to things like the Monroe Doctrine, Manifest Destiny and the philosophical predicate that almost led to nuclear war in the Cuban missile crisis.
Look, I'd like to see Putin meet the same fate as Sadaam Hussain but I'm just trying to be objective here.

I wonder if it is significant that you claim to be a lifelong NYC Liberal and you show a picture of Biden and Harris hugging as if you are proud of their victory.
Now, in this modern age where one person is causing oil prices to go up and stock funds to go down, you are looking "objectively" at the premier terrorist in the world today.
But, on the other hand, you wouldn't feel bad if we took Putin out and hung him like Saddam Hussein.
Covering all of your bases I see.

 

[j brown's body]

As outraged as I am about Putin's conduct in the Ukraine matter, I do wonder whether his view that the Ukraine is really a part of Russia is not terribly dissimilar to many hallowed US policies we've tacitly accepted over the past couple of hundred years.
I'm referring to things like the Monroe Doctrine, Manifest Destiny and the philosophical predicate that almost led to nuclear war in the Cuban missile crisis.
Look, I'd like to see Putin meet the same fate as Sadaam Hussain but I'm just trying to be objective here.

This is pretty much what Trump would say.

 

[j brown's body]

Yes, but are we holding him to a different standard than we've applied to ourselves in such matters?

Putin is attempting to undermine democracy here and in other western countries. He is a threat to all of us.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

Well Putin's a megalomanic dictator worse than any I can think of. You're going to say Trump but Trump never mobilized 150,000 troops on any other country's border with bad intentions.

Nah. That was Dumbya Bush I guess.

 

[Shrink726]

I wonder if it is significant that you claim to be a lifelong NYC Liberal and you show a picture of Biden and Harris hugging as if you are proud of their victory.
Now, in this modern age where one person is causing oil prices to go up and stock funds to go down, you are looking "objectively" at the premier terrorist in the world today.
But, on the other hand, you wouldn't feel bad if we took Putin out and hung him like Saddam Hussein.
Covering all of your bases I see.

Yes, I do consider myself a life-long liberal from NYC. And yes, I'm proud as hell of Biden/Harris, a team that could have accomplished wonderful things for this country absent a purely obstructionist Senate and douches like Manchin and Sinema. And yes, also to trying to look at this in an objective light. Whether I'm "covering all my bases" is purely incidental and of no importance to me.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

As outraged as I am about Putin's conduct in the Ukraine matter, I do wonder whether his view that the Ukraine is really a part of Russia is not terribly dissimilar to many hallowed US policies we've tacitly accepted over the past couple of hundred years.
I'm referring to things like the Monroe Doctrine, Manifest Destiny and the philosophical predicate that almost led to nuclear war in the Cuban missile crisis.
Look, I'd like to see Putin meet the same fate as Sadaam Hussain but I'm just trying to be objective here.

Meh.
Putins never done a damn thing to me or mine.

I cant get too excited at this point. I'm just one guy, I just want to enjoy my life.

 

[WillyPete]

As outraged as I am about Putin's conduct in the Ukraine matter, I do wonder whether his view that the Ukraine is really a part of Russia is not terribly dissimilar to many hallowed US policies we've tacitly accepted over the past couple of hundred years.
I'm referring to things like the Monroe Doctrine, Manifest Destiny and the philosophical predicate that almost led to nuclear war in the Cuban missile crisis.
Look, I'd like to see Putin meet the same fate as Sadaam Hussain but I'm just trying to be objective here.

The short answer is that the rules changed after WWII and with the Cold War, and you don't get to just grab territory and expect to slide on it any more.

Sorry Russia! I know it's a tradition in both our great nations.

 

[jaypatriot]

Yes, I do consider myself a life-long liberal from NYC. And yes, I'm proud as hell of Biden/Harris, a team that could have accomplished wonderful things for this country absent a purely obstructionist Senate and douches like Manchin and Sinema. And yes, also to trying to look at this in an objective light. Whether I'm "covering all my bases" is purely incidental and of no importance to me.

Love your answer. Despite your misguided politics.
I love Manchin and Sinema because they will not cave to Progressive programs that add nothing to improve our country other than giving people more free money when they do not need it. And I spent 18 years growing up in NYC. Now I won't go back to that cesspool.
Of course you need to blame Biden's legislative failures on just two Senators in your own party.! That should tell you something about Biden's presumed mandate for societal change.

 

[j brown's body]

Meh.
Putins never done a damn thing to me or mine.

I cant get too excited at this point. I'm just one guy, I just want to enjoy my life.

He helped give you President Trump.

 

[noonereal]

Putin misses his old Soviet Union days when he worked as a secret agent KGB man. Cloak and dagger and you know he had a license to kill. He's seen his better days now he hasn't been seen shirtless on horse in years.

I am not sure how most ignore NATOs expansion. How is this not a legitimate concern?

 

[j brown's body]

Love your answer. Despite your misguided politics.
I love Manchin and Sinema because they will not cave to Progressive programs that add nothing to improve our country other than giving people more free money when they do not need it. And I spent 18 years growing up in NYC. Now I won't go back to that cesspool.
Of course you need to blame Biden's legislative failures on just two Senators in your own party.! That should tell you something about Biden's presumed mandate for societal change.

Who really needs teeth anyway?

 

[noonereal]

Meh.
Putins never done a damn thing to me or mine.

I cant get too excited at this point. I'm just one guy, I just want to enjoy my life.

A very trumpian post!

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

He helped give you President Trump.

I'll blame that one on a bunch of REALLY big morons right here in the USA.🤡🤡🤡🇺🇸

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

A very trumpian post!

Have you been checked?
Long Haul TDS?

 

[jaypatriot]

Meh.
Putins never done a damn thing to me or mine.

I cant get too excited at this point. I'm just one guy, I just want to enjoy my life.

Good thing you're not trying to enjoy your life in Europe depending on Russian gas to keep you warm in your house.
And you're not worried about a big drop in your 401k or IRA because investors are spooked by Putin's terrorist actions in Eastern Europe. And gas prices at the pump don't bother you at all as a result of higher oil prices caused by Putin.
Keep enjoying your life.

 

[MaryP]

As outraged as I am about Putin's conduct in the Ukraine matter, I do wonder whether his view that the Ukraine is really a part of Russia is not terribly dissimilar to many hallowed US policies we've tacitly accepted over the past couple of hundred years.
I'm referring to things like the Monroe Doctrine, Manifest Destiny and the philosophical predicate that almost led to nuclear war in the Cubang missile crisis.
Look, I'd like to see Putin meet the same fate as Sadaam Hussain but I'm just trying to be objective here.

Alright, we've all heard the poor Vlad reasoning for this, but it doesn't change the fact that he's invading an independent country, trying to dictate to NATO and throwing a whole lot of sand in our faces as he tries to weasel his way into a military occupation while pretending he isn't.

If Ukraine was willing to declare itself neutral and not seek NATO membership, do you honestly think it would make Putin happy? I doubt it. It's an excuse.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

Good thing you're not trying to enjoy your life in Europe depending on Russian gas to keep you warm in your house.
And you're not worried about a big drop in your 401k or IRA because investors are spooked by Putin's terrorist actions in Eastern Europe. And gas prices at the pump don't bother you at all as a result of higher oil prices caused by Putin.
Keep enjoying your life.

OK. As of this point, I'm still OK.

 

[noonereal]

Have you been checked?
Long Haul TDS?

Long term TDS is a healthy response to chronic Trump/deplorable exposure.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

Who really needs teeth anyway?

Teeth are overrated!

FrEeDuMbZ$™ are even better than teeth!